Nordica El Capo question

**slowroastin** · 02-11-2016, 07:24 PM

I'm 6' 195lbs. Ski the east coast. One trip west each year.

I'm looking for a ski that won't beat me up after skiing 6-7 resort days in a row regardless of conditions. And also serve as my east coast pow tree ski.

Just received my 185 El Capo's and they are softer than I anticipated.

Is the 193 essentially the same ski just longer? Or does it stiffen up at all?

**Bandit Man** · 02-11-2016, 08:03 PM

Originally Posted by slowroastin

I'm 6' 195lbs.

Just received my 185 El Capo's and they are softer than I anticipated.

Is the 193 essentially the same ski just longer? Or does it stiffen up at all?

Are you hand flexing them and coming to that conclusion or have you skied them? They really don't ski soft. Pretty stout through the middle of the ski but softer towards tips and tails.

**slowroastin** · 02-11-2016, 08:05 PM

Hand flex, I know this doesn't prove much.

**Bandit Man** · 02-11-2016, 08:17 PM

Originally Posted by slowroastin

Hand flex, I know this doesn't prove much.

FWIW, I was concerned about the same thing before I skied mine. I weigh 200-lbs and like beefy skis.

That being said, the El Capo is really vanilla. It really does not know what it wants to be. Okay on groomers, okay in crud, and okay in pow but not awesome at any of them. The Cochise and Q-Lab are much better skis in that class. I'm not surprised that the El Capo was discontinued after skiing them.

**fat yeti** · 02-12-2016, 08:47 AM

193 is stiffer and measures the same length as the 196 bodacious. It's along the lines of s 194 xxl. I have a buddy who skis them and the 196 bodacious and says they are both a lot of ski.

**roQer** · 02-12-2016, 09:13 AM

Skied the 193 cm El Capo during a demo day. Very weird flex pattern with soft tails. Definitely not in the league of Cochise, Katana, W105 or Supernatural 108. If you like supportive tails you'll probably not get along well with El Capo, even in 193 cm length.

**slowroastin** · 02-12-2016, 11:20 AM

Hand flexed them again with the front of the ski supported by the coffee table. They give a little then seem to hit a wall. Very stiff.

I'm going to stick with the 185's. They will fill the gap between my Mantra's and Governors.

**BushwackerinPA** · 02-12-2016, 09:42 PM

Totally disagree about the Capo being vanilla. its easy going, but it also does not deflect and basically goes where you point it.

I also do not think they will be an awesome EC treeski but are a great all arounder and passable in the woods. . Most people who are heel pushers/ tail gunner hate the soft tails. If you drive the forebody and make round turns that ski just does not deflect ever, and has tons more grip on groomers than the Cochise, and far easier to handle in bumps

http://forum.pugski.com/threads/el-c...t-rid-of.1100/

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**Bandit Man** · 02-12-2016, 09:59 PM

Originally Posted by slowroastin

Hand flexed them again with the front of the ski supported by the coffee table. They give a little then seem to hit a wall. Very stiff.

I'm going to stick with the 185's. They will fill the gap between my Mantra's and Governors.

If you have those skis in your quiver you'll be fine. Will be interested to hear what you think about them since those skis have stiffer tails. Maybe it's a heel driver/tail gunner thing. Or maybe your PSA certification level isn't high enough to appreciate the finer points of an El Capo.

Get some time on them and let us know.

**BushwackerinPA** · 02-12-2016, 10:05 PM

The reason why the first cochise's are so popular because its stable directional lunch tray that can go sideways at 40 mph and still be fine. The capo prefers to be skied with the tail following the tip.

**Beder** · 02-13-2016, 12:08 PM

Originally Posted by BushwackerinPA

Totally disagree about the Capo being vanilla. its easy going, but it also does not deflect and basically goes where you point it.

I also do not think they will be an awesome EC treeski but are a great all arounder and passable in the woods. . Most people who are heel pushers/ tail gunner hate the soft tails. If you drive the forebody and make round turns that ski just does not deflect ever, and has tons more grip on groomers than the Cochise, and far easier to handle in bumps

http://forum.pugski.com/threads/el-c...t-rid-of.1100/

.

So there was a mass exit from gapicski...what happened?

**XavierD** · 02-13-2016, 12:23 PM

Originally Posted by BushwackerinPA

The reason why the first cochise's are so popular because its stable directional lunch tray that can go sideways at 40 mph and still be fine. The capo prefers to be skied with the tail following the tip.

I'd really like to see someone take a current Cochise sideways at 40mph. That would be funny.

I thought the Capo was ok. Didn't do anything wrong, but in the 106-110 directional ski is nothing special. Can't come up with a good reason to get a Capo over a Cochise, Q-Lab or Ranger 108 (yes all those skis are different, but still more defined than a Capo).
Also is important to see how Nordica is positioning itself with respect to Blizzard. You will see that they are generally going after different markets. Nordica more towards the intermediate skier (NRGY competes more against the K2 Pinnacle and Rossi 7 series of skis, than the Cochise/Bonifide) and Park/pipe performance.

**shroom** · 02-13-2016, 02:16 PM

Originally Posted by BushwackerinPA

The reason why the first cochise's are so popular because its stable directional lunch tray that can go sideways at 40 mph and still be fine. The capo prefers to be skied with the tail following the tip.

hahaha, holy shit that is the perfect description

**BushwackerinPA** · 02-13-2016, 04:09 PM

Originally Posted by 5B

So there was a mass exit from gapicski...what happened?

