Trucks.

[Falcon3]

Why spend all that money developing a PHEV when you can just skip straight to tooling up for a fully electric fleet to meet the new regulations and demand?

Except that the average time between new cars is like 6 years, and we have the tech to do PHEV now and cut a ton of emissions plus get people to install EV infrastructure at home and then go full EV in 6-10 years when they’re shopping again.

Nearly every person in this thread that has commented on EV trucks has said they won’t get one if they can’t tow/road trip/camp with one (range is the #1 issue, even if they only actually run into that issue 10x a year and the EV is great for 95% of their driving).

PHEV is a perfect step in the right direction and sets the stage for people to culturally/politically accept the EV revolution that needs to happen.

[neufox47]

If I could have my same truck with 50 mile fully electric range I’d be beyond stoked.


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This. Even if you had to switch to a tow mode to haul / tow. And even if the range was more like 25.


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[Yukonrider]

It's new truck season over in my house. I have been/am a die hard Toyota fan, and have planned to get the 2022 Tundra for a while now.

Fast forward to reality, my current truck is out. I could probably get another year out of it but I'm over it, and its still worth 'something'. Issue is 2022 Tundras are impossible to find in the configuration I want ( Limited, crew cab, long box, tow mirrors) its one of these "give us a deposit and we'll call you if we eventually get something close to what you want maybe 3 months maybe a year" situations that makes me irrationally angry.

Today I got bored and found a used F-150 that is the exact truck I want only a Ford. Its relatively close, I could go pick it up tomorrow, and while still effing expensive it's probably 6k+ less than the Tundra. Admittedly I like the Ford interior better too.

Question is, am I going to regret getting a Ford? Had the last truck for 12 years and haven't done anything unscheduled to it despite straight up abusing it. I probably won't keep this one as long as the last one, but reliability and resale are very important to me.


Not trying to turn this into a whole brand thing, these are honest questions. I have spent exactly zero minutes paying any attention to American trucks in the past 5 years, so maybe they don't suck as much as I like to make fun of them for?

[Conundrum]

Take the $6k less and buy a warranty if you're worried. I'm sure someone has been trying to reach you there.

And judging by how many of my d-bag friends drive them (what's that say about me?), there's plenty of people buying Ford F150s these days.

[Name Redacted]

Told this story a thousand times so I'll keep it short. Traded in a Tacoma that I loved but was old for a F150. 20k miles later w/ a factory warranty, and the Ford shit the bed at 80k, spark plug crumbled and ruined the top end, (the factory spark plugs that they recommend not checking till 100k). Ford refused to cover the new engine under warranty. Fuck Ford. And fuck warranties for that matter. Why should I have to pay to warranty your shit against failing? It's like the airlines charging you to carry on your baggage so they don't lose your shit. Anyway.

Replaced the engine, and traded it in for a Tacoma, now I wish that I'd bought a Tundra but I'll get by. At least I know that Taco will run well for me.

[AdironRider]

It isn't even a decision to make if reliability and resale are what matter. Get the Toyota.

The Ford will be 'fine' but you aren't going 6-12 years without an unscheduled repair or five with it and you will make back the 6k when you sell the Toyota, if not more.

[El Chupacabra]

I bought a new Ford truck last year. Build quality is definitely not to Japanese built Toyota / Lexus levels of fit and finish. However, Mrs C's US-built RAV4 has a number of fit and finish issues that I see and she'll never notice, so YMMV. Tundras aren't built in Japan anyway.

Aside from that, I expect to have some more issues long term vs if I'd bought a Tundra. But I needed a truck with far more carrying capacity than a Tundra, so it wasn't an option. And the F350 I got turns in the same MPG as a Tundra.

If you buy a used Ford that's still within factory warranty, you can buy an extended warranty - Ford calls them ESP. This dealer sells them online for cheap:
https://www.floodfordesp.com/

I bought one through them, at the "extra care" level, 7 yr / 48K mi, was about $680 after redeeming Ford Pass points that they gave me for buying the new truck. I don't drive that much so didn't need high miles for the warranty, more for the length of time.

[Mazderati]

I bought one through them, at the "extra care" level, 7 yr / 48K mi, was about $680 after redeeming Ford Pass points that they gave me for buying the new truck. I don't drive that much so didn't need high miles for the warranty, more for the length of time.

Do you know what the price was before points?

[El Chupacabra]

I think I got $200 of points credit from the truck purchase. The Flood Ford website let me apply the points directly, at checkout. Seemed like a good use of the points rather than buying filters or something from the dealer parts counter.

[Mazderati]

Doesn't seem like an awful price especially with the points. Integrated electronics and the cost to replace them have me thinking about OEM extended warranties.

[El Chupacabra]

The website spells out what's covered at each level of extended warranty. There's one higher level than the one I got, and it covers a lot more (almost total bumper to bumper), but costs a lot more. The lower levels didn't add a lot more over the 5/60 power train warranty.

