Trucks.

[Conundrum]

I'm curious which piece of plastic you're supposed to rip off with the handy man when you need to use it on the Rivian in those photos.

[easyrdr]

After 20 years of driving exclusively Silverado's (regular cab 2500, crew cab 1500), I made the switch to the Tundra in 2018.......bigger motor, more interior space for the family, better towing capacity. Bought the truck new and it cost a few grand less than a similar optioned out Chevy. I've put 25k on it and love the truck.

[Name Redacted]

Yeah, Tundras are kinda like an Apple computer, and Ford is like Dell. Tundra just comes with everything in fewer models. Ford comes with 50 different versions of motor, body, trim, etc. However, Ford offers models that go far beyond what any factory equipped Tundra will do (and of course carry the corresponding price tag). You ain't getting a 30 mpg Tundra that tows 11k lbs with 440 torque. However, that'll cost ya $60Gs.

[simple]

But a TRD Pro in flat brim is priceless

[Bobby Stainless]

[Conundrum]

You ain't getting a 30 mpg Tundra that tows 11k lbs with 440 torque. .

No dog in this fight but you are not getting an F150 that does that either.

[skaredshtles]

No dog in this fight but you are not getting an F150 that does that either.

Well - it *is* marketing, but with that in mind:

3.0L POWER STROKE® TURBO DIESEL
"11,500 lbs. towing — great news if you tow a lot for work or recreation; 1,940 lbs. payload; 250 horsepower at 3,250 rpm and 440 lb.-ft. of torque at just 1,750 rpm. Plus class-leading EPA-estimated 30 highway mpg fuel economy to go with all that muscle.*"

[Name Redacted]

No dog in this fight but you are not getting an F150 that does that either.

Those are the direct factory spec for the new diesel F150. Of course, the real life test spec might be slightly worse, they are substantially better than the diesel Tundra. Oh wait....

[AdironRider]

Those are factory spec for many different versions of the F150 with the diesel powerplant. You can get 30, but the tow rating suffers. Or you can tow 11k, but the mpg suffers, and so on and so forth. I don't fault them for this, different strokes for different folks, but the average Tundra is more capable for less money.

Like for example, to get 30 mpg you are looking at 2wd base models with that Ford diesel. You want 4wd? Kiss that 30 mpg goodbye and you are looking at 24 mg highway, at best.

Meanwhile Toyota just pops out a truck that will tow 10k pounds (to be fair it fluctuates a couple hundred pounds, but not the thousands like you'll see with a Ford), 4wd or not, options be damned. Oh and for less money new, and you'll sell it for 5k more at the end. That covers literally every drop of diesel you put in that Ford FYI over the years you would own it.

[Name Redacted]

Those are factory spec for many different versions of the F150 with the diesel powerplant. You can get 30, but the tow rating suffers. Or you can tow 11k, but the mpg suffers, and so on and so forth. I don't fault them for this, different strokes for different folks, but the average Tundra is more capable for less money.

Like for example, to get 30 mpg you are looking at 2wd base models with that Ford diesel. You want 4wd? Kiss that 30 mpg goodbye and you are looking at 24 mg highway, at best.

Meanwhile Toyota just pops out a truck that will tow 10k pounds (to be fair it fluctuates a couple hundred pounds, but not the thousands like you'll see with a Ford), 4wd or not, options be damned. Oh and for less money new, and you'll sell it for 5k more at the end. That covers literally every drop of diesel you put in that Ford FYI over the years you would own it.

Autotrader article compares the two:
https://www.autotrader.com/car-recal...81474979896141

This one is pretty much a no-brainer -- the F-150 is eons ahead of the Tundra in terms of technology, safety and engineering. The F-150 offers more power and efficiency, greater towing and payload capacity, along with a whole slew of convenient cabin technology that are not offered on the aging Tundra, making it the superior vehicle and earning it the nod in this comparison. That said, if you can find a great deal on a Tundra, it makes for a fine truck as well.

