Page 17 of 146 FirstFirst ... 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 ... LastLast
Results 401 to 425 of 3644
  1. #401
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    underground
    Posts
    935
    Quote Originally Posted by Benny Profane View Post
    Here is an example of the fanatical and incorrect reporting from the disaster industry that really bugs me.


    A Heat Wave Tests Europe’s Defenses. Expect More. https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/01/c...heat-wave.html


    "It is part of an unmistakable trend: The hottest summers in Europe in the last 500 years have all come in the last 17 years. "

    I mean, 500 years. Really? 500 years ago was 1519. Was there anybody, anywhere in Europe recording the temperature every day? I don't think so. What kind of instruments did they have? The thermometer wasn't even invented until 1714, so there goes at This just has to stop. I'm not saying that climate change doesn't exist, but, this Trumpian level evidence reporting is absurd
    Because there’s no way to determine past temperatures unless somebody was there with a thermometer. Un possible. Without thermometers there can be no temperature. Ipso fucking facto.



    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

  2. #402
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Looking down
    Posts
    50,491
    Quote Originally Posted by ms ann thrope View Post
    Because there’s no way to determine past temperatures unless somebody was there with a thermometer. Un possible. Without thermometers there can be no temperature. Ipso fucking facto.



    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
    So, how are they accurately determined?

    Please, no tree rings. Just, don't .

  3. #403
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    on the banks of Fish Creek
    Posts
    7,514
    Wha chu gots aginst tree rings old man?

  4. #404
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    The Bull City
    Posts
    14,003
    Quote Originally Posted by Benny Profane View Post
    So, how are they accurately determined?

    Please, no tree rings. Just, don't .
    study of radiocarbon-dated box core data from marine sediments

    examination of mollusc growth patterns

    A reconstruction based on ice cores

    data from botany, historical document research and meteorology, combined with records indicating prevailing temperature and rainfall

    examining spatial patterns of surface temperatures shown in multi-proxy reconstructions

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medieval_Warm_Period
    And tree rings. All independent data sources that reflect similar insights and corroboration of the other independent data sources.
    Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!

  5. #405
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Looking down
    Posts
    50,491
    I said accurately determined.

  6. #406
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    champlain valley
    Posts
    5,656
    Quote Originally Posted by ms ann thrope View Post
    Because there’s no way to determine past temperatures unless somebody was there with a thermometer. Un possible. Without thermometers there can be no temperature. Ipso fucking facto.



    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
    oye vey.

    paleo temperatures are modeled off of co2 percentages in ice cores between the holocene and the pliestocene. i think there are also isotopic analysis and growth rates for coral.

  7. #407
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Looking down
    Posts
    50,491
    There is no e in oy.

  8. #408
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    champlain valley
    Posts
    5,656
    i'm a goy

  9. #409
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    champlain valley
    Posts
    5,656
    i feel dirty but i like it

  10. #410
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    champlain valley
    Posts
    5,656
    Quote Originally Posted by liv2ski View Post
    So according to this: https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/v...ple-to-therapy there are 12 years left to change our ways before it becomes to late to meaningfully change course on climate change.
    While the discussion is pretty doom and gloom, I still find it hard to imagine that society will become so disrupted that the lights go out and mankind is reduced to a state we existed in hundreds of years ago. What am I missing here? Global nuclear war?
    eventually the world will go for geo engineering or a consortium of nations will shove it down the world's throat backed by big fucking bombs

  11. #411
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Wyoming
    Posts
    1,624
    So now we know the answer: If a tree falls in a forest and no one was around to hear it, it didn't make a sound.

    Or just read this: https://www.theguardian.com/environm...rature-proxies

  12. #412
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    truckee
    Posts
    23,120
    Quote Originally Posted by Benny Profane View Post
    Here is an example of the fanatical and incorrect reporting from the disaster industry that really bugs me.


