Tammy Wynette cannot be reached for help-Divorce advice

[shroom]

i mean, the first statement is solid. this isn’t Entourage.

[Cono Este]

You are fucking disgusting.

And you’re more than a few cards short of a full deck.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[Mazderati]

There's a shiticane blowing through this thread.

[Skidog]

That's just spiteful and mean. Who the fuck are you, and what do you know about his marriage.

I've never said shit about you here or to you; always seemed like a shitty thing to do. But you deserve to be called out for the miserable, self-loathing shit you're projecting here. Kick people down who you no nothing about while they're in the middle of the worst moment of their lives? The fuck do you think you are you miserable excuse?

You're mean, petty, and sad - flinging poo from the corner of the internet to feel superior or some sort of self-worth. Go find some happiness and direct your hate elsewhere, we're all stocked up here.

Remember her realtionship experience = #herpes

Sent from my XT1650 using TGR Forums mobile app

[Skidog]

Actually - your wrong.

I've asked.

I expected more from an attorney. You'RE.

Sent from my XT1650 using TGR Forums mobile app

[LHutz Esq]

Second thought - never mind.

Please carry on.

[Viva]

And you’re more than a few cards short of a full deck.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

Her cornbread ain't done in the middle

She's a few floors shy of the penthouse

A couple sandwiches short of a picnic



Sent from my XT1650 using TGR Forums mobile app

[DBdude]

There's a shiticane blowing through this thread.

the cracken is awake

[Meadow Skipper]

Her cornbread ain't done in the middle

She's a few floors shy of the penthouse

A couple sandwiches short of a picnic

A few fries short of a Happy Meal.

The cheese has slid off her cracker.

[liv2ski]

A loving father of daughters wouldn't speak of women that way.

I didn't say women, I said bitches which is what those gold digging cunts turned out to be. My oldest can be pretty harsh, so I feel bad for the guy that marries her. My youngest is the nicest person (besides her mom) that I know. Sadly she has had really bad luck with men so far. She is not the one to fuck someone else over.
Woman or man, it does not matter. Some people are just big pieces of shit and God help you if you marry one.

[babybear]

B bear, love your on line persona and only wish you two the best, but remember that cartoon goes both ways, so be careful and work on your relationship ever day. It is amazing how fast the garden dies if neglected.

I like you too. and pretty sure I am the same person online and irl (I'd probably make myself hotter/ thinner if I were making myself different )
appreciate the advice for sure. but just know I don't take this marriage thing lightly at all- I just think Cono's generalization shows his age. So many of my friends dont bat an eyelash at role reversals. Hell I was raised by my single dad so maybe I am just lucky and didn't grow up indoctrinated that I had to fit into some sort of a box
We've been together over 10 yrs now. It hasn't always been a bed of roses- we've gone thru some serious marriage ending stuff already so I feel confident in our ability to work through adverse situations and keep the spark. Obviously I don't talk about the rough patches but it hasn't always been like livin' inn paradise
I am also a deep thinker and I love continuing to learn and understand things - root causes and shit and that includes human nature and relationships. Not ashamed to say we've worked with a counselor- they are the experts after all. we learned so many good things (i could elaborate more but try to keep my time here brief)
We also talked that we both had doubts- oh boy that was tough. but in the end it actually made us feel more convicted about the marriage. when we were open about it, the things that gave us doubt were only macro big things that everyone worries about- like what if we are no longer attracted to each other. things that we were able to recognize that we had such a good thing going on that level and in that just thinking and articulating this that we were already on the path to being able to work through the issues bc we could recognize and talk about it
I know I am lucky but also wanted to share that altho I present mostly funny side here, I know life is not always the laugh house
vibes to those going through the trenches. I send internet (((hugs)))

[oftpiste]

Postscript.

I'm compelled to say my ranting and Fuck You's are much less about the system or its machinations than they are about all these people in here telling guys in pain that they're wrong to feel screwed. They're not. They feel screwed and their feelings are legit. Just like women's feelings are legit when they say they feel they're being treated inequitably. Fuck you if you suggest that because of some research paper any of these feelings are not real and demonstrable.

It's really fucked up that all these people who haven't been through it ("trenches" does not mean you've watched divorces happen from a law office or some other protected perch) lecturing others about how to get through an awful experience or keep a relationship afloat. It's easy to see who has relevant experience in this thread. They're the compassionate voices.

All kinds of people get fucked over spiritually, emotionally and financially. Some of them deserve it, some don't. Some guys are assholes, some women are assholes. Both genders are subject to trauma, illness - mental and otherwise, depression, addiction and other forms of change without notice that destroy relationships, even those which - to the rest of the world - appear bulletproof.

I suspect the majority of men in here truly desired a reasonable conclusion financially. I doubt they were interested in getting more than their shares, reasonably evaluated. Experientially and anecdotally, in the immediacy of a divorce in a no-fault state, and in the demographic range that is likely predominant in this TGR venue men do tend to get the short end. If it is the spouse who is responsible for the end of the marriage it exponentially increases the sense of getting fucked. Women often get more time with kids even if dad has been great, and often dad is expected to continue to provide. Yes, things are changing, but that's still the predominant metric.

