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  1. #2201
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mofro261 View Post

    Next, tell us what evidence would be necessary to have you change your mind.
    Climate Change Deniers Present Graphic Description Of What Earth Must Look Like For Them To Believe
    Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!

  2. #2202
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkiCougar View Post
    good thing tractors only reduced the farming workforce from 30 to 23 million with more efficient and cleaner tractors producing more food for an worldwide increasing population.
    You realize this is about nitrogen emissions and not about tractors, right?

  3. #2203
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    In skougs great and unmatched wisdom? Of course not

    Sent from my SM-G950W using TGR Forums mobile app

  4. #2204
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    Quote Originally Posted by grinch View Post
    In skougs great and unmatched wisdom? Of course not
    He also implied Greta Thunberg is a poseur, which is just laughable.

  5. #2205
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    Quote Originally Posted by The AD View Post
    He also implied Greta Thunberg is a poseur, which is just laughable.
    Shes pretty much the opposite of a poseur. Her straight forwardness is what has given her speeches impact. Her aspergers plays a part in that straight forward approach. Otherwise i guess thatd be thought of a drawback but i think aspergers gives her a certain amount of credibility

    Sent from my SM-G950W using TGR Forums mobile app

  6. #2206
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mofro261 View Post
    First, give us some examples of what your positions are and why they are correct as opposed to prevailing theory.

    Next, tell us what evidence would be necessary to have you change your mind.
    You really want to keep doing this? I haven't made my positions clear? My positions aren't opposed to prevailing theory. They are opposed to the alarmist media propaganda that WMD & co can't get enough of.

  7. #2207
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    Quote Originally Posted by ron johnson View Post
    You really want to keep doing this? I haven't made my positions clear? My positions aren't opposed to prevailing theory. They are opposed to the alarmist media propaganda that WMD & co can't get enough of.
    I knew you couldn't answer those basic questions, as you have no real insights on climate issues..

    Again, what position are you defending/promoting? What evidence, in light of your current position, would make you change your mind?

    This is how science works.
    Move upside and let the man go through...

  8. #2208
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    Quote Originally Posted by ron johnson View Post
    You really want to keep doing this? I haven't made my positions clear? My positions aren't opposed to prevailing theory. They are opposed to the alarmist media propaganda that WMD & co can't get enough of.
    You mean the news?


    "The Earth just had its hottest September on record"

    STORY HIGHLIGHTSSeptember 2019 was roughly 1.02 degrees F warmer than the average from 1981-2010.
    Regions with the most markedly above average temperatures included the central and eastern USA.
    "The recent ... record-breaking temperatures is an alarming reminder of the long-term warming trend."
    The heat goes on.


    The Earth just had its warmest September on record, tying a mark set in 2016, according to data released Friday by the Copernicus Climate Change Service, a European group that measures the planet's temperatures.


    Globally, September 2019 was roughly 1.02 degrees Fahrenheit warmer than the average from 1981-2010, "making it the warmest September in our data record, although virtually on a par with 2016," the group said in a statement.


    "Regions with the most markedly above average temperatures included the central and eastern USA, the Mongolian plateau and parts of the Arctic. Much below average temperatures were only recorded in a few regions, including southwestern Russia and parts of Antarctica," the group said.


    The data continues Earth's hot streak, with June being the warmest June ever, and July the warmest month in recorded history, according to AFP. August was the second hottest August since records began. This all contributed to the warmest summer on record for the Northern Hemisphere, according to data from the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration.


    "The recent series of record-breaking temperatures is an alarming reminder of the long-term warming trend that can be observed on a global level," Copernicus Director Jean-Noel Thepaut said to AFP.


    "With continued greenhouse gas emissions and the resulting impact on global temperatures, records will continue to be broken in the future," Thepaut said.
    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...rd/3865898002/

  9. #2209
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  10. #2210
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    https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.5312066

    Coal and bitumen: Why the Norwegian pension fund is ditching the oilsands

    Norway's largest pension fund is no stranger to Alberta's oilsands, having invested in several different oil producers over the last decade including Canadian and Norwegian-based companies. Now, those investments toward ramping up production from the bitumen-rich areas of northern Alberta have come to an end.
    KLP, which has assets of about $94 billion, has sold its stocks in oilsands companies.
    In its evaluation of the oilsands, the pension fund came to the conclusion that the oil production in the Fort McMurray region was akin to the coal industry in its harmful impacts to the environment.

    "Both are very high in emissions in producing the energy or fuel and we've decided to treat them similarly," said Jeanett Bergan, KLP's head of responsible investment during a phone interview with CBC News from Jeddah, Saudi Arabia.
    "We are seeing a lot of signs in society that say 'This is not what the future will look like.'"
    Quote Originally Posted by XXX-er View Post
    the situation strikes me as WAY too much drama at this point

  11. #2211
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    Diane Kruger tho.
    No longer stuck.

    Quote Originally Posted by stuckathuntermtn View Post
    Just an uneducated guess.

  12. #2212
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    "As Sea Levels Rise, So Do Ghost Forests -- Saltwater is killing woodlands along the East Coast, sometimes surprisingly far from the sea."


