ON3P SKIS Discussion

[klikboom]

Yes that bulletproof layer is what I'm talking about. I know it's not ideal for a wide ski but when I'm in Billy goats the edges just like disappear on ice. No other ski I've had has done this. I have total confidence on my gotamas on that same surface but with BGs it's like hip meet ice and I want to stop making that introduction lol. I'm going to get a base grind then go 0 base and 3 side bevel to see if I can get some bite

[klauss]

you're probably relying on the shovel too much for grip. It's prominent on the ski so easy to do. If the only issue is icy entrances and the rest of the run is soft the BG is the ski to be on. The first part of this vid has a nice ice crust and I am on long effective edge older 191 wrens. they weren't even comfortable there and are a ski I like when there is a mix of ice and soft. Try focusing energy under foot and moving to the softer stuff

[bskin]

Crazy stiff and huge rocker is a sweet combo.

What ON3P am I looking for as a regular day/spring touring ski? 95-105 underfoot 185-190 needs to hold an edge in scary windfucked icy entrances. Does not need to ski powder super well I have kusalas for those days.

I have some Wren 102s 186 cm I might be able to part with.


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[morphintoskittle]

What’s the recommended mount on a billy goat? I stand 6’3 160lbs~ and feel I may be a bit tall for the billy goat given a hard charging/cliff dropping nature. How’s the wren 114 in pnw snow? Comparable? Thanks

[klauss]

What’s the recommended mount on a billy goat?

the line

I stand 6’3 160lbs~ and feel I may be a bit tall for the billy goat given a hard charging/cliff dropping nature.

No

How’s the wren 114 in pnw snow?

great

Comparable?

kind of

[jackattack]

What’s the recommended mount on a billy goat? I stand 6’3 160lbs~ and feel I may be a bit tall for the billy goat given a hard charging/cliff dropping nature. How’s the wren 114 in pnw snow? Comparable? Thanks

read back a few pages there's many a detailed discussion on this topic.

[mtskibum16]

I have last year's asym BG. I have found them adequate on those icy entrances. The only thing I'd say is if they catch you by surprise it can be easy to lose it a bit. If I am expecting the hard spots it's no big deal. Also, I think it has more to do with the serious factory detune than the ski shape itself. Others mentioned it but be sure to stay centered and use the effective edge under foot where the edge is also sharper. Without knowing how your skis are tuned, a slightly sharper tune might do the trick for you. I'll give up a bit of ice bite for the magic they offer otherwise. I for sure wouldn't consider them scary on ice entrances, but I also haven't had the chance to take them on any serious steep stuff yet. Never tried the older versions to compare.

My guess is the Wren 114 would be better in these situations and still great in pow. Possibly (probably?) a better all around ski, but I doubt they have the same magic in variable PNW 3D snow.

[carlh]

What’s the recommended mount on a billy goat? I stand 6’3 160lbs~ and feel I may be a bit tall for the billy goat given a hard charging/cliff dropping nature. How’s the wren 114 in pnw snow? Comparable? Thanks

If you are worried you want more ski buy a custom set of 1.5x supergoats. I am 6'3" 200 and they are pretty much perfect but I have never skied stock billys to compare. My only wish is that I had a veneer topsheet cause they are pretty.

[tpacent]

Yes that bulletproof layer is what I'm talking about. I know it's not ideal for a wide ski but when I'm in Billy goats the edges just like disappear on ice. No other ski I've had has done this. I have total confidence on my gotamas on that same surface but with BGs it's like hip meet ice and I want to stop making that introduction lol. I'm going to get a base grind then go 0 base and 3 side bevel to see if I can get some bite

Definitely a reason to buy some newer ones.

[auvgeek]

I'm going to get a base grind then go 0 base and 3 side bevel to see if I can get some bite

Dude, don't do that. Go 1 base, 2 side without detuning underfoot if you want, but they are gonna be awfully hooky with no base bevel.