    A Heat Wave Tests Europe’s Defenses. Expect More. https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/01/c...heat-wave.html


    "It is part of an unmistakable trend: The hottest summers in Europe in the last 500 years have all come in the last 17 years. "

    I mean, 500 years. Really? 500 years ago was 1519. Was there anybody, anywhere in Europe recording the temperature every day? I don't think so. What kind of instruments did they have? The thermometer wasn't even invented until 1714, so there goes at least 200 years, although doubtful that they were immediately distributed out all over Europe with somebody recording it's readings every day , right? That probably took another 200 years. So, this is just a lie, but, to be polite, an exaggeration. And I see it happen all the time, and read it in "respected" publications like the NYT. Hell, I read somebody blame the Notre Dame fire in that paper on "climate change". Really. This just has to stop. I'm not saying that climate change doesn't exist, but, this Trumpian level evidence reporting is absurd
    Benny--just because you don't understand something that doesn'tmean it's wrong. Just because you only know how to tell temperature with a thermometer doesn't mean other people can't tell temperature other ways. I can't do a backflip--therefore no one can. C'mon, I thought you were smarter than that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kenny Satch View Post
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GujLcfdovE8

    I find what Dr. Judith Curry is saying very disturbing.

    If the science is not open to scurtinity then how can it be considered reliable? This Funding is everything approach is concerning. When will it stop. Never again if this is the new approach to science. Mind you I'm not a scientist worrying about keeping my job.
    Science has always been this way--it is imperfect because it is done by human beings. But science continues to test and reassess and sometimes overturn orthodoxy, maybe not as quickly as one would like but it happens. The pendulum swing of theory is well known in medicine. There is an orthodoxy, nothing that contradicts it is funded or published, until one day someone produces as contradictory theory with evidence so compelling it cannot be ignored. Suddenly there is a new orthodoxy and work supporting the old orthodoxy can't get funded or published--until one day it becomes the new new orthodoxy, and on and on. Practice medicine long enough and you see ideas that you thought were long dead come back to life.

    Group think never works.
    Name:  330px-Nagasakibomb.jpg
Views: 336
Size:  34.5 KB

    OK, maybe it does

  13. #413
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Ontario Canada eh
    Posts
    4,380
    OG I get how new findings can change theories but this "tow the line because this is our new cash cow or else" approach needs to stop
    Shame, like the media it was better when it wasn't about the money but about the work. Taking a claim and working to verify it or to say "at this time we don't know or we can't not verify our sources to give a factual conclusion"
    Politicians want the next wave of Taxation and science too along with multinational corporations that ultimately benefit from the contracts from such monies. What Al Gore started wasn't going away because the plan was to make willing participants pay a new tax. Start them off young because the demographic of millennials with soon out vote even other demographic.
    The trap was set long before the message was politicized and exploited.

  14. #414
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Looking down
    Posts
    50,491
    Quote Originally Posted by old goat View Post
    Benny--just because you don't understand something that doesn'tmean it's wrong. Just because you only know how to tell temperature with a thermometer doesn't mean other people can't tell temperature other ways. I can't do a backflip--therefore no one can. C'mon, I thought you were smarter than that.

    Ok, then, how do you tell temperature accurately "other ways"? Accurately. I say that, because the reporter used two specific numbers. 500 years, and 17 years, so she's not generalising. Tree rings and ice cores are not as accurate as modern instruments. There's a range, right? And how can that evidence ever be proven? It's just speculation, right?

  15. #415
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Posts
    2,100
    Quote Originally Posted by Benny Profane View Post
    Ok, then, how do you tell temperature accurately "other ways"? Accurately. I say that, because the reporter used two specific numbers. 500 years, and 17 years, so she's not generalising. Tree rings and ice cores are not as accurate as modern instruments. There's a range, right? And how can that evidence ever be proven? It's just speculation, right?
    https://www.scientificamerican.com/a...-temperatures/

  16. #416
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    The Bull City
    Posts
    14,003
    We don't need to know the exact temperature everywhere at every second for all of history to get reasonably, statistically significant estimates of average global or regional temperatures.
    Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!

  17. #417
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    on the banks of Fish Creek
    Posts
    7,514
    Quote Originally Posted by Benny Profane View Post
    It's a new religion fueled by tenure and academic ambition. "Skeptic" is the new heretic.

    It’s snowing in Mexico in the summer. 6 fucking feet of it. Something ain’t fucking right.....

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...ce/1616199001/

    Name:  2CBBA9C3-F8F8-47DF-94D8-361FE098C89F.jpeg
Views: 342
Size:  82.4 KB

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	36F073C6-D633-48C7-92D9-D9204B71606F.jpeg 
Views:	338 
Size:	106.7 KB 
ID:	287440

    Had to send in the freakin’ army dudes for shovel duty...

