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  1. #8226
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    Blister usually posts rocker numbers with their reviews. So if they have reviewed the ski your after they might have what you need.

  2. #8227
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    Mar 2008
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    Davis California
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    I own both the woodsman and billy goat. Woodsman is a solid one ski quiver board for targhee IMO. That being said. BG is one of my favorite skis of all time. Not great when there isnít a lot
    of new snow but itís unreal with anything more than 3 inches of softer pow/variable/chop. Woodsman is much more versatile and can lay trenches l, great in pow as well (itís got substantial rocker and is plenty wide) - itís just not the pow speciality tool of the BG. Trying to sell/trade my 116 woodsman for a 108 as rather than going with a 116 as a one ski quiver, the two ski quiver of the woodsman 108 and BG covers about everything me thinks.
    Go Sox!

  3. #8228
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    Seattle
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    Quote Originally Posted by tpacent View Post
    the two ski quiver of the woodsman 108 and BG covers about everything me thinks.
    What I'm rocking at Whistler this weekend.

  4. #8229
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    I really think 108 Woodsman and BG will be my main quiver eventually.

  5. #8230
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    Utah
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    854
    My new quiver, will post pics as soon as they are all mounted:

    184 Mindbender 99ti, p18
    187 Woodsman 108, p18
    189 BillyGoat, p18
    190 Rocker2 108, Guardian


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  6. #8231
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    Sep 2018
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    23
    Just wanted to give a shout out to ON3P for awesome customer service. I've heard about it on here before, and just experienced it and it's the real deal. Thanks guys.

  7. #8232
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    Oct 2017
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    Evergreen Co
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    Little Wren 114 stoke.

    I have had mine out in two 20+ inch powder days in CO and Utah in the last few weeks. I continue to be blown away by the stability but they also float really well. Much better than the Wildcat 118ís I had before. Itís a powder ski you can take out all day. Iíve also finally started trying some spins with them, at first the weight seemed like it would be an issue, but they release really smoothly on take offs and that Iíve been sticking almost everything.

    Favorite resort ski of all time.

    Dream resort Quiver:
    Wren 96ti
    Jeffery 108
    Wren 114
    Cease and Desist

    The only Ďissueí is that I really donít need anything else. There are very few days I would not be happy on the wrens. I think a Wren 108ti and Billy Goat combo would be incredible.

    One problem... If I ski these in tight trees for a few years chances are high Iíll bump something. They turn and pivot great, they just really encourage you to ski fast. My tree skis are Line Pescadoís so that could be some of whatís going on.

    Honestly, the Wren made me a better skier... or at least covered up some flaws. I ski faster and crash way less. The platform is so solid that I donít wheelie out of go over the bars nearly as often. They cut through everything, float and can somehow still slash nicely. They want an aggressive and very strong skier as a pilot... but damn hell of a ski.

    6í2Ē (maybe 6í3Ē)
    160lbs
    189cm

  8. #8233
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    Jul 2014
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    53
    Hi all, I was wondering if anyone here had experimented with mount points on the later iterations of the BG (i.e. with RES). I've got a pair of this year's BGs in 189 mounted on the line which I really want to like, but so far (~5 days), they haven't really done it for me.

    I'm wondering if mounting at +1 would improve my experience; I know that there's a fairly small sweetspot for mounting with the RES design. I ski pretty centered (my DD is a 4FRNT Hoji) and likely don't drive the BGs quite as much as they need to be. With my stance, I find that they don't respond quite as quickly as I'd like them to. Any thoughts?

  9. #8234
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    Always on the line with RES. Seriously. BGs really donít need to be driven and are better suited to a more centered stance. Iíd give it more time or maybe they just arenít for you. If you get to where youíre really thinking of moving them just sell them and find a different ski.

  10. #8235
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    Maybe iggy will chime in.....again. i couldnt find it but he had a post where he said the current skis could reasonably be mounted. I thought he gave less possible movement on the bg than woodsmans and jeffreys but still could be moved slightly. Im at +.5 on my bg's and res is still in effect. Was thinking i could probably go +1 even. Driving the tips no problem where theyre at now and im no jibber

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  11. #8236
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    Sandy
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tailwind View Post
    Little Wren 114 stoke.

    I have had mine out in two 20+ inch powder days in CO and Utah in the last few weeks. I continue to be blown away by the stability but they also float really well. Much better than the Wildcat 118ís I had before. Itís a powder ski you can take out all day. Iíve also finally started trying some spins with them, at first the weight seemed like it would be an issue, but they release really smoothly on take offs and that Iíve been sticking almost everything.

    Favorite resort ski of all time.

    Dream resort Quiver:
    Wren 96ti
    Jeffery 108
    Wren 114
    Cease and Desist

    The only Ďissueí is that I really donít need anything else. There are very few days I would not be happy on the wrens. I think a Wren 108ti and Billy Goat combo would be incredible.