[morphintoskittle]

If you are worried you want more ski buy a custom set of 1.5x supergoats. I am 6'3" 200 and they are pretty much perfect but I have never skied stock billys to compare. My only wish is that I had a veneer topsheet cause they are pretty.

I have considered this however am worried that at only 160lbs they may be a bit too much in 1.5 flex. Maybe stock flex then? To the guy also saying the rec mount is “the line” that’s great but I want something I can lean into and push ie further back mount. Do the SG’s prefer a centered stance as the stock BG’s do? Or can you lean into them more?

[Bandit Man]

I have considered this however am worried that at only 160lbs they may be a bit too much in 1.5 flex. Maybe stock flex then? To the guy also saying the rec mount is “the line” that’s great but I want something I can lean into and push ie further back mount. Do the SG’s prefer a centered stance as the stock BG’s do? Or can you lean into them more?

I own the current 189 BG and a standard flex SG. To be honest, not a lot of difference between the two. I’m only 5’8” but 195-lbs. either trust what people are telling you or look at a different ski. Ping Suprechicken about his 189 experience. He is closer to your dimensions, and is a ripping skier, and the 189 does just fine for him. You can push the 189’s really hard IMO. But they aren’t some Uber stiff metal layup charger. They are something different. Best heavy snow pow slayer ever.

Of yeah, auvgeek knows what he is talking about, too.

[morphintoskittle]

I own the current 189 BG and a standard flex SG. To be honest, not a lot of difference between the two. I’m only 5’8” but 195-lbs. either trust what people are telling you or look at a different ski. Ping Suprechicken about his 189 experience. He is closer to your dimensions, and is a ripping skier, and the 189 does just fine for him. You can push the 189’s really hard IMO. But they aren’t some Uber stiff metal layup charger. They are something different. Best heavy snow pow slayer ever.

Of yeah, auvgeek knows what he is talking about, too.

Yeah I guess 2cm in length isn’t too much...thanks for the detailed response! Exactly what I was looking for.

Edit: actually 4cm, just looked. May have to give a stock SG a try

[carlh]

If you want to drive your tips more than a Goat allows see if Praxis will make another set of Lhasa fats.

[mtskibum16]

I have considered this however am worried that at only 160lbs they may be a bit too much in 1.5 flex. Maybe stock flex then? To the guy also saying the rec mount is “the line” that’s great but I want something I can lean into and push ie further back mount. Do the SG’s prefer a centered stance as the stock BG’s do? Or can you lean into them more?

At 160 lbs I highly doubt you will find the standard BG too little ski. The BG is one ski you REALLY REALLY REALLY need to mount on the line. Going back will not do what you're hoping but instead fuck it up. My 184 BGs have a line at like -9ish from center (I'm 5'10" 170lbs). Keep in mind that a 189 ON3P is like a 191 compared to many other skis in the market. What do you normally ski?

The newer BGs like a more centered stance on groomers due to the sidecut design (RES/pin tail/asym), but you can drive them about as much as you want in any kind of 3D snow. This is not some noodle pow ski.

[galibier_numero_un]

Dude, don't do that. Go 1 base, 2 side without detuning underfoot if you want, but they are gonna be awfully hooky with no base bevel.

^^^ this ^^^
Definitely don't go to 0 base bevel.

Report on tuning "experiment" on my new (to me), 186 '14 Goats to follow soon.

... Thom

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[morphintoskittle]

At 160 lbs I highly doubt you will find the standard BG too little ski. The BG is one ski you REALLY REALLY REALLY need to mount on the line. Going back will not do what you're hoping but instead fuck it up. My 184 BGs have a line at like -9ish from center (I'm 5'10" 170lbs). Keep in mind that a 189 ON3P is like a 191 compared to many other skis in the market. What do you normally ski?

The newer BGs like a more centered stance on groomers due to the sidecut design (RES/pin tail/asym), but you can drive them about as much as you want in any kind of 3D snow. This is not some noodle pow ski.