    Up and down the mid-Atlantic coast, sea levels are rising rapidly, creating stands of dead trees — often bleached, sometimes blackened — known as ghost forests.

    The water is gaining as much as 5 millimeters per year in some places, well above the global average of 3.1 millimeters, driven by profound environmental shifts that include climate change.


    Increasingly powerful storms, a consequence of a warming world, push seawater inland. More intense dry spells reduce freshwater flowing outward. Adding to the peril, in some places the land is naturally sinking.


    All of this allows seawater to claim new territory, killing trees from the roots up.

    People living on the eastern shore of Chesapeake Bay, the country’s largest estuary system, have a front-row view of the sea’s rapid advance, said Keryn Gedan, a wetland ecologist at George Washington University.


    Part of the reason for the quickly rising waters may be that the Gulf Stream, which flows northward up the coast, is slowing down as meltwater from Greenland inhibits its flow. That is causing what some scientists describe as a pileup of water along the East Coast, elevating sea levels locally.


    The effects of climate change are also exacerbated by land that is sinking as a result of geological processes triggered by the end of the last ice age.


    Because of the extraordinary speed at which the water is rising here, Dr. Gedan said, “I think of this area as a window into the future for the rest of the world.”
    https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...gtype=Homepage

  13. #2213
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    RJ can’t see the forest for the trees.
    Forum Cross Pollinator, gratuitously strident

  14. #2214
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    Quote Originally Posted by WMD View Post
    "As Sea Levels Rise, So Do Ghost Forests -- Saltwater is killing woodlands along the East Coast, sometimes surprisingly far from the sea."
    "But the rising sea levels..."


  15. #2215
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mofro261 View Post
    I knew you couldn't answer those basic questions, as you have no real insights on climate issues..

    Again, what position are you defending/promoting? What evidence, in light of your current position, would make you change your mind?

    This is how science works.
    Okay, so we do this all over again. My main positions:

    1. There is no scientific consensus on how much warming humans are responsible for or how dangerous it is.

    --To change my mind I guess they could start with figuring out the climate sensitivity of CO2. But, even that won't be enough because no one can predict how the positive and negative feedbacks will interact. Which goes to show how absurd it is that people think there is a real consensus on this subject other than some blanket consensus that CO2 is a greenhouse gas and humans are warming the planet.

    2. There is nothing unusual about the climate of today compared to the climate throughout the period of human civilization (past 10,000) years.

    --There isn't anything unusual about the climate of today. MV would make the case that this is the first time the entire globe has warmed synchronously in the past 2,000 years, but I'm not buying it without more evidence. So I'd probably have to see another 1-2'C of warming in the next 50-100 years to feel that today's climate is unusual.

    3. There is no increase in extreme weather events from global warming.

    --There isn't, so I'd need to see a detectable increase over the next 50 years.

    4. The media is not objective when reporting on global warming.

    --They'd have to stop writing articles on global warming that are easily disproved.

    5. Current non carbon renewable tech cannot power the world.

    --Give me one example of a city or county running on a large mix of solar and wind with adequate storage that can be used as a model for the world.

  16. #2216
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    Quote Originally Posted by ron johnson View Post
    Okay, so we do this all over again. My main positions:

    5. Current non carbon renewable tech cannot power the world.

    --Give me one example of a city or county running on a large mix of solar and wind with adequate storage that can be used as a model for the world.
    Of course you are full of shit on all of this, but this one cracks me up the most. When you have been shown places running on renewables today, you say "that is because that place has lots of wind or geothermal or . . ." You want to be shown a model that can work everywhere, but ignore that that is what these places show. The model that works everywhere isn't the same mix of wind or solar in every place, it is to use whatever resources are available in each place. Scotland has lots of wind, so they rely on wind. Iceland has lots of hydro and geothermal potential, so that is what they use there. No one mix will work everywhere - the model is to use what is available in each place. But according to RJ that proves renewables can't work.

    "The polls now show that between 70 and 80 percent of the U.S. electorate is convinced about the realities of climate change. So, the challenge is not to persuade the last 20 or 30 percent. We don’t need them. Seventy or 80 percent support is more than we’ve had for almost any change in our political system over the life of the republic. What we need to do is to persuade those who are already convinced about the science to increase their sense of urgency, to decide that they need to work for and vote for candidates who understand this issue and are prepared to take serious action"

    https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/sto...-panel-report/

  17. #2217
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    Quote Originally Posted by ron johnson View Post
    Okay, so we do this all over again. My main positions:

    1. There is no scientific consensus on how much warming humans are responsible for or how dangerous it is.

    --To change my mind I guess they could start with figuring out the climate sensitivity of CO2. But, even that won't be enough because no one can predict how the positive and negative feedbacks will interact. Which goes to show how absurd it is that people think there is a real consensus on this subject other than some blanket consensus that CO2 is a greenhouse gas and humans are warming the planet.

    2. There is nothing unusual about the climate of today compared to the climate throughout the period of human civilization (past 10,000) years.

    --There isn't anything unusual about the climate of today. MV would make the case that this is the first time the entire globe has warmed synchronously in the past 2,000 years, but I'm not buying it without more evidence. So I'd probably have to see another 1-2'C of warming in the next 50-100 years to feel that today's climate is unusual.

