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  1. #1
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    Do you care where your Outerwear is made, or clothes in general?

    I was wondering if anyone else is paying attention to the labels on their outerwear and where your clothes are coming from? I started knocking brands last year in reviews that had tags promoting third world countries. Sure the name brand gear is rad, it works well, and even makes us look cool but at what cost?

    Up until the mid 60's we used to make almost all the clothing and textiles in the United States. Guessing this is about the time big business found out about cheap labor in foreign markets and jumped ship.

    It's interesting some of the hard good players in the industry have been able to continue to manufacture in North America however the textile industry says it's impossible.

    So would you be willing to pay say double, for a jacket made in the United States?

  2. #2
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    search Jong!

  3. #3
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    Double? No
    But what percentage of a $500 jacket is labor?
    And isnt it all made by machine anyway?

    I remember reading that a $100 running shoe costs $1 to make

    Hayduke Aug 7,1996 GS-Aug 26 2010
    HunterS March 17 09-Oct 24 14

  4. #4
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    I like my clothing made by chinese women living in north america
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  5. #5
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    price and quality trump manufacturing location. Seriously who gives a fuck? If US manufacturers can't keep up, fuck it, buy from somewhere else.

  6. #6
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    Since your modus operandi is to post trolling threads like this, get our expert input, then spam your blog acting like you did all this research on your own: I have a suggestion for you.

    Write an article about outdoor clothing made by Freeride Systems (http://www.freeridesystems.com). It is Made in USA, very high quality, excellent materials and workmanship. And the owner/CEO posts here on TGR.
    "Zee damn fat skis are ruining zee piste !" -Oscar Schevlin

    "Hike up your skirt and grow a dick you fucking crybaby" -what Bunion said to Harry at the top of The Headwaters

  7. #7
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    I care about where my outerwear is worn

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by XXX-er View Post
    I like my clothing made by chinese women living in north america
    I usually agree, though lately I've had some garments made by Chinese women in China and the quality seems equal.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harry View Post
    Since your modus operandi is to post trolling threads like this, get our expert input, then spam your blog acting like you did all this research on your own:
    nah bud, I actual care about the environment and humans-beings worldwide


    if this ain't your cup of tea, carry on. Willing to bet the industry will soon take notice...

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harry View Post
    And the owner/CEO posts here on TGR.
    i'm also the janitor




    and on another note i was at a huge sourcing show recently and it pretty much made me sick. the china manufacturers will sell me patterns from any major USA brand for free if i just order garments from them - no charge for the patterns. most here would be familiar with the brands i saw as samples and were offered up to me. i was there to forge some relations with other usa manufacturers and toured the rest of the nonsense for the hell of it acting as a potential buyer. i wont say how cheap their offers were, but they were much lower than i ever anticipated finding out..icing on cake was when one group said they opened new factory away from what had become their city factory...they said two hours by plane and then 4 more by car over rough roads to remote village.....really? anyone want to find out the truth watch "The True Cost" on netflix. it does matter when brands send the money overseas. but ski wear is just a drop in the bucket in relation to the bigger problem...everything is being made over there and with zero environmental or concerns for human dignity. i know there are some companies trumpeting their non sweatshop practices....a lot in south america being made now as well, not much difference except getting it into the states is cheaper with nafta...i will keep making my stuff in colorado and usa. our seam taping is now on par with the best overseas i am proud to say...ive worked hard to get it to this level. this year it really is awesome end blog
    Last edited by MiCol; 08-30-2015 at 08:44 PM.
    My Company: Made in Colorado SKi Clothing- check it out

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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by media310 View Post
    nah bud, I actual care about the environment and humans-beings worldwide


    if this ain't your cup of tea, carry on. Willing to bet the industry will soon take notice...
    yes, this is the movie i spoke of in last post....watch it ! its streaming on Netflix now
    My Company: Made in Colorado SKi Clothing- check it out

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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by gregL View Post
    I usually agree, though lately I've had some garments made by Chinese women in China and the quality seems equal.
    well of course doesn't matter where the chinese women running the machines live cuz they can do it in vancover or bumfcuk china its all about the amount of hair pulling the quality control guy can do
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harry View Post
    Since your modus operandi is to post trolling threads like this, get our expert input, then spam your blog acting like you did all this research on your own: I have a suggestion for you.

    Write an article about outdoor clothing made by Freeride Systems (http://www.freeridesystems.com). It is Made in USA, very high quality, excellent materials and workmanship. And the owner/CEO posts here on TGR.
    +1 on both points. It' nice to see someone competing effectively on a tilted playing field.