    One problem... If I ski these in tight trees for a few years chances are high Iíll bump something. They turn and pivot great, they just really encourage you to ski fast. My tree skis are Line Pescadoís so that could be some of whatís going on.

    Honestly, the Wren made me a better skier... or at least covered up some flaws. I ski faster and crash way less. The platform is so solid that I donít wheelie out of go over the bars nearly as often. They cut through everything, float and can somehow still slash nicely. They want an aggressive and very strong skier as a pilot... but damn hell of a ski.

    6í2Ē (maybe 6í3Ē)
    160lbs
    189cm
    This makes me really want a pair of 114s. I have a pair of 108s in the garage though so may be a bit of overlap lol.

  12. #8237
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    Agreed ó on the line for RES. Stop driving the tips, tip em over and fucking stand there.

    For those of you who didnít like the woodsman (Iím in that camp) just posted up a review on the Dynastar M-Free in the dynastar thread... itís what I hoped the woodsman 108 would ski like (but didnít).


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  13. #8238
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    Ahh , if your more center mounted you are driving the tips less

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  14. #8239
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkiLyft View Post
    Agreed ó on the line for RES. Stop driving the tips, tip em over and fucking stand there.

    For those of you who didnít like the woodsman (Iím in that camp) just posted up a review on the Dynastar M-Free in the dynastar thread... itís what I hoped the woodsman 108 would ski like (but didnít).


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    Any more details on what you didnít like about the Woodsman?

  15. #8240
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    Sure thing ó really donít want to go too much in depth but...
    1. Tail felt too locked in while in deep NW type snow, on piste they tracked just fine but again seemed like a lot of work to ski and there wasnít ďlifeĒ to the ski.
    2. Dead was another word that came to mind when skiing it, I didnít have JOY while on the ski. Sure it skied just fine but didnít make me feel like I wanted to push it. Dare I say planky ó I really wanted to love it TRUST me. Because the Billy Goat is such a marvelous platform that will never be removed from my quiver! But I just didnít get along with it ó seems quite a few have showed up for resale so maybe some people will chime in.

    Again these are really nuanced findings that others may not have experienced but these are my own feelings and you asked for them!


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  16. #8241
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    Quote Originally Posted by iggyskier View Post
    As a general rule:

    Magnus = 0 (90) or -2 (102)

    Jeffrey/Jessie = -3 to -4.5

    Woodsman = -5 to -6.5

    BillyGoat/CD = -8.5 to -9.5

    Wren = -8.5 to -10.5

    We don't list specifics because 1) excluding the Magnus Series, the mount point scales and we get really in the weeds with a 5 ski line and 5 different mount points and 2) there is still an internal debate to be had if it will do more harm than good. People think the mount on the sidewall is true center - often - even when it is obvious. Also, why would we take the time to mark the center of the ski - and then require you to measure - vs just doing it right the first time? And yes, the story of the shop mounting the BGs -9cm from the -9cm recommended is true.

    I agree we need to do a better job explaining it, though. Next year there will be some new...information on the production pages that will explain mounts in terms of balance - not necessarily specifics per ski, but should help this out.

    If anyone ever wants the specific mount point, you can always message us and we'll give you the measurements (that will likely be posted in FAQ next year too. Just haven't got to it).
    Here it is. Now what is the actual boot center line on bg's ? Im -.5 on my steeple and +.5 on my bg. Edit: for last sentence in the post. -9 is recommended so at -8.5 im still in the sweet spot. Im at -1 on my gpo and thats about 1 cm forward of my bg's. Hesitant to f with them. I couldnt do without either ski

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  17. #8242
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    I believe heís listing the range the recommended mount point is marked on each ski...itís different for each size. A 179 BG doesnít have the same mount point as a 189 for instance. So he posted the approximate range of each line.

  18. #8243
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtskibum16 View Post
    I believe heís listing the range the recommended mount point is marked on each ski...itís different for each size. A 179 BG doesnít have the same mount point as a 189 for instance. So he posted the approximate range of each line.
    That could be true. A big difference in the wrens then. That seems a bit much

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  19. #8244
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    Jan 2005
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    Portland
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skeeze View Post
    Call out time. Whoís the guy with the Woodsman 108s who could not figure out how to click into his Attack demo bindings today at the top of the gondola at Jackson? He somehow didnít know how to cock the heel piece and was just trying to jam his boot in. This went on for about 5 minutes until I took pity on him and walked down from the lodge to do it for him.

    Bad look for all of us ON3P skiers.
    Perks of getting bigger. And let's not kid ourselves here. It *could* be someone from here .

