Trucks.

[Name Redacted]

I owned a CJ7 for many years. Loved that thing. Really learned a lot about working on vehicles from that thing.

The only car that I would avoid more than a JGC would be a Bronco, either model. Look at the list of recalls just up to this point. The fucking windshields are DETACHING, the engines are blowing up, the brakes, the suspension, the control arms, etc etc. WTF?!?! How big of a piece of shit does a vehicle have to be before people stop buying it? Ooooh, but it has lockers! Neat! This thing is a fucking PT Cruiser with bigger tires. hahaha.

[Mazderati]

But in the offroad world, the only car that is better in terms of reliability is the 4Runner, which drives substantially worse both on and off road (it's still a very good off road car, to be fair, just not nearly as good as a Trailhawk Wrangler or GC.) All the others: Range Rover, Land Rover Disco, Bronco, Land Cruiser, MB G Class - they are all substantially worse for reliability.

I did some homework before purchase...

This may be the only time I've ever seen a Jeep referred to as more reliable than a Land Cruiser.

[Mazderati]

However when Toyota does update the 4run and GX the engines will get smaller and the 4x4 systems will be neutered.

Dealers are still charging over sticker for 4Runners, especially the TRD Off-road and Pro variants with locking rear diffs, because they are high-demand. The new Tundra got a rear locking diff that didn't exist on previous gens. On what are you basing smaller engines and neutered 4x4 systems?

[skaredshtles]

This may be the only time I've ever seen a Jeep referred to as more reliable than a Land Cruiser.

That's GOTTA be a typo - perhaps he meant Land Rover?

[Harry]

The Bronco Sport is front wheel drive based, transverse engine, isn't it? Just like the Maverick and Escape?

Yes, but a different center diff than the Escape. (I have no idea whats in the Maverick.

I’m not trying to claim you can go rock crawling in a Bronco Sport, just that it is not the same drivetrain as an Escape.

Edit: I’m using the term “center diff” somewhat loosely here, because it’s not really in the center.

Another edit: if I were driving in snow I would rather be in a Bronco Sport than an Escape. That’s the point I am trying to make.


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[El Chupacabra]

AFAIK none of those variants have a true transfer case. I'm having difficulty picturing a center differential in any FWD based crossover.

[Harry]

AFAIK none of those variants have a true transfer case. I'm having difficulty picturing a center differential in any FWD based crossover.

How do you think power gets to the back wheels ?


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[This End Up]

On what are you basing smaller engines and neutered 4x4 systems?

All vehicles recently. A recent example is the Toyota Tundra and Sequoia. They went from a naturally aspirated 5.7L V8 to a turbo 3.5L V6. I’m all for smaller turbo engines on daily drivers, but not on a truck/SUV used for towing/hauling. And the Sequoia lost its mechanical center diff (Torsen). The reliable v8 and “full time” mechanical four wheel are the reasons I bought a Sequoia a few years ago.

It’s only a matter time before the “downsizers” come for the beloved 4Runners.

[alias_rice]

I

The only car that I would avoid more than a JGC would be a Bronco, either model. Look at the list of recalls just up to this point. The fucking windshields are DETACHING, the engines are blowing up, the brakes, the suspension, the control arms, etc etc. WTF?!?! How big of a piece of shit does a vehicle have to be before people stop buying it? Ooooh, but it has lockers! Neat! This thing is a fucking PT Cruiser with bigger tires. hahaha.

If you are going to buy a vehicle in its first year of production you better go in eyes wide open. With that said, I’ve had no issues with mine in the 10,000 miles I’ve had it. If it was my only vehicle or if I had 25 mile commute instead of 3 it might be a different story, but no complaints from me. And if you need an off road capable vehicle that you take the top off of, you are pretty limited.

[El Chupacabra]

How do you think power gets to the back wheels ?


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Driveshaft out of the FWD transaxle, computer controlled viscous coupling. No transfer case. No mechanical 50/50 lock front/rear.

This is all fine for the AWD inclement weather usage they are all intended for.

[EWG]

Actually that's kinda correct. I actually didn't want to have Land Cruiser on the list at all, either bad or good, since it's no longer being sold in North America. Shouldn't be on either the good or bad list. Meant to have it say land rover, typed it wrong twice by mistake, and only fixed one of them.

Blah blah blah.

That's GOTTA be a typo - perhaps he meant Land Rover?

[The SnowShow]

Can one mod a MDX with all terrain tires and suspension and get a reliable, off road machine?

[jackattack]

All vehicles recently. A recent example is the Toyota Tundra and Sequoia. They went from a naturally aspirated 5.7L V8 to a turbo 3.5L V6. I’m all for smaller turbo engines on daily drivers, but not on a truck/SUV used for towing/hauling. And the Sequoia lost its mechanical center diff (Torsen). The reliable v8 and “full time” mechanical four wheel are the reasons I bought a Sequoia a few years ago.

It’s only a matter time before the “downsizers” come for the beloved 4Runners.

Toyota is following the market. The market for Sequoia and Tundra is a daily driver. If you tow/haul every day get a 1 ton.

[Hopeless Sinner]

All vehicles recently. A recent example is the Toyota Tundra and Sequoia. They went from a naturally aspirated 5.7L V8 to a turbo 3.5L V6. I’m all for smaller turbo engines on daily drivers, but not on a truck/SUV used for towing/hauling. And the Sequoia lost its mechanical center diff (Torsen). The reliable v8 and “full time” mechanical four wheel are the reasons I bought a Sequoia a few years ago.