2019 Ford F-150 engines:

3.3-liter V6: 290 horsepower; 265 lb-ft

MPG -- rear-wheel drive: 19 miles per gallon in the city, 25 mpg on the highway and 22 mpg in combined driving; 4-wheel drive: 18 mpg city/23 mpg hwy/20 mpg combined

2.7-liter Turbo V6: 325 hp; 400 lb-ft

MPG -- RWD: 20 mpg city/26 mpg hwy/22 mpg combined; 4WD: 19 mpg city/24 mpg hwy/21 mpg combined

5.0-liter V8: 395 hp; 400 lb-ft

MPG -- RWD: 17 mpg city/23 mpg hwy/19 mpg combined; 4WD: 16 mpg city/22 mpg hwy/18 mpg combined

3.5-liter Turbo V6: 375 hp; 470 lb-ft

MPG -- RWD: 18 mpg city/25 mpg hwy/21 mpg combined; 4WD: 17 mpg city/23 mpg hwy/19 mpg combined

3.5-liter High-Output Turbo V6: 450 hp; 510 lb-ft

MPG - 4WD: 15 mpg city/18 mpg hwy/16 mpg combined

3.0-liter Turbodiesel: 250 hp; 440 lb-ft

MPG -- RWD: 22 mpg city/30 mpg hwy/25 mpg combined; 4WD: 20 mpg city/25 mpg hwy/22 mpg combined

Tundra

Tundra assembly takes place in San Antonio, Texas. Last all-new for 2007, the Tundra is one of the oldest vehicles on the market, and is now in its 12th model year since its last redesign. Updates over the years have helped keep it competitive, but the Tundra is well overdue for a full redesign. Two basic V8 engines are offered. Both make power on par with the competition, but neither is what you'd call modern or efficient.

2019 Toyota Tundra Engines

4.6-liter V8: 310 hp; 327 lb-ft

MPG -- RWD: 15 mpg city/19 mpg hwy/16 mpg combined; 4WD: 14 mpg city/18 mpg hwy/16 mpg combined

5.7-liter V8: 381 hp 401 lb-ft

MPG -- RWD: 13 mpg city/18 mpg hwy/15 mpg combined; 4WD: 13 mpg city/17 mpg hwy/14 mpg combined

"Eons ahead" just to reiterate/

[Conundrum]

Wasn’t out when I looked at trucks in November. Sounds cool. Easy to get?

[Name Redacted]

Wasn’t out when I looked at trucks in November. Sounds cool. Easy to get?

The diesel is only in the higher end Lariat, King Ranch, etc models. I think fleet vehicles can get it too. But although those specs are pretty impressive, you can actually get even better performance in the ecoboost. See above article.

I'm honestly not totally anti-Tundra. But when I was shopping around for a used truck, I got a lot more truck for a lot less money with the F150 so that's what I went with.

[AdironRider]

Autotrader article compares the two:
https://www.autotrader.com/car-recal...81474979896141

"Eons ahead" just to reiterate/

You are going to toss some hipster article by Chris Oneill from Autotrader as the proof in the pudding? This is a common fault of truck reviews, where they have some jabroni from C&D or Jalopnik who hasn't gotten dirty once in his entire life review a truck. It always comes down to something along the lines of "well the Ridgeline drives more like a car and plays nice with my iPhone and is therefor better". The Rivian is going to straight KILL IT with that crowd.

That being said:

They probably have a point on safety, the Tundra is 12 years old after all.

Ford hands down wins the payload comparison, but I am slightly skeptical about a f150 hauling upwards of 3200 pounds like they advertise on some rigs.

Used values, no doubt, I already said as much but we were talking new. You get your money back with the Toyota when you sell, but unlike a Tacoma, you actually can buy a Tundra super cheap comparatively to the competition new. You can get it for, on average, about 3k less than a Ford/Chevy with similar capability, and about 1-2k less than the Ram. I just did the math on all of these for work (see my fleet vehicle thread from a couple months back). The Tundra is the best value when buying new. When you can turn around and sell it for about 5k more than those comparables 5 years later, that is a big swing in terms of money in your pocket. (I wasn't lying when I said you basically get the gas for free if you buy a Tundra, the full 5 year costs prove it) If you are buying used though, I would tell you the same thing, get a Ford, its a better deal. Toyota resale only benefits owner #1.