I suspect most if not all the splitting couples in this discussion are not comprised of people in poverty or other social or personal disadvantage. Most of them of either gender are probably reasonably well educated, and well capable of making a decent if not very good living to support themselves and their progeny. Many probably have assets that will and should be, however grudgingly, equally divided.

Hutz, please don't misquote me. I said, "ask any divorce attorney". And why do you refer to yourself as an "attorney" in quotes? Do you only play one on TV? I asked your gender to understand if it was somehow related to your position herein. I don't really understand how you read that as an irrational suggestion, and you seemed to take great offense. Does it bother you that someone thought you might be female? Why is that?

And again, have you sanctimonious types been through a divorce, as a man, in a no-fault state? If you haven't then you are not in any way entitled to pontificate on how men who have been might feel about it.

[mtngirl79]

My mother had a better job than my father when they got married.

Then he wanted to move west, and she agreed. They had equally good jobs when they settled into western Washington.

My mother was the oldest of 7 kids and her mother died when she was 12. She was responsible for way too much of the care of her younger siblings.

She never wanted to have children. She wanted to be a career woman. The reason I know this is because my father brags about that and how he bet with his buddies how long until she was pregnant.

Before my older brother was born she was fired for being pregnant... mothers didn't work. She actually sued and won a small settlement but that was pretty much the end of being a career woman for about 30 years.

She followed my dad around when he moved. She took care of the kids and the house and wasn't able to get a livable wage job again until a couple years before she passed away.

My dad was pretty abusive, and several times divorce was rolled around and she visited attorneys. When I was a teenager, it was especially bad.

Later in life, it came up that she stayed because she was scared. After talking to the lawyers, she was afraid my dad would win custody... I have no doubt he would have fought dirty. He would have done anything short of murder to keep her from getting any decent amount of money because everything was HIS.

My mother's confidence was destroyed. He ruined her self esteem, much like he ruined mine.

For so long... for basically ever men have made the rules. Hell, women have not even had the right to vote in the USA for 100 years yet.

We have to battle the Harvey Weinsteins of the world to have successful careers. We are belittled all over the media. We are objectified and held to unreasonable standards.

Building families takes a higher toll on our careers and our bodies. The family workloads are often unbalanced.

My generation was really the first generation that it was even "normal" for women to have careers.. yet, we are called golddiggers. What do you expect?

Anyone who can't see that is blind. Of course all men aren't assholes. Some men, many men here, even, are excellent. The best there is. That doesn't mean that every woman in America and the world doesn't have to live in this society and doesn't carry the weight of it.

I'm sorry for anyone suffering, I really am, but the woman hatred is disgusting and I'm not going to ignore it.

Oftpiste, your post reads like "men lives matters"

If you want me to understand your position, understand mine.

[LHutz Esq]

We don't have attorneys in Canada - we are lawyers hence I am not and never was an "attorney". I was a divorce lawyer for a long time so I have some information to convey whatever you call me.

I never said how you feel about your divorce and how the system treated you wasn't legit. I only said that most divorce lawyers men or women that I know don't share your view when they are talking amoungst themselves.

I gave you some data that supports my point and you brought up gender. Not me. I am not offended by the questioning - seeing as I was called out for chauvinistic statements in another thread - it may mean I am a balanced individual -but that gender was thought to be relevant to the information I am providing does suggest an issue. The thing is the research about who usually comes out ahead may not be correct. It may be that there are other studies that support your experience in your jurisdiction. And the studies I am aware of are old. I don't know as that is not my area anymore.

Like I said - I don't know you- this conversation is all I have to go on and so I am going to jump to unfounded conclusions about you and you me- I am fine with that.

I never meant to discount your feelings absa-fucking-lulty they are legit feelings. (Although i did kind of discount them after your first fuck you didn't I?- I hear this position from people who espouse those point of view so I do discount them out of habit). I do want to counter the argument you seem to present as universal fact. That is not to say it wasn't fact in your case.

Edit to add - I do remember studies showing how men suffer more depression and mental issues after marriage. So maybe I should have been clearer that I was focusing on financial position

[KQ]

Well that's fucking grim as all get out. Thanks.

Sorry. Read it the other day and actually didn't get all the way through because I thought it was ridiculous. Never was a cheater myself but then I've never been married though I still wouldn't cheat. Always figured if you were dating and cheating it was stupid - just break up with the person and date the other.

BTW - I have to say I've always loved your avatar.

[hatchgreenchile]

Generational gender roles have nothing to do with an individual's marriage going off the rails. OffPiste nailed it. I have nothing further to offer. As a father of a beautiful daughter, and a husband who proactively works at a healthy marriage, I've got some ideas, but I'll reserve those for a barstool after hearing someone's story in person.

We can now return to the TGR201 "Contemporary Feminist Theory" thread jack. Thanks.