    Cheers,
    Thom
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by XavierD View Post
    price and quality trump manufacturing location. Seriously who gives a fuck? If US manufacturers can't keep up, fuck it, buy from somewhere else.
    and attitudes like that is whats bringing humanity back to the dark-ages...

    Quote Originally Posted by MiCol
    everything is being made over there and with zero environmental or concerns for human dignity. i know there are some companies trumpeting their non sweatshop practices....a lot in south america being made now as well, not much difference except getting it into the states is cheaper with nafta...i will keep making my stuff in colorado and usa.
    Sadly a very un-american attitude. Unfortunately, since you do sound like a good guy, Ive stopped buying usa-brands because "you guys" are trying to fuck the rest of the world without consent.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by media310 View Post
    I was wondering if anyone else is paying attention to the labels on their outerwear and where your clothes are coming from? I started knocking brands last year in reviews that had tags promoting third world countries. Sure the name brand gear is rad, it works well, and even makes us look cool but at what cost?
    your 1st mistake is thinkin anyone cares who you knock
    2nd is thinkin anything can make you "cool."
    "When the child was a child it waited patiently for the first snow and it still does"- Van "The Man" Morrison
    "I find I have already had my reward, in the doing of the thing" - Buzz Holmstrom
    "THIS IS WHAT WE DO"-AML -
    ski on in eternal peace

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by rabbit View Post



    Sadly a very un-american attitude. Unfortunately, since you do sound like a good guy, Ive stopped buying usa-brands because "you guys" are trying to fuck the rest of the world without consent.
    Whether I am good or not is irrelevant, the facts speak for themselves. I disagree with your "un-American" classification and think making in the USA with better than living wages is the correct American attitude like that regarding tea in 1773. Watch "The True Cost" and see what you think after you see it. If you are not affiliated with the supply side of a product the movie will have impact and a lasting affect on you and bring a sense of disappointment with regards to choices made by American's like:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walton_family
    No more justification hiding behind shareholder value either...
    My Company: Made in Colorado SKi Clothing- check it out

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  17. #17
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    Do you care where your Outerwear is made, or clothes in general?

    I'm sorry but whenever anyone says "watch this propaganda video for the real truth" it raises major red flags.

    In response to that I say open a Econ 101 book. After you read it come back here and explain why any one with half a fucking thought would try and compete by manufacturing stateside.

  18. #18
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    ^ i guess you haven't seen it. I certainly didn't fund it and pretty sure it was crowd funded. It pretty much just lays on the line what the true cost of apparel is beyond swiping the debit/credit card at checkout . I don't think there is a shadow element on the make side of it. I didn't see any alternative offered up other than cleaning up the situation as it stands today. certainly worth the time to view imo
    My Company: Made in Colorado SKi Clothing- check it out

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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by steepconcrete View Post
    I'm sorry but whenever anyone says "watch this propaganda video for the real truth" it raises major red flags.

    In response to that I say open a Econ 101 book. After you read it come back here and explain why any one with half a fucking thought would try and compete by manufacturing stateside.
    I'd venture to say there are still people willing to buy one product over the other based on where its made. Especially when prices are close.

    I think MiCol is likely more interested in providing jobs and making a good product over sole profit. I get capitalism, just think not everyone is overly interested in lining pockets to excess.

    Make the living you want, and feel good about what you're selling..I say that's a win win.
    http://www.firsttracksonline.com

    I wish i could be like SkiFishBum

  20. #20
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    If the sole focus is on jobs you are not doing your employees any favor trying to compete at higher costs. It severely limits your growth.

    Manufacturing stateside companies just try to survive. Companies who source overseas grow and in the longer run employ more Americans because of that growth.

  21. #21
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    ^ I don't know how accurate that statement is..the historically old companies below grew US Sales with US manufacturing and when they went to expand into selling product in foreign markets , they produced some of the product here and then some in those countries .
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caterpillar_Inc.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harley-Davidson

    These are newer entities and I believe entire production is here and growing:
    http://www.mdhelicopters.com/v2/index.php
    http://blackmountaindoor.com/
    http://www.croscill.com/
    My Company: Made in Colorado SKi Clothing- check it out

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  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by MiCol View Post
    ^ I don't know how accurate that statement is..the historically old companies below grew US Sales with US manufacturing and when they went to expand into selling product in foreign markets , they produced some of the product here and then some in those countries .
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caterpillar_Inc.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harley-Davidson

    These are newer entities and I believe entire production is here and growing:
    http://www.mdhelicopters.com/v2/index.php
    http://blackmountaindoor.com/
    http://www.croscill.com/
    And I'm sure Martin guitars could not possibly move overseas.