However, the tech argument (while stupid when talking about trucks, literally no one cares other than posers) is a fail. You get a full tech suite including radar cruise, etc on every single Tundra from 18 on, no option package needed. Not true on the Ford, you gotta pay/play the options game there.

This was my ultimately point. Every truck can do certain things better than others. I like that Toyota cut out 90% of the bullshit and just puts out a solid rig regardless of whatever trim you choose, vs the Ford/Chevy/Dodge which is very trim/motor/option specific. That apple vs dell comparison was spot on in that matter. On the used market, that gets annoying when you have to search out the right year, option, trim, etc to tow your boat (Ford tow ratings range from 5500 to 12500 - that is a huge swing). Meanwhile Toyota basically has two ratings, 7500 or so for the 4.6, and 10000ish for the 5.7.

Funny story. I ran all the numbers for work like I mentioned, but then the owner of my company decided on buying Ram because they had 3 in stock locally, optioned exactly the same, in the color red he liked regardless of all that actuarial math I did so go figure. I ended up going with the Tundra personally. Different strokes and it really just comes down to color apparently. I was laughing the entire time I was shopping for him because that was literally the only thing every single dealership asked me was "What color you want". No talk of options, no talk of diesel. No talk about 4x4 (they are all 4x4 on a dealer lot), just the color. Sure enough, having three in red earned the local dealer the business from my boss, so I can't really fault them.

[Supermoon]

My only complaint about our Tundra is that you can’t get heated seats unless you get the Limited package which includes all this other bullshit I don’t want like chrome handles.

[Rideski]

Wow heavy hitting info in the last several posts. I didn’t see ground clearance mentioned in there. If hypothetically mpg was equal, more clearance would be nice. If it comes at a sacrifice of mpg then it gets debatable. What about factory skid plates?
I don’t care much about towing currently but heavy payload is good. So then I could potentially go with a better mpg gear ratio on the ford Sounds like maybe. No doubt that will be more of a chore with a used truck, puts the search peramiters through the roof.

[Bobby Stainless]

every single dealership asked me was "What color you want". No talk of options, no talk of diesel. No talk about 4x4 (they are all 4x4 on a dealer lot), just the color. Sure enough, having three in red earned the local dealer the business from my boss, so I can't really fault them.

Go try and sell a nicely optioned gold truck. Color is the big thing with 90% of consumers.

[Foggy_Goggles]

But a TRD Pro in flat brim is priceless

Don't underestimate the F150 flat brim scene. It can a bit more bedazzled jean, motofist, Eric Church but is a force to be reckoned with non the less.

Honestly, all the new half tons appear to be good trucks. You are gonna buy what you like so just do it and option it out for what works for you. I'm a $25K used F250 gas XL guy. I love it. 50K problem free miles and it does what I need. You might be Platinum 150 tonneau cover light bar guy who drives his truck to the office and goes to the car wash once a week.

You wanna be a living Calvin and Hobbs sticker, have at it. There is a reason the big 3 plus Toyota sell a shit ton of trucks at really high profit margins. They are capable vehicles that are in demand and gas is cheap.

[ncskier]

having owned both the tundra and many f150's. I'd say in either case, its a matter of preference. I'm in a 2017 superduty now which share the f50 cab and it it better in regards to features, but I also have a 7 year 125k ford extended warranty for a reason. If I was tooling around in a tundra, I'd roll without the extended warranty. The tundra does have bad air injection pumps and the power door lock actuators are guaranteed to fail. That being said they are rock solid.
I just bought my kid a 2018 f150 crew cab 4x4 STX model with 2.7 eco boost for 31.5k brand new with rebates and personal cash offer. It came down to price for sure but also with a 16 year old, the ford is 5 star safety rated in crash tests and the tundra is abysmal by modern standards. So for me, the newer, safer style(and price) won out. If its redesigned and safer at some point, i'd buy a tundra for my younger kid. Either way its what you value regarding features and if you plan on running a truck to 200k miles.

[Foggy_Goggles]

I just bought my kid a 2018 f150 crew cab 4x4 STX model with 2.7 eco boost for 31.5k brand new with rebates and personal cash offer. It came down to price for sure but also with a 16 year old

This is the kinda a crap that makes me so happy that I moved out of yuppyville. What happened to 16 year olds buying a $3K shit box with the lawn cutting money? College, food, a roof over your head, a few clothes...sure. A new truck? Why?

