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  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by XavierD View Post
    BLUF: you should be able to move your foot specifically your ankle and midfoot over your inside edge in the boot.

    Hmm.
    I guess what I am trying to say is generally we have trouble adding enough space to boots in the area you are discribing as you need to be able to roll your ankle and foot into this spot to get the ski edge to engage.



    L
    Imagine you had the right amount of space to achieve what you are describing for a skinny foot. Then as the boot dynamically flexes in certain snow conditions, that space becomes larger than desired, right at the time when there is the most potential energy in the interface between your skinny foot and boot. Perhaps this is a poor analogy, but it like the last suddenly goes from 98 to 100, right at the worst time.

    One thing I like about the X-MAX is the way it wraps my foot, and that wrap remains consistent throughout the range of the boot's forward flex. If I understand you correctly, that is a bad thing?
    Life is not lift served.

  2. #102
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    Overall, yes, I would want more room in that area, that would allow me to move my ankle in over the inside edge of the ski. I would be cool with it remaining constant so long as there was space there for my foot to move into.

    To each there own.

  3. #103
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    Wouldn't this be accomplished with a slight loosening of the buckles? We're not looking for a leather boot level of "precision" after all.

    I'm really trying to understand this concept of building extra motion into the shell.

    Cheers
    Thom
    Last edited by galibier_numero_un; 11-02-2016 at 01:29 AM.
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  4. #104
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    Apr 2007
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    Red Lodge, MT
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    282
    Just in case anyone's curious about the Beast horseshoe fit on these boots, it seems to go on fairly easily as long as you don't let it creep while installing, and there doesn't appear to be any interference between horseshoe mount screws and internal boot structures. (pics at https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/s...68#post4846568).

  5. #105
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
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    Der Town
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    Alright just got my pair, here's some initial thoughts.

    Sizing/fit: I went with a 27.5 which is around a 1.5 finger shell fit. I went with a what I'd consider a comfort fit because I actually plan on touring in these boots and wanted a relaxed fit boot for really cold days and days skiing with the wife. (I bought some 26.5 RX 130 for a performance fit boot when I want precision). These boots fit significantly larger than my pair of 27.5 RX 130 LV I was skiing in last year. Other than a small ankle punch to fit into the heel pocket a little better, all I needed was a thermomold with a thick toe cap to fit the XT 130. My 27.5 RX 130s required quite a bit more work. I have a narrow, low volume foot and I have always struggled with touring boots being too wide. So all that said, if you are buying these boots for alpine skiing mostly and are in between the size break, go down.

    Flex: Flexes like a Lange 120 or 130 in any variation (RS or RX). Hard to judge absolute stiffness in room temps on carpet but it seems like plenty of stiffness to me. I might even trim the cuff a little bit to get a soft flex at the top, we'll see. I find I don't need as much stiffness when truly backcountry skiing.

    ROM: Is good backwards, sucks forward. Forward flex reminds me of Factor 130 or other early beef boots. Smooth and then you hit an abrupt, hard stop not quite as far forward as I would like. Again, I think if I were to trim a couple spots on the upper cuff I would get slightly softer flex and a really big improvement in forward ROM, but I'm going to wait on that until I ski and skin a few days in these boots.

    Otherwise, nice fit and finish. Color is a little bit bright, but whatever, The liner is pretty nice. The boot feels significantly lighter than an alpine boot, and is even lighter than the Dynafit Titans I used to ski in. I am hoping to go ski some high elevation snow this weekend so I'll let you all know more as use them.

    Oh, and:
    ~205 lbs
    5' 10"
    27 y/o
    do squats
    not a dentist
    ski 3-4 days per week during ski season

  6. #106
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
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    367
    Do you use the laces with the stock liners? Was just pondering the potential benefits of using elastic laces, along the lines of replacing the stock powerstrap with a booster strap.

  7. #107
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    Dec 2014
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    I had mine molded today. I'm pretty confident I made the right shell choice - consistent with Leavenworth's comments. I went for a performance fit: 9.5 on the Bannock, selecting a 25.5 shell which was a tight finger between heel and shell.

    I have the slightest bit of pinch at the top of one outer toe, and given the similarity of my two feet, I'm sure I didn't push as much foam out of that to area. If it doesn't take me 5-7 days to dial them in, I'd either be very lucky or have picked too large of a shell.

    [edit] Looks like the toe pinch is minor sample to sample variance - stitching inside vs. outside the line. I think a mild liner stretch at the toe will fix this.[/edit]

    They'll be my 90℅ inbounds, 10% side country boot.

