ON3P SKIS Discussion

[smartyiak]

Wasn't there talk about a new fat ski being revealed before years' end? Any more news on that?

Came in here for update on “ConsentForm” or “‘MericanPillowfight”...but feeling Rick-rolled!

Lies...it’s all LIES!!!


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[iggyskier]

Wasn't there talk about a new fat ski being revealed before years' end? Any more news on that?

Little fast on the timeline. I don't remember exactly what was said, but nothing too crazy. We sold out of 2018 CDs before the season started, so there was talk of a midseason release of the 2019 Cease & Desist. New CD has one major update to make it a lot more practical for people who aren't skiing out of a helicopter or snowcat all the time (aka...most of us). That said, not sure production will have the time for it anytime soon. We'll see how January shapes up.

We are also working on one other powder ski prototype with LSM & Magnus - but that ski has several months of testing to go before we really know what we have there.

[uglymoney]

Yeah, fair enough. Good point. But one of the 'similar skis' I mention is a BG, on which I mounted a couple cm back, can't remember exactly, and the tails still kicked my ass. But that was a '10-'11 version, so quite different.

The tails won't kick your ass anymore. I had a pair of original BG (shipped Jan 8 2010) and the tails wouldn't release sometimes (usually in dusty on crusty and mank). My 16/17's BGhad no such issue last year and that was with me skiing on a weak rebuilt knee all season.

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[TahoeJ]

Pretty sure you guys said before the end of the season, not the end of the year. Which, given your new production schedule, makes sense.

On that note... something half way between a BG and C&D would be awesome. And I only say that because of how much I like the Wren 108's in powder.

[Wawawa]

I have been on my 102 Steeples the last two days in powder, groomers, and chopped up leftovers on 22 Designs Outlaws. Boot center on the line is perfect. Don't overthink it, just listen to PowTron. The days of mounting tele back doesn't really apply the way it used to except for certain skis and if you aren't on modern boots/bindings. Just keep a centered stance and don't poodle.
http://www.backcountrytalk.earnyourt...for-tele-still

And might I add that I am very impressed with the float and ability in crud for such a narrow ski as the 102. I like them a lot and can't wait to get them out for a tour.

Thanks, that's helpful. Yeah, I know people say don't mount back for tele anymore (and yeah, I'm on NTN) but I got kind of burned recently following that advice. On the other hand, that was on skis with fat-ish, pretty symmetrical tails and a -6 mount, and that just wasn't working for me. So the fairly pinner tails and recommended -9 on the Steeple was looking pretty good to me from the get-go. I just invariably second-guess everything right before I fire up the 3.6x9.

Sorry for the tele tangent here, folks.

[Wawawa]

The tails won't kick your ass anymore. I had a pair of original BG (shipped Jan 8 2010) and the tails wouldn't release sometimes (usually in dusty on crusty and mank). My 16/17's BGhad no such issue last year and that was with me skiing on a weak rebuilt knee all season.

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Sweet. Yeah I had exactly the same issue.

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[RudyGarmisch]

First day out on the new C&D - conditions were excellent which helped some, but holy wow. This is a much more capable ski than its versions in past. And the pow performance - holy f.

I regretted ditching my 191 BG tours this summer but I’m kicking myself for not replacing them earlier.

[Adrgha]

Little fast on the timeline. I don't remember exactly what was said, but nothing too crazy. We sold out of 2018 CDs before the season started, so there was talk of a midseason release of the 2019 Cease & Desist. New CD has one major update to make it a lot more practical for people who aren't skiing out of a helicopter or snowcat all the time (aka...most of us). That said, not sure production will have the time for it anytime soon. We'll see how January shapes up.

We are also working on one other powder ski prototype with LSM & Magnus - but that ski has several months of testing to go before we really know what we have there.

Hey, thanks for that bit of information. I was going to get a pair of C&D's this season, but I ended up being too late to the show (for various reasons.. I don't know if it was you I e-mailed with?).

Updated C&D's sound sweet. Will definitely secure myself a pair this time around!