    Quote Originally Posted by goolick View Post
    Does a 2 ski quiver of Kartel 108/116 make any sense at all? Because I just traded my PB&Js for a Kartel 108 and that what I'm running with now. I feel like I'm going to end up having too much overlap and wanting to change out the 116. Someone talk me out of it.
    For what it is worth, that is the quiver of most of the factory guys and team guys (outside of park skis) run.

    Quote Originally Posted by kid-kapow View Post
    Besides, ON3P's freestyle line is up for an update come 2021 - so I would just wait and see, and then decide.
    For what it is worth, most updates for 2021 are structural and won't be sexy but are an update we've been working on for awhile (and has taken a lot of work to complete internally). Shapes overall very dialed.

    Quote Originally Posted by brundo View Post
    Speaking of custom and Praxis...does on3p do a custom spring sale like praxis does?
    For sure June/July. Maybe a bit earlier depending when we finish early dealer production runs.

    Quote Originally Posted by kid-kapow View Post
    Good catch.

    Yeah, Iggy was talking about them testing lighter cores again during the Blister podcast / 2020 launch last year, so perhaps 2021 will be the year eh One would think that a custom core consisting of both bamboo and some light weight wood like pawlonia could be sufficiently not sucky to be worthy of a ON3P ski. Guess we will know soon enough Exciting times
    Quote Originally Posted by adrenalated View Post
    Take a tape measure. Hook it on the tail of the ski. Pull it straight to the tip. Not following the curve of the base. Straight line from tip to tail (so yes in the air above the topsheet). Just like if you were measuring how tall a person is, you don't follow all the curves of their body.

    Yeah Iggy has mentioned testing a lighter "tour" core but I'm not anticipating seeing it in production in 20/21.
    We're on track on a product timeline to have this available come fall - but a lot of questions right now with any supply lines that run through China (bamboo). So....we're in a bit wait and see mode right now on it and exploring US-based options.

    Quote Originally Posted by TunaGill View Post
    I'm curious as well regarding 116 Woodsman vs. Billy Goat.

    Anyone skied both?

    Which one would be better for a place like Grand Targhee?
    As best I can summarize it - BG is a real soft day ski, WD116 is a wider all mountain ski. WD 116 carves better, is more versatile in terms that its base level performance will be higher in all conditions, and will give you a traditional turn shape for those who like it. BG is a better powder ski. I view BG as more of a quiver ski and WD 116 as a ski for those who are skiing bigger mountains everyday (Snowbird, Jackson) and like a wider platform or for those who need more stability than a Jeffrey, but cannot make a ski mounted as far back as the BG work.

    Quote Originally Posted by powder_to_the_people View Post
    Hi all, I was wondering if anyone here had experimented with mount points on the later iterations of the BG (i.e. with RES). I've got a pair of this year's BGs in 189 mounted on the line which I really want to like, but so far (~5 days), they haven't really done it for me.

    I'm wondering if mounting at +1 would improve my experience; I know that there's a fairly small sweetspot for mounting with the RES design. I ski pretty centered (my DD is a 4FRNT Hoji) and likely don't drive the BGs quite as much as they need to be. With my stance, I find that they don't respond quite as quickly as I'd like them to. Any thoughts?
    For what it is worth, I doubt moving the mount forward +1cm is going to alter the balance in a way that will help you. Design is predicated on a bit of forward pressing to engage the forebody of the skis. If you are used to skiing skis pretty vertically, it is hard to create the needed flex to engage the sidecut standing vertical. You don't have to be super aggressive on them to do so, but it does require a bit more forward lean that you are going to be used to on a ski like a Hoji.

    We do have one team guy who skis his +2cm (Rex Shepard), but that is most certainly the exceptions in terms of where people like to ski them.

    Quote Originally Posted by SkiLyft View Post
    Sure thing ó really donít want to go too much in depth but...
    1. Tail felt too locked in while in deep NW type snow, on piste they tracked just fine but again seemed like a lot of work to ski and there wasnít ďlifeĒ to the ski.
    2. Dead was another word that came to mind when skiing it, I didnít have JOY while on the ski. Sure it skied just fine but didnít make me feel like I wanted to push it. Dare I say planky ó I really wanted to love it TRUST me. Because the Billy Goat is such a marvelous platform that will never be removed from my quiver! But I just didnít get along with it ó seems quite a few have showed up for resale so maybe some people will chime in.

    Again these are really nuanced findings that others may not have experienced but these are my own feelings and you asked for them!
    Out of curiosity, is this feedback based upon the BBI demo at Alpy?

    Quote Originally Posted by mtskibum16 View Post
    I believe heís listing the range the recommended mount point is marked on each ski...itís different for each size. A 179 BG doesnít have the same mount point as a 189 for instance. So he posted the approximate range of each line.
    Quote Originally Posted by grinch View Post
    That could be true. A big difference in the wrens then. That seems a bit much
    What?
    Seriously, this canít turn into yet another ON3P thread....