    Edit to add: I popped them into skis with Vipecs and noticed that they trigger the toe piece forward release with the same low bumper (insert) that my Maestrales do. The Titans required the taller bumper (yet another thing to think about when boot swapping).

    I don't have a gram scale with enough range to weigh ski boots, but I measured with a digital bathroom scale that's almost always withn .1 Lbs. of my local FedEx's scales (45 grams). Note the OG Titans are 26.5 (BSL = 302) and the Langes are 25.5 (BSL = 296).

    OG Titan shells only with stock power strap: 7.1 Lbs (1614 g / boot - shell only)
    XT Freetours shells only with Booster Strap: 6.2 Lbs (1409 g / boot - shell only)
    XT Freetours ready to ski, with Booster Strap / Powerwrap Liner / Superfeet Foot Beds: 7.5 Lbs. (1705 g / boot - ready to ski)


    ... Thom
    Last edited by galibier_numero_un; 11-08-2016 at 05:26 PM.
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  8. #108
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    Jan 2009
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    Squaw valley
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    I tried the xt 130 green boot yesterday. Maybe there was something wrong with the boot, but

    Ski and hike mode felt very similar. Not much range of motion.

    In ski mode, there was a fair buy of backwards flex, much more than the bd mx 130.

    In walk mode, pretty stiff to flex.

    Are all like this, or the boot I tried didn't work right?

  9. #109
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
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    367
    Did you unbuckle the lower cuff latch, and flex forward until you feel a pop after flipping the switch? I actually read the instructions after buying the boots and it made a big difference in walk performance. I thought it was totally worthless until I did it right.

  10. #110
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    Dec 2010
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    whitefish
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    I just tried mine on to make sure. There is a notable difference (in a good way) between walk and ski mode. I also opened the top buckles and power strap. I can come about 10-15 degrees past upright in walks mode, definitely not the case in ski mode.

    I will add, when I tried on a pair several weeks ago, the store ended up warranting a pair because there was a very notable asymmetric flex in the boots, and Lange ended up saying the plastic didn't cure right in the one boot.

  11. #111
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    While not the whole story, did you have the spoiler shims velcroed to the back of the liner?

    Without them, there's less forward lean, and depending on how skinny your calfs are, a bit of fore and aft slop.

    Cherrs,
    Thom
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  12. #112
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    Aug 2011
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    I got my first day on them. As should be no surprise, they ski like an alpine boot. They tour like my dynafit titans did. Happy with them so far.

  13. #113
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    Ok, then something was wrong, either me or the boots.

    In walk mode, I couldn't get them past vertical.

  14. #114
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    I need to get on the WROD this week to make my first turns on them. Yes, on the carpet (and on the scale), they feel like a better, lighter Titan.

    Walk mode - did you loosen the top two buckles? I know it's normal/obvious, but I had to ask.

    ... Thom
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  15. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by rod9301 View Post
    Ok, then something was wrong, either me or the boots.

    In walk mode, I couldn't get them past vertical.
    They don't have very much forward rom but rearward is pretty good. I skinned with the bottom buckles latched, both top completely undone and power strap loosely velcroed, worked pretty good. I think there is room to improve the forward rom by some minor plastic trimming that would minimally effect downhill performance.

  16. #116
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    Apr 2007
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    Red Lodge, MT
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    I got my first lift-served day in on mine today. Nothing steep, but 13 runs coaching race kids on the WROD (on Fischer slalom skis) and two lunch runs on Bros and natural snow. My thought after the first attempted turn was "oh, crap, these boots and slalom skis could be a bad combo for opening day". I managed to limit the acrobatics enough to get a feel for them, and I'm really, really happy with the way they skióclose, if not quite, to race-boot performance. Hopefully I'll be able to get out for some more touring on them soon and verify that they perform as well as I expect there, but so far, I'm very happy.

  17. #117
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    Jan 2009
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    I tried the pink boots last night, I think they are 110 flex.

    They had decent rear range of motion, forward not so much until I opened the top buckles.

    In my area, can't find the green ones,130.

    When I tried a pair, they had very poor rear rom.

    Maybe defective boot.

    Does anyone know if the 130 has the same rom as the 110?

    Btw, the 110 felt good as far as stiffness guess, same as my rx130 s, at least in the shop

  18. #118
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    Same cuff design and walk mode, so should be same ROM.

  19. #119
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    All of these boots are stiff to the rear until you loosen the top two buckles. As Leavenworth said a few posts ago, the touring ROM is similar to Titans.