[3PinGrin]

Thanks, that's helpful. Yeah, I know people say don't mount back for tele anymore (and yeah, I'm on NTN) but I got kind of burned recently following that advice. On the other hand, that was on skis with fat-ish, pretty symmetrical tails and a -6 mount, and that just wasn't working for me. So the fairly pinner tails and recommended -9 on the Steeple was looking pretty good to me from the get-go. I just invariably second-guess everything right before I fire up the 3.6x9.

Sorry for the tele tangent here, folks.

Oh, don't get me wrong I still overthink it every time as well! I usually follow up with the manufacturer if I have questions (and did for my Steeples too). However, some ski and binding companies (22 Designs included) are STILL recommending up to 4cm back for tele which is way too far back in most cases. Especially for NTN setups.

[MiddleOfNight]

Ha, thanks. Appreciated. The reason I ask is that I'm on tele (yeah, I know, my bad decisions)

+1 vote for mounting boot center on the line.
I overthought the mount point decision on my first ON3P's too. Iggy called, explained, and saved me from making a mistake.

Now I don't give it a second thought. BG's, BGtour, Wren's, PF's .. now SG's.. all boot center on line. Happy with all, very responsive and driver friendly. But in fairness I haven't tried a - mount.

FWIW I'm on old hammerheads (center setting) and 4 buckle garmont, and all touring or bowl laps.

[tuco]

Oh, don't get me wrong I still overthink it every time as well! I usually follow up with the manufacturer if I have questions (and did for my Steeples too). However, some ski and binding companies (22 Designs included) are STILL recommending up to 4cm back for tele which is way too far back in most cases. Especially for NTN setups.

-4 is way too far back in all cases. I've never understood why tele mounts had to be some sort of hocus pocus. I remember going balance point when I first started teleing and quickly found out I didn't like it and started going measured midsole on ski center 25+ years ago. This was on leather shit, cable bindings and skinny skis.

[Norseman]

Still dig the shit outta these old steeds. You guys make an outstanding product.

[Skeeze]

Had my first day on Wren 108s today. Using these as a daily driver unless it’s super firm. Compared to Line Supernatural 108s, they’re comparable on groomers (the Lines are perhaps more natural carvers, but the Wrens are totally solid on big radius turns), but the Wrens are much better everywhere else.

The Wrens pivot much easier in tight spots and they also seem more damp when slarving through variable wind buff. They’re plenty stable for going fast but also are a bit lighter than the SN108s, on which I would notice the weight when making jump turns or skiing bumps. And I’m sure the Wrens will be better in deeper snow with its rocker profile—I had issues with the tips of the SN108 spearing into heavy snow, whereas the tip rocker profile of the Wrens doesn’t look like that will be a possibility.

Add in the clear difference in build quality and durability, and the Wrens are pretty perfect.

[jdadour]

Got my 189 Wrenegade 108s out for the first time this weekend (with Skeeze above, at Mammoth. Arent we cute, MATCHING SKIS!)

Cliff Notes: WOWOWOWOW

I'm 6 foot 185lbs, and have been looking for a daily driver a bit bigger and with a bit more rocker than my 186 Belafontes. Also had the 186 Supernatural 108s like Skeeze and felt like they had a lot of swing weight and weren't easy to pivot. Goal was to find a ski that would excel in steep wind buff and soft chop conditions that are so common of the top of Mammoth, but still manageable elsewhere. Also, was debating between the 184 and 189, and very happy that sized up to the 189.

Groomers/Hardpack: Great edge hold and carving ability. Balanced and composed. Despite the long radius, I somehow found them easy to force them into small radius turns, and then roll them all the way over and they can make very strong large GS turns. Flex and torsional rigidity are stout, yet not super stiff. I traversed across some steep ice off of the top Mammoth into a chute, and they held their track well.

Pivot-ability: Very surprised how easy these skis pivot. The rocker profile and manageable swing weight certainly contribute to this. Not sure how these 189s would perform in the "Crested Butte Test" but i was hopping into a steep moguled entry to a chute with no problems.

Fresh snow/Soft chop: Floated well and was able to release tails just fine. Haven't gotten them in anything deeper that 6inches yet.