For a factory backed warranty, I'm basically betting that I'll have something needing repair that would cost me $680 in the first 7 years. I picked the $0 deductible plan - it's a little less if there's a deductible, but I didn't think it was enough savings to justify the deductible. (Something like $150 cheaper to buy, but with a $75 deductible.)

[Ted Striker]

It isn't even a decision to make if reliability and resale are what matter. Get the Toyota.

The Ford will be 'fine' but you aren't going 6-12 years without an unscheduled repair or five with it and you will make back the 6k when you sell the Toyota, if not more.

^^^ This is a point that I usually try to make in these discussions. Overall cost of ownership if selling in 5-10 years will pretty much always favor the Toyota due to the ridiculous resale - even if the Ford doesn't develop any issues.

That said, if you're getting the discount up front, it could be a wash.

[Yukonrider]

It isn't even a decision to make if reliability and resale are what matter. Get the Toyota.

This is what I've told all my friends who bought Fords, but , but unfortunately I'm getting backed up against a wall.

If you buy a used Ford that's still within factory warranty, you can buy an extended warranty

This is a great idea, a good way to hedge against my reliability concerns. I can probably get one included at the negotiations table. Pricing is pretty steep, about 2k for 100k miles and 7 years.

[El Chupacabra]

This is a great idea, a good way to hedge against my reliability concerns. I can probably get one included at the negotiations table. Pricing is pretty steep, about 2k for 100k miles and 7 years.

Take a look at that Flood Ford ESP site, and see what kind of pricing they give. I think they sell those plans with a small markup, in contrast to dealerships' generally gigantic markups -- that may help in negotiating if you're buying a used truck from the dealer.

[XXX-er]

junior bought a 2 yr old f-150 still on warranty, it had an issue with the 3.5 ecoboost having a pourous block which they found by putting dye in the oil, Ford gave him a new Block

[G. Gordon Liddy]

And judging by how many of my d-bag friends drive them (what's that say about me?), there's plenty of people buying Ford F150s these days.

Hmm. I resemble this remark. Anyhow, I've had my F-150 for 6 years now. Nothing but oil changes and tire rotations. It's not just a city cruiser either. We use it as our primary vehicle to access a cabin 40 miles out some pretty rough dirt roads...

[frorider]

Anecdata are cute ‘n’ all, but statistically:

Taking into consideration predictive reliability scores as well as CR’s overall scores, the full-size truck reliability rankings look like this:

Ram 1500
Toyota Tundra
Ford F-150
Nissan Titan
GMC Sierra 1500
Chevrolet Silverado 1500

I’m assuming everyone knows the limitations of consumer reports data…I’d rather have a Bluetooth connectivity issue than a cracked exhaust manifold.

[neufox47]

Told this story a thousand times so I'll keep it short. Traded in a Tacoma that I loved but was old for a F150. 20k miles later w/ a factory warranty, and the Ford shit the bed at 80k, spark plug crumbled and ruined the top end, (the factory spark plugs that they recommend not checking till 100k). Ford refused to cover the new engine under warranty. Fuck Ford. And fuck warranties for that matter. Why should I have to pay to warranty your shit against failing? It's like the airlines charging you to carry on your baggage so they don't lose your shit. Anyway.

Replaced the engine, and traded it in for a Tacoma, now I wish that I'd bought a Tundra but I'll get by. At least I know that Taco will run well for me.

I had something similar but much less consequential on a Honda. They recommend changing the transmission fluid at 36k and 30k if used in extreme conditions. At 24k it wasn’t shifting right, so I brought it in, got charged $300 to diagnose that it needed a transmission fluid change plus the cost of the fluid change.


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[bodywhomper]

Quick google is that ford and mercedes are teaming with rivian. Wonder how long before their 4 wheel indie e-motor systems (“skateboard architecture”) comes out on a larger variety of vehicles (and trucks). Looks like commercial vans…. Van life?

[El Chupacabra]

Anecdata are cute ‘n’ all, but statistically:



I’m assuming everyone knows the limitations of consumer reports data…I’d rather have a Bluetooth connectivity issue than a cracked exhaust manifold.

Consumer Reports ranked the Ram the highest?

[frorider]

Consumer Reports ranked the Ram the highest?

I know, blew some minds. Tundra was #1 in previous years.

I’ll still never buy a Ram. I’m clinging to my anecdata dammit

[Ted Striker]

.

[frorider]

How did the F150, the number one selling vehicle in America, avoid that list entirely? Fascinating.

[Ted Striker]

Fleets take a big chunk of the F150s out, maybe?

[anotherVTskibum]

How did the F150, the number one selling vehicle in America, avoid that list entirely? Fascinating.

It's from car insurance applications, so it would have to be current vehicle of someone with a prior DUI, right?

Maybe too many of the F-150 drivers had to downgrade to Rams to pay their legal fees.

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