    First few hours on them today. Yes, they fit the bill for the down very nicely. Over the weekend. I'll get to see how they tour.

    I'm loving these boots, although between it being my first day out, and the snow being heavy, it's going to take a day if two to get used to the flatter stance.

    ... Thom
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  20. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by galibier_numero_un View Post
    All of these boots are stiff to the rear until you loosen the top two buckles. As Leavenworth said a few posts ago, the touring ROM is similar to Titans.

    First few hours on them today. Yes, they fit the bill for the down very nicely. Over the weekend. I'll get to see how they tour.

    I'm loving these boots, although between it being my first day out, and the snow being heavy, it's going to take a day if two to get used to the flatter stance.

    ... Thom
    Thom, I run the spoilers. Give that a shot.

  21. #121
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    Roger on that!

    ...Thom
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  22. #122
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    244
    Initial thoughts on the Freetour XT 130 LV after four resort days:

    Fit: higher volume than both the Tecnica R9.5 and the Fischer Vacuum Ranger Pros I've had recently. I needed a big toe punch for width more than length, but that's it. More instep height and more met head width than those other boots. My feet are 270-272 mm long, 101 wide, flat instep, low volume ankle/heel/calf and I'm in a size 26.5 for all recent boots

    Stance: seems more upright even with the spoilers in place than my recent Fischers or Tecnica R9.5. Not in a bad way, feels about right

    Liner: good heel hold for a stock liner, relatively warm for how light it is. I'm a Zipfit guy so I'll probably try switching out this week to see if that locks my skinny ankle/heel down even more

    Flex: forward stiffness is easily 120 in the 0-10 F temps we had last weekend. The forward flex is progressive like a true alpine boot. Compared to Ranger Pros with booster straps, the Lange stiffens up earlier in the forward flex earlier and is not quite as good in providing suspension in rough snow. That might just be Velcro strap vs booster strap though. Interestingly, there is more rearward flex in the Langes than I'm used to. I'm not sure if that's the squishy spoilers, the walk mode, or just the nature of this lighter Grilamind crossover boot. But compared to the Fischers, I can feel the Langes give a little if I get knocked in the backseat

    Warmth: average. Better than the Ranger Pros but that's not saying much

    Walk mode: haven't toured yet. Seems like ROM rearward is average for this class of boots

    Soles: able to fit them in my old STH 14s and 16s just fine, plenty of vertical clearance. Haven't crashed hard enough to test the release yet

    Overall, I'm happy so far. I haven't sold Fischer Ranger Pros and TLT6Ps yet, but if these tour reasonably well, the rearward flex doesn't bug me, and the possible additions of Zipfits and/or booster straps optimize resort performance, I may be down to a one boot quiver by seasons end. For this purpose, they are significantly better than the original Cochise Pro 130s I once had (Langes have better heel hold, are lighter, flex more progressively, etc)

  23. #123
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    Jan 2009
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    Park City
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    Hey dgamms glad to hear it. A pair will be under the tree for the wife to replace her factor 130's. She's hoping to tour in them as well!

    Who did the punching for you?
    I rip the groomed on tele gear

  24. #124
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    244
    Detrusor, I dropped them at Park City Ski Boot on Iron Horse Dr. Cool little shop that only does ski boots. The guys can be a little grumpy but their work has been top notch in the past.

  25. #125
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    Dec 2014
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    Some of the edge to edge slow-ness I was sensing had to do with cuff adjustment. I'm not surprised as I'm a bit of a princess and the pea with respect to this setup parameter.

    It's been a million years since I last owned a pair of Langes. Any geezers remember the orange Banshee from the early 1970's? That was my 4th pair of Langes. 40 years later, I'm on my 5th pair ;-)

    Anyhow, cuff adjustment is different from Scarpas and my old Titans in the sense that there's no cam assembly on the outer pivot bolt. It's just (assumed) an oval hole. Essentially, you loosen the bolt, flex the boot, and (with someone else's help so you can maintain your stance) retighten the bolt. Details are here: http://www.lange-boots.com/US/US/rec...-skiboots.html.

    Bonus tip: before performing this adjustment, scribe a mark with a fine point Sharpie where the cuff meets the lower shell - on the outer (buckle) side of the boot. This gives you a reference point to return to. Since no one was around to help with the tightening, I adjusted the cuff on the work bench, taking advantage of the reference point to add perhaps 1/2 degree to the left boot.

    I'll test my first adjustment tomorrow and report back.

    Cheers,
    Thom
    Last edited by galibier_numero_un; 12-21-2016 at 07:22 PM.
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

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