  20. #8245
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    @iggy - i was thinking your post gave a safe range that some people may move their mount and mtskibum thought it was the mount point variance in the different sizes of each model. That would mean evefy length of the wren has a different mount point. Looks like might be the case/not sure

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  21. #8246
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    Quote Originally Posted by iggyskier View Post


    Out of curiosity, is this feedback based upon the BBI demo at Alpy?

    Following. Was something wrong with that ski?



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  22. #8247
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    Click image for larger version. 

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    God damn I love these Caylors! You should do a limited time repress of these gems.
    FWIW, the Woodsie 116 protos in this pic my brother described as the easiest/most intuitive ski he's ever skied.

  23. #8248
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
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    743
    Quote Originally Posted by iggyskier View Post
    For what it is worth, most updates for 2021 are structural and won't be sexy but are an update we've been working on for awhile (and has taken a lot of work to complete internally). Shapes overall very dialed.
    ....
    We're on track on a product timeline to have this available come fall - but a lot of questions right now with any supply lines that run through China (bamboo). So....we're in a bit wait and see mode right now on it and exploring US-based options.
    Sweet - thanks for the update!

    C&D day for me today. Bluebird-ish, lots of snow after a big storm and stoke through the roof in spite of being a bit under the weather.

    On a side note, I've spent a few days on Wildcat108s over the past week. I must admit to preferring Woodsman108s over Wildcat108s. Wildcats are fun on groomers, but get knocked around quite a bit more in variable. While I haven't tried them back to back, my take so far is that you do not gain enough playfulness to make up for the loss in stability when going from a wood to wild. Using wildcat108s also makes me even more curious on how a jeffrey108 that is custom stiffer and mounted 2cm back would ride, especially as I am finally starting to make sense of my custom stiffer k116s .

    The main takeaway so far is that I am considering remounting my wood108/116s with Shifts over Castified Pivots (Shifts work better with the XTDs I mainly use) - or perhaps I should get a second pair of wood108s this summer. Dunno. Prob can't afford the latter.

  24. #8249
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    ON3P SKIS Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by iggyskier View Post

    Out of curiosity, is this feedback based upon the BBI demo at Alpy?
    Nah, if I recall that was a pre-production W116, since then Iíve stepped in the 108 and 116 on two different occasions.

    As a side note Mrs Skilyft loves her Jessie 108ís the quote yesterday was ďyouíre never selling theseĒ

    Iím impressed with how quick edge to edge they are at that size ó her skiing has improved significantly since she got on them!

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  25. #8250
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    Utah
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    Quote Originally Posted by kid-kapow View Post
    Sweet - thanks for the update!

    C&D day for me today. Bluebird-ish, lots of snow after a big storm and stoke through the roof in spite of being a bit under the weather.

    On a side note, I've spent a few days on Wildcat108s over the past week. I must admit to preferring Woodsman108s over Wildcat108s. Wildcats are fun on groomers, but get knocked around quite a bit more in variable. While I haven't tried them back to back, my take so far is that you do not gain enough playfulness to make up for the loss in stability when going from a wood to wild. Using wildcat108s also makes me even more curious on how a jeffrey108 that is custom stiffer and mounted 2cm back would ride, especially as I am finally starting to make sense of my custom stiffer k116s .

    The main takeaway so far is that I am considering remounting my wood108/116s with Shifts over Castified Pivots (Shifts work better with the XTDs I mainly use) - or perhaps I should get a second pair of wood108s this summer. Dunno. Prob can't afford the latter.
    I only have 1 day on my 187cm woodsman 108, 15+ days on 190 wildcat 116, and 50+ days on a 186 Jeffrey 108 proto. Hereís my take, which will change when I get more days on my woodsman.

    185lbs
    Comfortable initiating turns in either forward or neutral stance
    Used to be a jibber

    Wildcat 116 vs Jeffrey 108

    Overall Feel
    Jeffrey is stiffer but looser. Similar suspension and playfulness.

    Powder
    Jeffrey Floats much better in any stance.

    Chop
    Jeffrey blasts through it, wildcat gets deflected easily.

    Groomers
    Wildcat is a more natural carver, Jeffrey is a bit loose

    Summary
    Why would you buy the wildcat? It doesnít float as well, gets deflected more easily, similar playfulness and suspension.


    Woodsman 108

    Only one day so far on shit snow. Felt NOTICEABLY stiffer than the Jeffrey. Biggest difference so far is that itís not as loose. Still plenty of pop, but with more camber and less rocker I felt like I was fighting the ski a little bit in rock hard crud, but it definitely was much more stout than either of the other skis, especially in the tip. On groomers it had similar performance to the wildcat.







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