It’s only a matter time before the “downsizers” come for the beloved 4Runners.

What no diesel? Pretty sure the smaller motors are going to do the job just fine.

[frorider]

I didn’t pay too much attention to bronco sport reviews but I recall a competent site that said the badlands version really reset his prejudices & was best in this category when it came to off-road.

Quick Google lead to this , pretty legit for this unibody CUV category

[Harry]

Driveshaft out of the FWD transaxle, computer controlled viscous coupling.

This is not correct on the Bronco Sport Badlands. It uses a dual-clutch , not a viscous coupling.

That’s my whole point. Far superior to any of its competitors.

No transfer case.

Yeah, OK. :rollseyes:

No mechanical 50/50 lock front/rear.

By this definition, almost zero full size 4x4 pickup trucks sold in North America have transfer cases. Anything with a 4A setting uses dual-clutch, not mechanical lock. And just about all pickups sold today, other than stripped down base models, have the 4A setting.

This is all fine for the AWD inclement weather usage they are all intended for.

Agree. But I’m standing by my statement that the Bronco Sport is far better than it’s competitors in these conditions. The statement that started this was that the Bronco Sport was the exact same as the Escape, and that is just not true.

Note: I’m no Bronco fanboy. Ford has been fucking me over on my reservation for a full size Bronco for over 2 years now. And they are telling me it may be another year until I get mine. But I’ve had time to study up on Broncos during those 2 years, and I’m really impressed with the Bronco Sport.


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[Name Redacted]

Dude, they didn't even glue the windshields in right. The motors are exploding. The brakes and suspension are all fucked up. If I was on a wait list for one of these I'd take my money and run and count my blessings that I didn't end up with one. How the fuck are you still waiting for one of these pieces of shit? You "Studied up"? WTF? Study up on all the ways that they fucked up the production.

Who gives a damn about the off road performance of a Bronco Sport? No way would I trust that thing off road.

[Cruiser]

.

[The SnowShow]

Dude, they didn't even glue the windshields in right. The motors are exploding. The brakes and suspension are all fucked up. If I was on a wait list for one of these I'd take my money and run and count my blessings that I didn't end up with one. How the fuck are you still waiting for one of these pieces of shit? You "Studied up"? WTF? Study up on all the ways that they fucked up the production.

Who gives a damn about the off road performance of a Bronco Sport? No way would I trust that thing off road.

What do you trust? Toyota. Period?

[Name Redacted]

What do you trust? Toyota. Period?

I mean, yeah, pretty much. Like I said before, I'd buy a jeep if it was just for fun and I had money to throw at it.

Look, everything sucks. Not a great time to buy either. I've been shopping for vans and trucks all year. Really trying to hold off a few years till the Hybrid stuff works it's way into this segment of the industry a little more.

I keep coming back to the fact that everything is a compromise, because every single vehicle has downsides. But I'm big on reliability. I don't care much about power, or MPGs, or bells and whistles. So yeah, Toyota. Maybe Nissan, Honda, Acura, etc if I wasn't shopping for a full sized truck.

OTOH, I am still leaning towards just biting the bullet and getting a Chevy Silverado for a work truck. But god damn that's a tough thing to do.

[Labcabin]

I mean, yeah, pretty much. Like I said before, I'd buy a jeep if it was just for fun and I had money to throw at it.

Look, everything sucks. Not a great time to buy either. I've been shopping for vans and trucks all year. Really trying to hold off a few years till the Hybrid stuff works it's way into this segment of the industry a little more.

I keep coming back to the fact that everything is a compromise, because every single vehicle has downsides. But I'm big on reliability. I don't care much about power, or MPGs, or bells and whistles. So yeah, Toyota. Maybe Nissan, Honda, Acura, etc if I wasn't shopping for a full sized truck.

OTOH, I am still leaning towards just biting the bullet and getting a Chevy Silverado for a work truck. But god damn that's a tough thing to do.

Toyota Tundra before Silverado. You know what’s right. For now and resale.


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[simple]

I bet every brand is building their trucks with zip ties and duct tape these days. Instead of a ECU they just hand you an Iphone 4s

[Mazderati]

All vehicles recently. A recent example is the Toyota Tundra and Sequoia. They went from a naturally aspirated 5.7L V8 to a turbo 3.5L V6. I’m all for smaller turbo engines on daily drivers, but not on a truck/SUV used for towing/hauling. And the Sequoia lost its mechanical center diff (Torsen). The reliable v8 and “full time” mechanical four wheel are the reasons I bought a Sequoia a few years ago.

It’s only a matter time before the “downsizers” come for the beloved 4Runners.

The question was about the next gen 4Runner and GX and anything about them is speculation at this point. The new Sequoia has a part-time 4WD system with optional rear locker. It's a more traditional design than the previous gen. Neophobes should love it.

[Mazderati]

Dude, they didn't even glue the windshields in right. The motors are exploding. The brakes and suspension are all fucked up. If I was on a wait list for one of these I'd take my money and run and count my blessings that I didn't end up with one. How the fuck are you still waiting for one of these pieces of shit? You "Studied up"? WTF? Study up on all the ways that they fucked up the production.

Who gives a damn about the off road performance of a Bronco Sport? No way would I trust that thing off road.

It sounds like the bugs may be worked out by the time Harry gets his.

[Harry]

Who gives a damn about the off road performance of a Bronco Sport? No way would I trust that thing off road.

Who’s talking about off-roading in a Bronco Sport ? I’m talking about driving in inclement weather.





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