    I'm not talking about iconic American brands or aerospace -- this is about apparel.

    I fully support what you do. I'm a organic farmer and it's similar. I have much higher inputs and costs. The yield is lower and therefore I have to get about twice as much as conventional to make it. Not everyone is willing to pay more simply to appease others ideals so my customer base is limited.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by steepconcrete View Post
    And I'm sure Martin guitars could not possibly move overseas.

    I'm not talking about iconic American brands or aerospace -- this is about apparel.

    I fully support what you do. I'm a organic farmer and it's similar. I have much higher inputs and costs. The yield is lower and therefore I have to get about twice as much as conventional to make it. Not everyone is willing to pay more simply to appease others ideals so my customer base is limited.
    I looked over my list and I knew you might say that. I left out some USA textile based companies because they are in my supply chain and I am protecting that information due to my cost of exploring and travel to find them.

    That is cool that you are an organic farmer. Obviously a lot of this hits home as your response indicates. I believe you would want to grow your operation for the simple fact of you are doing something right, you need to make a living and you cant do all the work yourself and still lead a balanced life. So, you need enough capital either derived from sales or borrowing to hire a couple of people to help you out so your yield can increase to cover costs. I am with you. I have the same issues.

    When people discover my products they buy. Letting people know I am out there is costly and guessing around to find the best medium erodes capital. The main issue I encounter is that I need more distribution to earn more dollars to grow the company. I need more people to know what I am doing. I won't borrow because I've been a slave to debt before in my life and I know that it was and is not a good thing.

    My natural inclination in 2011-12 was to turn toward retailers. They have their own issues with employee , lease, etc costs. They need to make big margins based on high real estate and employee costs. The big guys like a private equity owned Sports Authority have the stores 550+ to give you much needed cash flow with slimmer margins but they are profit pigs and won't do it unless your brand brings people in to their stores (e.g. North Face) or it is highly lucrative with immense margins (e.g. anything made cheap). And this is the story of how specialty retail is evaporating as a distribution source much like the independent grocers you could or would have been able to sell through. Luckily for you , you may be able to penetrate Whole Foods or a local equivalent.

    People given the choice and education that you exist would rather buy your products. I would. I do. Sure you need to be competitively priced to help people buy what you grow over a GMO factory farm or for me slave labor and ecological dumping. But , it is expensive to scale up the advertising or publicity to tell the story. And, there is the problem.

    p.s. i had to sell a few beloved guitars including a 40's martin 000 to fund my business. That hurt

    edit to correct some spelling not all
    Last edited by MiCol; 08-31-2015 at 09:48 AM.
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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skidog View Post
    I'd venture to say there are still people willing to buy one product over the other based on where its made. Especially when prices are close.

    I think MiCol is likely more interested in providing jobs and making a good product over sole profit. I get capitalism, just think not everyone is overly interested in lining pockets to excess.

    Make the living you want, and feel good about what you're selling..I say that's a win win.
    thanks I agree with this. no matter how nice skis i can buy now or whatever I am not a capitalist in the sense of what it really means imo i.e. the Waltons, Buffets, Koch Bros, Baine PE, hedge funds, etc, etc, even Yvonne Choinard.

    Through making sales, I might be able to buy some badly needed equipment or raw materials or even spoil myself with a nice new used car but I cant buy industries, do merger and acquisition deals, set up distribution with major retail with a few phone calls, etc I'm small potatoes but it feels right

    edit: Seems relevant , A few years ago I read an interview of a competitor Colorado brand with production in china. Two partners..they said they want to be the next North Face. I do not. To each his own. But, sometimes we all get lumped together like all we want to do is grow to the largest possible size. I do not. I want to keep living in the mountains and making a sustainable product from a pile of raw materials in the USA.
    My Company: Made in Colorado SKi Clothing- check it out

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  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by steepconcrete View Post
    I'm not talking about iconic American brands or aerospace -- this is about apparel.
    The hottest shit casualwear company at the moment makes their stuff in the USA:
    http://www.american-giant.com/
    Quote Originally Posted by Ernest_Hemingway View Post
    I realize there is not much hope for a bullfighting forum. I understand that most of you would prefer to discuss the ingredients of jacket fabrics than the ingredients of a brave man. I know nothing of the former. But the latter is made of courage, and skill, and grace in the presence of the possibility of death. If someone could make a jacket of those three things it would no doubt be the most popular and prized item in all of your closets.

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