Crud/Variable: At 2350 grams and a 30m radius they stay composed when thing get nasty. Never felt uncomfortable sending it through some variable spots.

At first i felt that I wasnt in full control of tips in some situations , but I then adjusted my weight ever so slightly forward and the problem was solved. With all that tip and rocker up front they like to be driven.

Overall, these skis might be perfect. I felt comfortable and confident in all situations. Hey ON3P, good job! This Moment fanboy just found his new favorite daily driver. Now Luke just needs to make a Tahoe 112 and we will have ourselves some competition

[PowTron]

Got my 189 Wrenegade 108s out for the first time this weekend (with Skeeze above, at Mammoth. Arent we cute, MATCHING SKIS!)

Cliff Notes: WOWOWOWOW

I'm 6 foot 185lbs, and have been looking for a daily driver a bit bigger and with a bit more rocker than my 186 Belafontes. Also had the 186 Supernatural 108s like Skeeze and felt like they had a lot of swing weight and weren't easy to pivot. Goal was to find a ski that would excel in steep wind buff and soft chop conditions that are so common of the top of Mammoth, but still manageable elsewhere. Also, was debating between the 184 and 189, and very happy that sized up to the 189.

Groomers/Hardpack: Great edge hold and carving ability. Balanced and composed. Despite the long radius, I somehow found them easy to force them into small radius turns, and then roll them all the way over and they can make very strong large GS turns. Flex and torsional rigidity are stout, yet not super stiff. I traversed across some steep ice off of the top Mammoth into a chute, and they held their track well.

Pivot-ability: Very surprised how easy these skis pivot. The rocker profile and manageable swing weight certainly contribute to this. Not sure how these 189s would perform in the "Crested Butte Test" but i was hopping into a steep moguled entry to a chute with no problems.

Fresh snow/Soft chop: Floated well and was able to release tails just fine. Haven't gotten them in anything deeper that 6inches yet.

Crud/Variable: At 2350 grams and a 30m radius they stay composed when thing get nasty. Never felt uncomfortable sending it through some variable spots.

At first i felt that I wasnt in full control of tips in some situations , but I then adjusted my weight ever so slightly forward and the problem was solved. With all that tip and rocker up front they like to be driven.

Overall, these skis might be perfect. I felt comfortable and confident in all situations. Hey ON3P, good job! This Moment fanboy just found his new favorite daily driver. Now Luke just needs to make a Tahoe 112 and we will have ourselves some competition

Welcome aboard!

[galibier_numero_un]

Stoke for Wrens is building (debating 98 vs. 108). Just might have to get to the LL demo on Wednesday, the 3rd.

... Thom

[Aus George]

Got my 189 Wrenegade 108s out for the first time this weekend (with Skeeze above, at Mammoth. Arent we cute, MATCHING SKIS!)

Cliff Notes: WOWOWOWOW

I'm 6 foot 185lbs, and have been looking for a daily driver a bit bigger and with a bit more rocker than my 186 Belafontes. Also had the 186 Supernatural 108s like Skeeze and felt like they had a lot of swing weight and weren't easy to pivot. Goal was to find a ski that would excel in steep wind buff and soft chop conditions that are so common of the top of Mammoth, but still manageable elsewhere. Also, was debating between the 184 and 189, and very happy that sized up to the 189.

Groomers/Hardpack: Great edge hold and carving ability. Balanced and composed. Despite the long radius, I somehow found them easy to force them into small radius turns, and then roll them all the way over and they can make very strong large GS turns. Flex and torsional rigidity are stout, yet not super stiff. I traversed across some steep ice off of the top Mammoth into a chute, and they held their track well.

Pivot-ability: Very surprised how easy these skis pivot. The rocker profile and manageable swing weight certainly contribute to this. Not sure how these 189s would perform in the "Crested Butte Test" but i was hopping into a steep moguled entry to a chute with no problems.

Fresh snow/Soft chop: Floated well and was able to release tails just fine. Haven't gotten them in anything deeper that 6inches yet.

Crud/Variable: At 2350 grams and a 30m radius they stay composed when thing get nasty. Never felt uncomfortable sending it through some variable spots.