Well I am banned, lots of people got banned, and a couple moderates got fired.

Epicski.com is no longer the core group of people.

**XavierD** · 02-13-2016, 04:37 PM

What happened. Never had an account but did the Admin just have a knee Jerk authority kick?

**Bandit Man** · 02-13-2016, 07:40 PM

Originally Posted by BushwackerinPA

Well I am banned, lots of people got banned, and a couple moderates got fired.

Epicski.com is no longer the core group of people.

So full off WIN!!! We need to hear more...

**slowroastin** · 02-15-2016, 07:54 PM

They will be mounted as soon as my bindings come in. I'm not a tail gunner. I ski fast on edge and almost never smear a turn. Centered to forward with my weight so I'm thinking the capos will be great.

**Beder** · 02-15-2016, 09:30 PM

After a week on them I bought a second pair, average price $170 I think. Love the flex. I think they ski like my Bonafides, but maybe I'm a beater.

**Bandit Man** · 02-16-2016, 09:53 AM

Originally Posted by 5B

After a week on them I bought a second pair, average price $170 I think. Love the flex. I think they ski like my Bonafides, but maybe I'm a beater.

So, honest inquiry here. What is it about the flex that you and others here who are fond of the ski liked? How does the flex make this ski better? I ask because I thought it is what ruined the ski. Solid through most of the ski, but suprisingly soft in the tips and tails. Couldn't charge on them with confidence. Again just trying to understand those nuances.

**beckcommar** · 02-16-2016, 11:36 AM

I picked up a very cheap blowout pair as well and I too really like them. To me the softness in the tips and tails makes for much more fun skiing in bumps and generally in any terrain where I'm looking to be a little more nimble while the stiff underfoot flex still lets me feel confident when dealing with variable snow and crud. I can see that if you just want to totally rip and charge no matter what, this might not be your ski. But if you're maybe a little less aggressive, the softer tip and tail makes the ski a little less demanding and a little more cooperative at lower speeds. So, yeah, maybe it is sort of a compromise ski in many respects...but for me it is a compromise that makes a lot of sense for a big bunch of my ski days. I think this are really excellent for me during the days after a storm at a resort when I'm seeking out lingering bit soft snow.

**doebedoe** · 02-16-2016, 11:45 AM

I think @beckcommar hits the nail on the head re:why some of us like the flex pattern. No you can't charge as stupid hard on them as a full-on charger like the Katana or Q-lab. But the bit of softer flex in the tip and tail makes it easier to work a turn shape at speeds below 35mp and makes it more lively in the bumps. It is still stiff enough underfoot to stand up to being pushed, and the metal makes it plenty damp in most crud.

And lets not discount the fact that they are cheap as fuck right now.

**Bandit Man** · 02-16-2016, 02:03 PM

Originally Posted by doebedoe

I think @beckcommar hits the nail on the head re:why some of us like the flex pattern. No you can't charge as stupid hard on them as a full-on charger like the Katana or Q-lab. But the bit of softer flex in the tip and tail makes it easier to work a turn shape at speeds below 35mp and makes it more lively in the bumps. It is still stiff enough underfoot to stand up to being pushed, and the metal makes it plenty damp in most crud.

And lets not discount the fact that they are cheap as fuck right now.

Fair enough. I bought them for the same reasons (cheap and seem versatile) but just felt the performance drop off too much. In the PNW crud I had to throttle back to get them to work, which sounds consistent with others' comments, again just too much to ask for me.

On groomers I felt like the turn radius was too big and gave the skis a numb feeling while on edge, especially compared to my 190 Q-Labs. I avoid bumps so no comment there.

Glad to hear lots of others are enjoying some blow out boards and making them work. Am a little disappointed I didn't have the same experience.

**slowroastin** · 01-31-2017, 12:15 AM

I wanted to love this ski, but after getting bucked hard a few times while raging through chop I decided it wasn't the ski for me. At slower speeds and in the bumps this ski is very nimble. Bring it up to speed on smooth groomers and it will lay trenches. Very confidence inspiring but it becomes misleading. The heavy dampness does not equate to much. High speed in the chop the tips will fold and the metal in the ski will snap the ski like a bow. Twice I was able to recover. One time I went down at around 50 mph and tweaked my neck. The price point of this ski is just not worth how unpredictable it can be.

On a side note - the enforcer is a sweet ski and a much better option.

**espiecks** · 04-12-2017, 11:55 AM

This is a ski I have looked at for several years. It is so intriguing, and I know it is something that would suit me (at the low price value). However, I ski with my kids most of the time know, and I'm concerned that the el capo will be too demanding as an everyday driver, especially if I'm skiing at slower speeds with my 3 kids under 10 years old. Also still teaching my 3 year old, been using the armada tst for that, but they finally delaminated on me last weekend.

**Bandit Man** · 04-12-2017, 04:57 PM

Originally Posted by espiecks

This is a ski I have looked at for several years. It is so intriguing, and I know it is something that would suit me (at the low price value). However, I ski with my kids most of the time know, and I'm concerned that the el capo will be too demanding as an everyday driver, especially if I'm skiing at slower speeds with my 3 kids under 10 years old. Also still teaching my 3 year old, been using the armada tst for that, but they finally delaminated on me last weekend.

These skis are garbage. The shape, layup, and rocker profile all work on paper, but they totally missed it on the flex. Don't be lured in by the price. Find something else...anything else.