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Thread: Law in a ski town
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06-15-2015, 06:29 PM #1Registered User
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Law in a ski town
Just took the LSAT. Planning on starting law school in the fall of 2016.
Looking for advice in regards to:
- Schools that can help me get into a ski town after grad.
- Jobs after graduation in ski towns
- What is the best focus of study with this in mind?
- How hard is it to be succesful in the SLC area if you aren't LDS?
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06-15-2015, 06:37 PM #2
This seems like a good place to cross-reference this thread:
https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/s...d-feel-trapped
How badly do you want to be a lawyer and do the day-to-day work of practicing law?
Have you ever worked in a law firm? internship, anything?
Are your law school plans driven by the idea of "3 years of grad school = job with lots of money!" or by the idea or "I've always wanted to be a lawyer and it is my lifelong dream and nothing less can satisfy me!"
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06-15-2015, 06:55 PM #3Registered User
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I grew up in a family of Lawyers and Judges, so I know what i'm in for. With out a doubt it won't be lucrative in the ski town environment with out getting creative. I'm just looking for a career path that can provide some type of substantial income in said environment.
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06-15-2015, 07:10 PM #4Registered User
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I am LDS and went to law school at BYU over 10 years ago, so what I say may be outdated. Take it with a grain of salt.
Non-LDS can definitely be successful in SLC. The larger firms in SLC only recruit the top 10% of students from UT law schools as they get plenty of LDS kids that went to Tier 1 law schools. Smaller firms tend to take lower down the class rank. As you know, hiring in firms is terrible and will likely not be better by the time you graduate. Having a connection to a job before you go to school will be key. Leverage your family connections as best you can. Once you have established yourself, work your way into the ideal location.
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06-15-2015, 07:31 PM #5Registered User
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Thank you!
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06-15-2015, 08:44 PM #6
1) Follow teenage snowboarders down the WROD on opening day.
2) Hand out business cards to carnage victims.
3) Profit !"Zee damn fat skis are ruining zee piste !" -Oscar Schevlin
"Hike up your skirt and grow a dick you fucking crybaby" -what Bunion said to Harry at the top of The Headwaters
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06-16-2015, 02:18 PM #7
Since El Chup got the welcome wagon out of the way...
Assuming you're taking out loans, consider specializing in attending school and learning about public law in the state in which you want to practice. Then get a government job/non-profit job after you graduate and get on PSLF. Hours are way better than private practice, and there are city attorney/county counsel/agency attorney jobs in every county in the country. That said, you're locking yourself into public/non-profit practice for at least ten years post-grad if you want the PSLF payoff. That's a long time to be contemplating before you've even gone to school.
Good private practice positions that enable you to pay off big student loan debt are almost non-existent in true ski towns unless you land at a top 5-10 school. And even then your odds are very long. SLC, Denver, etc. are obviously different.
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06-16-2015, 02:21 PM #8
Paging Hutch
“How does it feel to be the greatest guitarist in the world? I don’t know, go ask Rory Gallagher”. — Jimi Hendrix
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06-16-2015, 03:33 PM #9
The whole country has too many lawyers.Do something useful
“THE EDGE, there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over.” HST
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06-16-2015, 05:32 PM #10
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06-18-2015, 03:19 PM #11
Serious question: have you asked your family of lawyers whether or not this is a good idea? It's not that I'd actively dissuade any reasonably smart or hard-working person from doing it, but it's tough out there. If you can go to a very good school and incur little debt, or if you have a reasonably lucrative job lined up (family business, say, or an employer who promises to take you back once you're done), that's one thing. Otherwise, you're talking about spending a lot of money- not just the loans, but also whatever salary you've forgone by not working for those three years- for an education that the market does not seem to value highly these days. The general consensus among partners at my old firm was that they would not want their kids going to law school and graduating into this market, and these were people who'd been pretty successful in this thing called rap. Sorry, I meant law. Whatever.
Not to further piss on your parade, but "knowing what you're in for" isn't the same as knowing whether or not you'll like it. If you have these family connections, I urge you to use them to find a paralegal job and spend a year or two working in a law office to get some firsthand experience. Not only will that inform your decision immensely, but it'll give you a bunch of connections and maybe even a job (even if it's only a minimum wage gig during your 1L summer, which is a damn sight better than what a lot of 1Ls end up doing).
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06-18-2015, 03:38 PM #12....................
