Tele bindings that aren't crap

**ski-wpk** · 01-10-2016, 09:16 AM

I know, I know... all tele is crap... but for those of you on a tele rig, what bindings do I get that will drive, and last more than a season?

In the past 3 seasons I've broken 2 HH heel loops, 1 HH toe box, 1 BD 01 toe box, and ripped out 2 pair of Targas. I'm now ski-less due to two binding fails in the last week. I definitely need a 6-hole mount pattern but even that hasn't solved the issue, as my exploded 01 proved yesterday.

Are Axls/Vices really an improvement over HammerHeads? Is the Axl's tour mode equivalent to the BD 01, and is the tour mode worth another $100 over the non-tour Vice? Or is the Bishop v2 worth the $500 price tag?

Thanks for any advice. I'm currently on Scarpa T-Race and primary skis are Gotamas and Squad 7s. Solomon GS skis occasionally as well.

**Tri-Ungulate** · 01-10-2016, 09:30 AM

http://bishopbindings.com
Expensive but worth it. Best in-area rig in terms of control, power, dial-ability, and sturdiness and most parts are easily replaceable when they get worn down. I have broken several pairs but the new models have addressed weaknesses in the power tubes.

Not so great for touring, though not terrible.

**DropCliffsNotBombs** · 01-10-2016, 09:54 AM

They still make tele gear? Well I'll be damned!

**charlesj** · 01-10-2016, 12:23 PM

there will always be a subset of alpine skiers who for one reason or another choose to embrace the challenging anachronism that is free heel. It is fun, more work and can make one a better alpine skier, moreover it is a friendly elitist sub culture not a smug one. If I wasn't so old and decrepit I'd do it more

**Peruvian** · 01-10-2016, 12:28 PM

What condition are your bindings when they explode? HH and 01s have pretty low rates of toe box failure.

When I was on 75mm I always like Voile switchbacks.

**bodywhomper** · 01-10-2016, 12:34 PM

Learn to be less of a hack!

Also, pull out can also be a function of misadjusted bindings.

**lowsparkco** · 01-10-2016, 12:41 PM

The Axl is definitely an upgrade from the HH if you tour. Heavier than the BD free pivot, but burlier too.

Back when HH was the standard for lift access skiing, I don't recall a lot of reports of failures. If they're the little spring activated heels, then sure, depending on the mount and care, I could see them being some what fragile, but the toe box? The Vice is just to keep the parts redundant between a tour / no tour binding.

Sounds like the Bomber may be your binding. Big guys with aggressive technique have always had a tough time ripping screws using tele bindings. All you can do is mount 'em solid and ski a bit more conservatively. No way around the fact that you're transferring more force onto fewer screws.

**ski-wpk** · 01-10-2016, 01:47 PM

Here's my exploded 01 toe box from yesterday.

Click image for larger version.

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Sounds like I need Bishops. Just can't afford them at the $495 price tag.

**kneedropper** · 01-10-2016, 04:37 PM

Originally Posted by ski-wpk

Here's my exploded 01 toe box from yesterday.

Sounds like I need Bishops. Just can't afford them at the $495 price tag.

Buy my used set for $250 plus ship & PayPal. Skis free or I can pull the bindings for you.

Bomber bishops first gen $250. Skis free or I can ship just bindings. Salomon ak rocket 195 with the tails partially chopped.

Click image for larger version.

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**Meadow Skipper** · 01-10-2016, 04:53 PM

Originally Posted by charlesj

there will always be a subset of alpine skiers who for one reason or another choose to embrace the challenging anachronism that is free heel. It is fun, more work and can make one a better alpine skier, moreover it is a friendly elitist sub culture not a smug one. If I wasn't so old and decrepit I'd do it more

That, and chicks dig it.

Originally Posted by Tri-Ungulate

http://bishopbindings.com
Expensive but worth it. Best in-area rig in terms of control, power, dial-ability, and sturdiness and most parts are easily replaceable when they get worn down. I have broken several pairs but the new models have addressed weaknesses in the power tubes.

Not so great for touring, though not terrible.

^^^This.

**Peruvian** · 01-10-2016, 06:58 PM

Originally Posted by ski-wpk

Here's my exploded 01 toe box from yesterday.

Sounds like I need Bishops. Just can't afford them at the $495 price tag.

By chance, do you run your springs with a lot of pre-load? That looks like you bottomed out and the forward pressure tore the binding apart. Maybe try with less spring tension in the future.

**miserywhip** · 01-10-2016, 07:04 PM

Originally Posted by Tri-Ungulate

http://bishopbindings.com
Expensive but worth it. Best in-area rig in terms of control, power, dial-ability, and sturdiness and most parts are easily replaceable when they get worn down. I have broken several pairs but the new models have addressed weaknesses in the power tubes.

Not so great for touring, though not terrible.

Demoed these today at Loveland. They look quite unlikely to break, construction appears top notch. They skied well, but I can't offer a detailed review - only did a couple runs, and my flimsy boots (and legs) had trouble with the beefy skis I chose.

Thanks to montanaskier for the hook up. Cool brand.