[ncskier]

This is the kinda a crap that makes me so happy that I moved out of yuppyville. What happened to 16 year olds buying a $3K shit box with the lawn cutting money? College, food, a roof over your head, a few clothes...sure. A new truck? Why?

Because he is a straight A student, ranked in the top ten of his very competitive high school, is in all honors classes, volunteers, has a job now, doesn't give his mom or me grief ever, works his tail off around the family farm and at home and drives his younger sibling to practices for sports. He's an all around great kid.
Also, there is no such thing as a reliable 3k shit box. In fact, I sold a 16 year tacoma for 7k with nearly 185,000 miles to help pay for the new truck. The tacoma had one airbag and a regular cab.
While we all may have romantic ideals of being raised up tough, the reality is I wanted him in something safe, something he could help out with a family business and I can afford it. From the time my kids were born I had planned to fully fund college and grad school and good transportation. It was a priority for my wife and I. If he was shitty and goofing off, then no new car.

[Conundrum]

I'm honestly not totally anti-Tundra. But when I was shopping around for a used truck, I got a lot more truck for a lot less money with the F150 so that's what I went with.

Did the same thing a few years ago and probably a similar decision making process. More truck for the money on the used market in a F150. Then I upgraded the suspension at a cost so it actually rode like a truck. Then I added airbags so I could tow a trailer without the back end wallowing. Then I pouted when I only got 16 mpg combined in an Ecoboost that was supposed to be so much better. Then I was happy I had an extended warranty when a turbo went out and left me a tough spot on the highway. Then I was bummed when I took it to the dealer multiple times to fix the radio which no buttons would operate below 25 degrees. I had to set the station and volume for whatever I wanted to listen to the next morning. Then I bought a new Tundra and everything has been great the last few months. I know a lot of happy Ford owners. I’ve been one but not with my last F150.

[ncskier]

Not judging your parenting, just noting that yes, there are reliable 3k shit boxes. I drive one every day!

No judgement taken.

[ncskier]

Did the same thing a few years ago and probably a similar decision making process. More truck for the money on the used market in a F150. Then I upgraded the suspension at a cost so it actually rode like a truck. Then I added airbags so I could tow a trailer without the back end wallowing. Then I pouted when I only got 16 mpg combined in an Ecoboost that was supposed to be so much better. Then I was happy I had an extended warranty when a turbo went out and left me a tough spot on the highway. Then I was bummed when I took it to the dealer multiple times to fix the radio which no buttons would operate below 25 degrees. I had to set the station and volume for whatever I wanted to listen to the next morning. Then I bought a new Tundra and everything has been great the last few months. I know a lot of happy Ford owners. I’ve been one but not with my last F150.

That's a good reason to always get the extended warranty through ford for sure. I don't think its the motor or drivetrain per se that will get you. It's going to be the power running boards, the cooled seats, the panoramic roof, naviagation etc.
Tundra is also more like a heavy 1/2 for sure. The 4.30 rear end tows better although on the used marked you may be limited to a very small gas tank and no integrated trailer brake controller. I think they added those in the last couple of years.
I moved up to the superduty, for the sole reason the all new aluminum F-150 seemed to tow and haul more like a glorified station wagon

[PNWbrit]

Because he is a straight A student, ranked in the top ten of his very competitive high school, is in all honors classes, volunteers, has a job now, doesn't give his mom or me grief ever, works his tail off around the family farm and at home and drives his younger sibling to practices for sports. He's an all around great kid.
Also, there is no such thing as a reliable 3k shit box. In fact, I sold a 16 year tacoma for 7k with nearly 185,000 miles to help pay for the new truck. The tacoma had one airbag and a regular cab.
While we all may have romantic ideals of being raised up tough, the reality is I wanted him in something safe, something he could help out with a family business and I can afford it. From the time my kids were born I had planned to fully fund college and grad school and good transportation. It was a priority for my wife and I. If he was shitty and goofing off, then no new car.

That's a lot of root canals...

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

[Timberridge]

Did you get the gun rack and Dale Jr sticker for it?

Plus, how will he learn basic car mechanics if it's new and under warranty?