[mtngirl79]

Generational gender roles have nothing to do with an individual's marriage going off the rails. OffPiste nailed it. I have nothing further to offer. As a father of a beautiful daughter, and a husband who proactively works at a healthy marriage, I've got some ideas, but I'll reserve those for a barstool after hearing someone's story in person.

We can now return to the TGR201 "Contemporary Feminist Theory" thread jack. Thanks.

If there wasn't misogyny going on, I wouldn't need to support the other side.

You can support your buddies through a divorce with out misogyny.

Without hatred for the ex-wife, even, because hatred will only hurt you in the end.

[Bunion 2020]

If you want me to understand your position, understand mine.

Life is a 2 way street.

Your quote and that are all that is needed.

[Kevo]

Edit- Apparently I just quoted a bunch of posts by accident.

[Meadow Skipper]

If you want me to understand your position, understand mine.

It seems to me that using essentially the same approach and argument techniques as the ones that thoroughly upset and offended you may not be the best way to move the discussion forward.

But that should work if you just want to piss off and offend - I just don't think it promotes understanding.

[oftpiste]

Oftpiste, your post reads like "men lives matters".
If you want me to understand your position, understand mine.

I absolutely understand that women have been and still are treated inequitably. I work hard at being conscious and careful about my thinking about and treatment of all women, and all people. I am so sorry that you and your family suffered such horrible abuse at the hands of an unhealthy man. I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy. It's a terrible, damaging thing to be abused no matter who or what gender you are. But that story is not what the men posting their feelings about the system here is about. The guys who write here about their suffering seem, for the most part, to be conscious, aware, thoughtful, loving, devoted spouses and fathers.

I'd argue your statement that your generation was the first for it being normal for women to have careers. My generation, one considerably farther down the age range than yours, was all over that shit. Most of my contemporaries and myself have very talented, capable and financially productive wives. Decisions are made with sacrifices from both spouses to prioritize child-rearing over money.

There is no hatred of women in my thinking or writing. From the men who are in the midst of their marital shitstorms here I don't hear any hatred either. I hear sadness and grief over what they've lost emotionally, and incredulity that they gave it their all, did all the things they thought they were supposed to do (traditional and non-traditional), were emotionally abused or otherwise betrayed by their spouses, and STILL often find themselves alone in a shitty apartment, booted out of their homes, unable to spend enough time with their children, and paying all the bills for everyone still living in the house that used be their home. Again I acknowledge these stories can be told from both genders and no one, male or female, should have to be in that position. This is generally a thread about TGR male participants' experiences.

Don't all lives matter? Men and women? Isn't the goal equality, true parity? So, yes, as much as women deserve and are legitimately entitled to be treated better and have those conversations, no one ever talks about what men go through as fathers and spouses and men. We have absolutely different issues facing us, and certainly not sexual objectification, the impact of which I can hardly begin to imagine, but we have our shit too that we keep to ourselves and about which you don't see headlines on the magazines in the checkout line. We feel like we'll be accused of misogyny if we talk about it, which clearly, is what happens as evidenced here.

Those issues are as real as yours. So yes, male lives matter as much as any lives matter.

Lastly, as much as you have suffered - and I believe you have and I am deeply compassionate for you - you (and many other commenters) have not been a man (of reasonable consciousness, self-awareness, devotion to family, healthy state of mind) who has been abandoned or betrayed in spite of best efforts to be that ideal husband that is written about by feminists then faces the system making them feel even more abandoned and betrayed.

None of this makes anyone right or wrong. What is wrong is diminishing someone's pain by invalidating what they feel, and being lectured by people who, again, don't know shit about what they're experiencing.

[mtngirl79]

I did not say my generation was the first to have careers. I said my generation was the first for it to be normal for women to have careers.

None of the "feminists" I know, and I know a lot of them hate men.

They just want to be treated as equal people not sex objects.

The outliers that hate men are no where close to as loud as the hate for women that is all over the mainstream.

So when I hear of a woman not wanting to have sex, I don't think poor husband, he deserves to get laid, I think of the wife because I know what that feels like, and I've grinned and endured it because that's what I'm suppose to do. You can't explain why because rape and abuse isn't polite conversation and there is always the undertone of was it my fault? Am I remembering or not remembering or am I believed?

And that what felt ok yesterday now isnt today because of some instant or situation that can't even be explained?

I have never met a man that was willing to appreciate what its honestly like to be female in this world.

I just want you to think about it.

[Buster Highmen]

I care, no matter how immasculine that may sound.

[Cruiser]

Mtngirl is trolling the shit out of you guys. Bravo, my dear. Bravo!

[oftpiste]

I did not say my generation was the first to have careers. I said my generation was the first for it to be normal for women to have careers.

My post is now edited to reflect your actual statement about women and careers. You're still
incorrect.

You apparently didn't read the rest of what I wrote.

No one said feminists hated men. No one said husbands deserve to get laid. And again, I refer to the men here in this thread who are suffering. Not the greater world out there, in which there is indeed much misogyny. Which is a terrible thing.

You clearly are looking for compassion and empathy. That's all anyone wants, including those here at whom you hurl accusations.