**Tri-Ungulate** · 01-10-2016, 07:14 PM

ski-wpk, if you don't jump on kneedropper's offer I'm tempted to get em myself, and I have 3 sets of Bishops already. They look to be in great shape. I prolly won't because you only really only need one pair with the switch plates, but still. I've competed (and podiumed) on the Tele Freeskiing tour with my Bishops and will swear by them. I also ski on Voiles and Rotte NTN, (as well as have skied on Hammerheads and O1s in the past) but for your needs the Bishop sounds like the ticket.

**ski-wpk** · 01-10-2016, 09:22 PM

Originally Posted by Peruvian

By chance, do you run your springs with a lot of pre-load? That looks like you bottomed out and the forward pressure tore the binding apart. Maybe try with less spring tension in the future.

Not a lot of preload actually. Flipping up the heel bail on the 01s is always kind of scary because they don't 'snap' with any authority. I always think they won't stay on but I've never come out of them (until yesterday).

**ski-wpk** · 01-10-2016, 09:30 PM

Originally Posted by kneedropper

Buy my used set for $250 plus ship & PayPal. Skis free or I can pull the bindings for you.

Bomber bishops first gen $250. Skis free or I can ship just bindings. Salomon ak rocket 195 with the tails partially chopped.

How different are v2s than the original?

**Tech Tonics** · 01-10-2016, 09:32 PM

Fuck duckbills.

NTN is where it's at.

Sooooo superior.

**dschane** · 01-10-2016, 10:44 PM

Another vote for Bishops, or the Voile Switchback X2s if you plan to go touring.

**Tri-Ungulate** · 01-10-2016, 11:06 PM

Originally Posted by ski-wpk

How different are v2s than the original?

As I mentioned earlier, vastly beefier power tubes, which in the v1s had the possibility of cracking. This has happened to me, usually in very cold weather after a few zillion cycles of hard use. Also v2 has a slightly beefier pivot, though that's unlikely to be a problem. When I have cracked the power tubes, Bishop has replaced them, and though they do charge for the replacements, I considered it fair, especially since all the pairs I broke were from bindings I bought used. If you buy them new, I'm pretty sure they have an excellent warrantee.

**Flyoverland Captive** · 01-10-2016, 11:10 PM

Axls and Vices are pretty bomber; I've destroyed a shitload of Hammerheads, but only one Axl, and that was the first year prototype. But then I switched to NTN, and have had no problems at all.

**MMP** · 01-11-2016, 06:09 AM

I have some AXL I'm not using if you want to pick some up lmk.

**HHTELE** · 01-11-2016, 07:11 AM

Originally Posted by ski-wpk

Not a lot of preload actually. Flipping up the heel bail on the 01s is always kind of scary because they don't 'snap' with any authority. I always think they won't stay on but I've never come out of them (until yesterday).

Well, at least the release function works.
That's actually the tertiary release on an O1- cables being primary and screws ripping being secondary.

Haven't skied Bombers, but if I was looking for the closest thing to unbreakable, that would be my first choice. Universally well regarded as durable and precise.

As far as touring- I have Axls, 01's (4 hole) and SBs, (v2).
AXLs ski best (subjective), have the most reliable ski/tour switch, and are the most durable.

I have been skinning/sidestepping up steep and hard where most others were booting with crampons and been very happy to have AXLs between me and my skis. Really reliable in and out of tour mode with the least chance of potential ice build up, and very secure when stomping an edge in.

**Meadow Skipper** · 01-11-2016, 07:25 AM

Originally Posted by Tech Tonics

Fuck duckbills.

NTN is where it's at.

Sooooo superior.

I love me some NTN, I've got them on almost all my skis, but those Bombers are mo' bomber.

**MMP** · 01-11-2016, 07:40 AM

just switched to NTN, havent skied it yet. picking up my rig today. Pieced together with Scarpa TX comp and Freedoms from Hop, solid hookup, ridiculously fast ship, and some Kastle from Rusty Groomer.

After wearing those boots in the house, and then skinning half of my local hill in T-1's and AXL's saturday, I'm looking forward to the weight savings, and being older (51), having a repaired ACL, and skiing out west more every year at higher elevations (I hate to admit this) bending down to attach leashes and click in getting painful, cant wait to step-in.

**ski-wpk** · 01-11-2016, 12:31 PM

NTN may be my long term option but for now, BD is shipping a replacement 01 (<24 HR resolution - thanks BD!) and I picked up some Vices to try on a second pair. Definitely Bishops on the next setup. Just can't afford them (new or used) right now.

Thanks all for the feedback. I'll post to this thread when I break the Vices. : )

**ski-wpk** · 01-11-2016, 12:34 PM

Originally Posted by hhtele

Well, at least the release function works.
That's actually the tertiary release on an O1- cables being primary and screws ripping being secondary.

Haven't skied Bombers, but if I was looking for the closest thing to unbreakable, that would be my first choice. Universally well regarded as durable and precise.

As far as touring- I have Axls, 01's (4 hole) and SBs, (v2).
AXLs ski best (subjective), have the most reliable ski/tour switch, and are the most durable.

I have been skinning/sidestepping up steep and hard where most others were booting with crampons and been very happy to have AXLs between me and my skis. Really reliable in and out of tour mode with the least chance of potential ice build up, and very secure when stomping an edge in.

I went with Vice over Axl. Disappointed to not have tour mode but figured that was just another potential failure point. Hopefully fewer parts equals less breakage.