    3. There is no increase in extreme weather events from global warming.

    --There isn't, so I'd need to see a detectable increase over the next 50 years.

    4. The media is not objective when reporting on global warming.

    --They'd have to stop writing articles on global warming that are easily disproved.

    5. Current non carbon renewable tech cannot power the world.

    --Give me one example of a city or county running on a large mix of solar and wind with adequate storage that can be used as a model for the world.
    What you fail to grasp is that there is no time left for navel-gazing, the time to act is NOW.
    It is that simple.
    Forum Cross Pollinator, gratuitously strident

  18. #2218
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    He doesn't grasp it, he has no intention of grasping it, his intent is just to cause discontent and confusion. He is a paid troll. He joined the board in August, and has only posted in this thread. This is the type of poster that should get a swift kick in the ass right off the board.
    sigless.

  19. #2219
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    Quote Originally Posted by rideit View Post
    What you fail to grasp is that there is no time left for navel-gazing, the time to act is NOW.
    It is that simple.
    It really is that simple - the Ant and the Grasshopper because we don't want:


    Name:  SOOH.jpg
Views: 208
Size:  12.5 KB
    When you see something that is not right, not just, not fair, you have a moral obligation to say something. To do something." Rep. John Lewis


    Kindness is a bridge between all people

    Dunkin’ Donuts Worker Dances With Customer Who Has Autism

  20. #2220
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    Quote Originally Posted by WMD View Post
    Of course you are full of shit on all of this, but this one cracks me up the most. When you have been shown places running on renewables today, you say "that is because that place has lots of wind or geothermal or . . ." You want to be shown a model that can work everywhere, but ignore that that is what these places show. The model that works everywhere isn't the same mix of wind or solar in every place, it is to use whatever resources are available in each place. Scotland has lots of wind, so they rely on wind. Iceland has lots of hydro and geothermal potential, so that is what they use there. No one mix will work everywhere - the model is to use what is available in each place. But according to RJ that proves renewables can't work.
    Every so called 'example' you have tried to show me is an outlier because they have a competitive advantage with certain renewable energy sources. Like Scotland with wind, or Iceland with geothermal. On top of that, none of the examples you've given me have any sort of adequate storage, which is the number 1 problem with a 100% non carbon renewable energy system.

    I'm well aware that the renewable mix is going to differ based on location, but you seem to be missing the fact that much of the country lacks significant hydro and geothermal, and isn't especially suitable for solar or wind. I think you would agree that any 100% non carbon renewable energy system in the US is going to be largely dependent on wind and solar. All I'm asking for is to see an example of a location with a climate/resource base comparable to much of the US powered by 100% non carbon renewables. Is it too much to ask to run a national 2 year pilot program in a liberal city with a large appetite for green tech like Boulder or Portland? As far as I'm aware, like much of the US, neither city has abundant hydro, geothermal, solar, or wind. It makes a ton of sense to create a smaller model like this to analyze for potential shortcomings, before jumping into a massive national buildout.

  21. #2221
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    Quote Originally Posted by rideit View Post
    What you fail to grasp is that there is no time left for navel-gazing, the time to act is NOW.
    It is that simple.
    Right, there is nothing unusual about the present climate, there is no consensus on what the future climate will look like, but we have to act NOW!

    And don't forget, even if the US stopped all carbon emissions tomorrow, there would be no detectable reduction in temperatures by 2100, but we have to act NOW!

  22. #2222
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    Here’s the deal, Ron.
    As stated above, you are a paid troll.
    However, you are really terrible at your job, as you have convinced no one, and, in fact, have actually hardened many people’s positions.
    Unless, of course, that is your true (psy-ops) intended goal, in which case, Mazeltov, you are a master!
    Either way,
    I like tits.
    Forum Cross Pollinator, gratuitously strident

  23. #2223
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    Quote Originally Posted by ron johnson View Post
    Right, there is nothing unusual about the present climate, there is no consensus on what the future climate will look like, but we have to act NOW!

    And don't forget, even if the US stopped all carbon emissions tomorrow, there would be no detectable reduction in temperatures by 2100, but we have to act NOW!


    All of the above have been destroyed as bullshit over and over. Posting it again doesn't change that. Take a lap and read the entire thread again.
    Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!

  24. #2224
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    Ron and his masters are desperate as they see the tide of public opinion has finally turned against them. Their lies no longer work and we are no longer going to let them fuck the planet for their profits.

    Ron is the Hail Mary for climate deniers. This is the final flurry before the denial funding dries up.

    Where do you like to ride Ron? You never answered...

  25. #2225
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    Quote Originally Posted by rideit View Post
    Here’s the deal, Ron.
    As stated above, you are a paid troll.
    However, you are really terrible at your job, as you have convinced no one, and, in fact, have actually hardened many people’s positions.
    Unless, of course, that is your true (psy-ops) intended goal, in which case, Mazeltov, you are a master!
    Either way,
    I like tits.
    If there is one thing I've learned more than anything else from this discussion, it's that people are are incredibly closed off to any POV that differs to their own.

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