At first i felt that I wasnt in full control of tips in some situations , but I then adjusted my weight ever so slightly forward and the problem was solved. With all that tip and rocker up front they like to be driven.

Overall, these skis might be perfect. I felt comfortable and confident in all situations. Hey ON3P, good job! This Moment fanboy just found his new favorite daily driver. Now Luke just needs to make a Tahoe 112 and we will have ourselves some competition

Thanks for the mini review. I'm basically the same stats as you, was daily on my 186 Belas... I went with the 184 Wren as I wanted something a bit easier to ski. Couple of cm's shouldn't really matter much in my mind.

[Banh Mi]

I feel so stupid not getting Wren 108s this season


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[galibier_numero_un]

I feel so stupid not getting Wren 108s this season

That would be me (stupid - for the same reason). That was the biggest hole in my quiver.

... Thom

[Banh Mi]

That would be me (stupid - for the same reason). That was the biggest hole in my quiver.

... Thom

Same here. Why I felt the need to customize my daily driver, I have no clue..

I shoulda stuck with the tried and true Wren.


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[NW_SKIER]

Or vicik

[galibier_numero_un]

Same here. Why I felt the need to customize my daily driver, I have no clue..

I shoulda stuck with the tried and true Wren.


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And for me, why do I need three skis 116-118 when I have skis in the 100-109 range that I don't tend to ski. I tried to convince myself that they're good (Automatic 109s and OG Coombas), but the fact of the matter is that I'm never tempted to bring them out except as rock skis.

... Thom

[Banh Mi]

Or vicik

My first year on viciks (a different pair from yours), I was like 178 lbs or something like that. 21 years old. They were beasts for me at that weight. As the years went by, I got fatter(which is the main part) and faster, and now I really crave that 189 length and stiffer flex of the wrens.

I cant buy a pair of the wren 108s until I sell like 3 or 4 pairs of skis, I am freakin’ broke. It may not happen this season either..

I love my 191 wrens, they are so beastly. Mine aren’t even the 2012 versions either, or whatever year the man-eater version was. They arent crazy stiff, but they are the most locked in ski I own (they ski straighter than the Monster 108s), and extremely confidence inspiring when charging open terrain. They aren’t “too” locked in though, and the layup is super poppy, which compliments that damp and straight feel very well. As burly as they are, I have no problems with them when skiing tighter terrain, bumps or trees. Never selling these beasts.

And for me, why do I need three skis 116-118 when I have skis in the 100-109 range that I don't tend to ski. I tried to convince myself that they're good (Automatic 109s and OG Coombas), but the fact of the matter is that I'm never tempted to bring them out except as rock skis.

... Thom

Lol. I have three in the 116-118 range too. That’s my favorite 2mm range, if I was told to pick one.. Rx, Supergoat, and Billy Goat. I am cutting my quiver in half before the season ends, but those aforementioned skis will be staying, for sure.

I also rarely ski 100-110mm anymore. A ski in that range needs to perform exceptionally, for me to ski it all the time. Normally, they don’t excel on firm or in powder. The viciks were so good though, and I wouldnt be surprised if the new wrens are better.




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[galibier_numero_un]

... Lol. I have three in the 116-118 range too. That’s my favorite 2mm range, if I was told to pick one.. Rx, Supergoat, and Billy Goat. I am cutting my quiver in half before the season ends, but those aforementioned skis will be staying, for sure.

I also rarely ski 100-110mm anymore. A ski in that range needs to perform exceptionally, for me to ski it all the time. Normally, they don’t excel on firm or in powder. The viciks were so good though, and I wouldnt be surprised if the new wrens are better.

Gotta see if I can get to next week's demo. I have to ask myself if Wren 108s are too close in width to my BGs and such, and whether the 98s are a better spacing in my quiver - this, considering how much low tide we see during extended periods here in Colorado.

Then again, 108 doesn't feel terribly wide to me anymore, especially since I don't hang out on groomers and lay trenches.

... Thom

[skibass]

Not going to lie. I love my 98/ BG combo. Perfect resort 2 ski quiver.