Wow that is quite far back. What I saw online was -7 but that makes me feel better. I’m currently on 190 Bibbys. Had them mounted at -6 but like them now better at -4 from center. With that said, on a day where I want to charge like no other they obviously lack. The comment on only keeping a centered stance on groomers makes sense given the new shape. Am I being stupid for considering owning a quiver of a Bibby at -4 and billy goats?

[Sessiøn]

It should be explained that the line on the BG matches the point where the side cut transitions to RES. So deviating from this doesn't gain any performance whatsoever and quite likely degrades the performance of the ski even more. So it's not really as arbitrary and flexible as with a ski a traditional side cut.

[auvgeek]

Am I being stupid for considering owning a quiver of a Bibby at -4 and billy goats?

No. I own a Jeffrey 110 mounted at like -4.X from center and a BG.

It actually works really well because you can drive the tips of the BG in soft snow about as hard as you'd drive the tips of a more progressively mounted ski in harder snow. In other words, you never feel like you have to stay super neutral in 3D snow like you do on more center mounted skis like the Jeffrey/Kartel, Bibby, Renegade, etc. To me, the BG is pretty intuitive in 3D snow. As long as you're not trying to ski switch. RES doesn't have a reverse.

[andrewpringle]

I switched out from my C&D’s to Wrens after lunch. If I didn’t have a backup in the car I would have wished I was on BG’s all day.

Tues? I think I watched you swap in the gondy line. If so, those Wrens with the graphic over veneer looked sick.

Absolutely bottomless in the PNW front range right now.

Amazing conditions for sure. The 189 BG's ability to pick up speed through troughs, chop and poppy airs, then decelerate in a deep turn is so fun -- was just on repeat all day. Some BG stoke: https://photos.app.goo.gl/krsC4hkctuTZTbKK8

[mtskibum16]

Wow that is quite far back. What I saw online was -7 but that makes me feel better. I’m currently on 190 Bibbys. Had them mounted at -6 but like them now better at -4 from center. With that said, on a day where I want to charge like no other they obviously lack. The comment on only keeping a centered stance on groomers makes sense given the new shape. Am I being stupid for considering owning a quiver of a Bibby at -4 and billy goats?

Good point of reference. I have 184 Bibbys that were my go-to pow ski before I got BGs. They are mounted on the line at -6. Not only are they actually about 2cm shorter than my 184 BGs, they ski even shorter than that due to the more progressive mount. I'm a nerd so I measure all my skis. My BGs have a 101.5cm tip length (from center) compared to 96.3cm for the Bibbys. So the BGs have 5.2cm more ski out front than the Bibbys. I often found my Bibbys short up front for hard charging and lower angle pow and have not found that to be the case with the BG. YMMV

As for keeping both, that's not crazy at all. They are different feeling skis and offer pros and cons on a given day. The Bibbys are also a bit more versatile in that they are a better carver so kind of act as a wide all mountain ski whereas the BG seems like more of a dedicated pow/deep crud ski. On a soft conditions day and I'm feeling a bit more playful I could see myself taking the Bibbys out over my BGs and more traditional Q-Labs. That said, I can't imagine ever grabbing my Bibbys over the BGs for a true pow day after just a handful of days on the BGs. As I said previously in this thread, the BGs have quickly moved to best ski ever status for me.

[Bruce Springskiin]

F-ya Pillowfights! So glad I got a chance to ski these legends. Don’t feel near as long as they are, the mount puts a lot out back, making the front feel short. Pivot when and where requested. I was sure I couldn’t bury the tips but somehow summersaulted out of a bomb hole. Easy to pop off berms and bumps.
Didn’t meet any ladies though


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[t-the-east]

New wren 96s were so fun today.

Stupid question- what’s the name from? I know my kartels are Karl’s pro model, Wren...? And Stimpy?

[S.B.]

From iggy on newschoolers

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[morphintoskittle]

Awesome. Thanks for the help guys. Think I may just be in search of some stock BGs or SG’s.