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06-18-2015, 03:44 PM #13
^real talk
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06-18-2015, 04:08 PM #14....................
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But seriously, I am hiring for an associate in Park City. 2-3 years out, 50/50 real estate litigation and real estate transactions.
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06-19-2015, 07:40 AM #15
^^^ I would think that would be a lifetime of work given the PC RE market.
I have been in this State for 30 years and I am willing to admit that I am part of the problem.
"Happiest years of my life were earning < $8.00 and hour, collecting unemployment every spring and fall, no car, no debt and no responsibilities. 1984-1990 Park City UT"
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06-19-2015, 08:04 AM #16
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06-19-2015, 10:11 AM #17Registered User
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My wife's cousin is a very successful lawyer in bumfuck Indiana. He offered his vastly underemployed nephew lawyer, still living with his parents, a $100K to start, to move there from Minneapolis.
Nope.
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06-19-2015, 01:32 PM #18....................
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06-19-2015, 07:00 PM #19Registered User
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from what little I know about proffesional carriers, well there isn't shit going on ski town for a lawyer, well but real estate crap and subdividing land and suing the gov't when they won't let you do what you want
then again if you specialize in these areas you might have a chance
divorce
immigration
drunk driving arrests
drug possesion
general supidity that is usually defeneded by a public defender unless your daddy is rich
good luck
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06-20-2015, 01:02 PM #20
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06-20-2015, 07:01 PM #21Registered User
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06-23-2015, 12:16 PM #22
This is pretty good. The job market now is better than it was in 2012, but the gains are mostly at the high end (i.e. BigLaw seems to be hiring at a decent clip, especially for IP lawyers). The middle market is still having a tough time.
The author's comments on the tried and not-true line of thought that says "with a law degree, you can do anything/work in any field" could use a little refinement, IMO. Of course, many lawyers go on to work in non-legal capacities in one industry or another, but you get those jobs through the expertise and connections gained during representation. A J.D. can be a great entree into working in the financial sector, in technology, in healthcare, wherever, but you have to get some industry knowledge through your practice first. If there's a particular industry in which you are interested, at least take a shot at getting in and working your way up. Saying "I'm going to go to law school, then spend six years as an associate, then go in house in [industry x], then transition to a non-legal role" is a plan, for sure, but leaves a lot to chance when you could just get an entry level job in that industry and take a lot less time than 9+ years to get to the same place.
Really- any ski town that needs more than a handful of real estate studs like Hutch and a few civil litigators is big enough to have a real economy outside of skiing, at which point you might well be better off getting a decent job working in whatever industry it is that sustains the non-lawyer locals.
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08-04-2015, 12:43 PM #23Registered User
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Have you seen the employment stats on new lawyers vs. school costs lately? It sucks. Cross that with a ski town and what a dumb career move that would be. Take the same money and become a ski town plumber. I live in a ski town and every local lawyer is doing dull ass piddly stuff, contracts, real estate, etc.
Now, what might make sense is lawschool, big city, big career in a very specialized field then move to ski town at the age of 40 or 50 and make big city money doing intellectually challenging work while chilling in a mtn town. Your kids will be the primary beneficiaries but I know a few neighbors who do that.
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08-04-2015, 05:40 PM #24Banned
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Seems like a ski town is perfect for a slimy attorney who preys on those who get DUIs.
Get some badass marketing that is geared towards the local skiers and charge them all $1,500 for a DUI case. Work for approximately 30mins on each of them and you're probably making some decent money.
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08-05-2015, 02:25 PM #25
I'm not a lawyer but my brother is and I live in a ski town and know many lawyers here and i can say two things:
1) all this advice mirrors everything any lawyer has ever told me about career choice/satisfaction
2) -All the successful lawyers (who made good money) I've known in the ten years I've lived in Aspen worked as much as any lawyer in a big firm in a big city trying to make partner
-didn't ski much at lunch
-all of them worked in RE law (divorce or water law would be other viable options)
-I can't think of any who came here fresh out of law school. I'm not saying its impossible but all the lawyers I've known that worked at small firms with reasonable schedule demands came here later in their career and had some connections that got them the job. The ones who came here younger usually still had connections but are working at satellite offices of bigger firms that still expect lots of 70-80+ hour weeks and don't give a shit that you moved here to ski.Last edited by Joey Joe Joe Junior Shabadoo; 08-05-2015 at 02:36 PM.
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