    Name:  E58D67E8-29C6-4C8F-97B5-880656C18072.jpeg
Views: 341
Size:  53.0 KB




    fuck them tree rings though

  18. #418
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Looking down
    Posts
    50,491
    Ok, but, here's the thing. First, from that:

    "trapped in deep ice cores are tiny bubbles of ancient air, which we can extract and analyze using mass spectrometers. Temperature, in contrast, is not measured directly, but is instead inferred from the isotopic composition of the water molecules released by melting the ice cores."

    Now, I'm not disputing that we can figure out a general idea of historical climate from this method, although I'm a tad skeptical that's it's valid going back a million years and for an area much larger than the region they take these samples, but, again, what is the range of temperatures that we're talking about, you know, beyond "cool", "cold", or, "warm"? Nobody gives me a number, because, well, they can't. But, we're comparing that data set, if it is a data set, with present day records, which are infinitely more accurate. The person who wrote this article specifically said "It is part of an unmistakable trend: The hottest summers in Europe in the last 500 years have all come in the last 17 years." Those are numbers. And they have no real basis. We have no idea how hot it was in Paris in 1519, other than, maybe, well, "pretty hot", or, "mild", or something.

  19. #419
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    The Cone of Uncertainty
    Posts
    49,306


    I don't think that bus is gonna come for a while.

  20. #420
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    The Bull City
    Posts
    14,003
    So, everything the science community knows about how elements and laws of physics behave under different temperature scenarios tells us that recent climate is doing things to those elements beyond what the most extreme heats of the past did to those elements. And dating samples tells us when those past extremes occurred. We can infer past extreme temps based on preserved samples of those elements. Are we fishing for another explanation? Or, are we just trying to poison the well with whatabboutism?
    Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!

  21. #421
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    I can still smell Poutine.
    Posts
    24,509
    Oh, they are definitely trying to poison the well.

  22. #422
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Sandy, Utah
    Posts
    14,410
    What say ye to the fact that the oldest ice core sample ever pulled is 2.7 million years old, yet earth is like 4.5Billion years old...lots of millions in a billion....what was happening before 2.7 million years ago? Could there be answers there too? we dont know what we dont know...

  23. #423
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Posts
    2,100
    Quote Originally Posted by Benny Profane View Post
    Ok, but, here's the thing. First, from that:

    "trapped in deep ice cores are tiny bubbles of ancient air, which we can extract and analyze using mass spectrometers. Temperature, in contrast, is not measured directly, but is instead inferred from the isotopic composition of the water molecules released by melting the ice cores."

    Now, I'm not disputing that we can figure out a general idea of historical climate from this method, although I'm a tad skeptical that's it's valid going back a million years and for an area much larger than the region they take these samples, but, again, what is the range of temperatures that we're talking about, you know, beyond "cool", "cold", or, "warm"? Nobody gives me a number, because, well, they can't. But, we're comparing that data set, if it is a data set, with present day records, which are infinitely more accurate. The person who wrote this article specifically said "It is part of an unmistakable trend: The hottest summers in Europe in the last 500 years have all come in the last 17 years." Those are numbers. And they have no real basis. We have no idea how hot it was in Paris in 1519, other than, maybe, well, "pretty hot", or, "mild", or something.
    Just because your cat can't argue back doesnt mean you should come here with MAGA-chud levels of obtuseness.

  24. #424
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    shadow of HS butte
    Posts
    6,398
    Quote Originally Posted by SumJongGuy View Post
    So, everything the science community knows about how elements and laws of physics behave under different temperature scenarios tells us that recent climate is doing things to those elements beyond what the most extreme heats of the past did to those elements. And dating samples tells us when those past extremes occurred. We can infer past extreme temps based on preserved samples of those elements. Are we fishing for another explanation? Or, are we just trying to poison the well with whatabboutism?
    Give up the straw man dude, that’s not what he’s talking about ferchristsakes.

  25. #425
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Posts
    2,100
    Quote Originally Posted by east or bust View Post
    Give up the straw man dude, that’s not what he’s talking about ferchristsakes.
    Yes it is. Bunny doesn't understand the science behind ice core sampling so he doesn't believe it because it doesn't rely on what he understands, thermometers. A couple people send him reading material explaining ice core sampling, Bunny still needs human attention, Bunny continues to argue.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •