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Thread: Law in a ski town
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08-05-2015, 03:12 PM #26
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02-23-2016, 08:36 AM #27Registered User
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Don't become a lawyer...please, I beg you...unless you really really want to practice law. There are much more balanced, fulfilling things you can do with your life.
I'm saying this from experience. I was fortunate enough to go to a top school and do well...I graduated with about 235K in debt, just from law school..Did the big firm thing in NYC, then Denver, trying to pay it off. That amount of debt is crippling. Still managed to get out and ski a good amount...but guess what, I was never going to make it at a firm..not with that approach. The profession is a grind fest, generally, trust me. Attorneys just get used to it...and don't really know any other way, after a few years.
Lawyers are generally not a chill bunch. Yeah, they exist, but the overall community is one that relishes in the "misery loves company" mentality. Now, I've managed to ski a good amount as a lawyer, but as a result, there's a big trade off on the work end...won't go to far as an attorney with that approach.
I'm not saying don't go..but make sure you think realllly really hard about the choice (i.e. student debt, law is a very demanding profession...one that doesn't value free time, oversupply of attorneys, difficult to practice in small towns). Don't go to law school because you think it will give you options. That's a bullshit statement that parents like to throw around.
I can't tell you how many friends I had that were fun, low key guys living in ski towns, that are now doing the city grind as lawyers, and have lost site of what the really valued. Don't think they didn't also go into law school thinking they'd go work in ski towns afterwards.
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02-23-2016, 09:00 AM #28Registered User
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Lawyer who lives 2 hours from 10+ ski areas here and gets in 25 days or so...
I don't practice law. I work in house at a huge company. I make more than most of my classmates. I work half the hours. Still pay 800 a month on my student loans. I have a family life. I'm happy.
If I was still in insurance defense I might have jumped off a building by now.
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02-23-2016, 10:48 AM #29
As a lawyer... I agree.
For anyone reading this thread and considering law school and "practicing law in a ski town," IMHO your best bet is going to be practicing law in a town or city that is reasonably close to skiing, and not a "ski town." Salt Lake City, for example, rather than trying to practice law in Telluride.
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02-23-2016, 11:02 AM #30
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02-23-2016, 11:06 AM #31
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02-23-2016, 11:09 AM #32
Lawyers: Three times as likely to suffer clinical depression as the general population. Twice as likely to become an addict as the general population. Over three times as likely to commit suicide as the general population. Suicide is the third leading cause of death among lawyers. And the rewards? Thanks to bimodal salary distribution, half the attorneys in private practice are grinding themselves out like an old cigarette for $72K or less. Why do they stay in it? Because if you wash out of law, you are truly fucked. Corporate head hunters don't think of failed lawyers as good team players. The line that a law degree takes you anywhere is just marketing for law schools. It's total bullshit because a J.D. barely prepares you to practice law. Yeah, you can do jobs that don't require a law degree but then why would you sink three years and $150,000 into a superfluous degree? My personal opinion: if you have the smarts, charisma and family connections that would make you a successful attorney and you really want to make money in a ski town, become a dirt pimp. That's the #1 economy in any resort community. If you are a good closer, dirt pimpin is way easier work than lawyering.
Last edited by neckdeep; 02-23-2016 at 11:42 AM.
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02-23-2016, 11:24 AM #33
I had to google that -- interesting.
http://abovethelaw.com/2012/07/start...own-the-drain/
It's what I suspected was true, but I'd never looked into it. For old times comparison sake, I got out of law school in 1998 with about $50K debt, and my first job paid $42K. Bumped to around $49K the next year, then I changed firms the following year and got something like $60K. I was definitely in that first curve of the bimodal chart.
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02-23-2016, 11:36 AM #34
Believe me, I thought about it. They listed a position right around the time I got hired at my current job too. They were counsel for another defendant on a small residential sale non-disclosure suit in Truckee that I worked on a few years back. Brian Hanley was the assigned attorney. Very nice guy. And I've gotten the impression that it's a nice place to work. Ran into somebody while climbing Cathedral Peak a few years back that was buddies with one of the name partners and had nothing but good things to say about him.
That said, my current public sector gig is worth ~$25k year in loan stuff. Plus all the other great benefits and reasonable salary. I see moving to a Sac-based public agency job, or Placer/Nevada/El Dorado County Counsel as likely in the next two or so years. Once I'm out from under the loans (circa nine years), I could see taking a job there as an of counsel and maybe even working on partner long-term, depending on billable expectations. Goddamn it's nice not to have to think about that shit.
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02-23-2016, 01:23 PM #35
One ex-Biglaw friend teaches elementary school now. Another is a real estate agent in SF. In fact, there are a number of RE agents/brokers with law degrees. (I used to do RE work, see above.) RE folks can make bank in affluent areas if they're good salespeople. The legal background helps with marketing for sure if you have it. There are a LOT of boneheads in that industry that make pretty damn good money.
I interviewed for a land use/public advocacy/local government lobbyist-type position with NRG Solar 18 months ago. Not law per se. Paid ~$140K IIRC.
Keep the chin up dude. I agree with neckdeep to the extent that the degree itself doesn't "open doors," as law school employment offices like to bullshit to impressionable 23 year-olds. But I disagree that you can't move to something outside of law if you have the right experience and look in the right places. Referral to that NRG Solar interview was via a friend of a friend who I'd drank with once or twice and had some really great chairlift conversations with on a random day at Squaw. If you're thinking you want to get out of law, or honestly, advance your career in general, remember that those kinds of opportunities arise from places you don't expect.
And, maybe you just haven't found the right legal job? It took me five years from graduation before I found a position (the one I'm in now) where I wasn't compulsively checking listings on a daily basis. I actually had one about a year out, but I was only there for 11 months before I got laid off and the firm went under six months later. (That was 2011.) I sent out dozens and dozens of applications. Cold emailed and had coffee and networked with a lot of people. And then, funny enough, got hired here based on the standard application process on my second time applying (a year after the first).
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02-23-2016, 01:30 PM #36
seems like a ski town would always have work for a real estate agent slash property lawyer
not that you'd have time to ski
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02-23-2016, 01:45 PM #37
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02-23-2016, 07:06 PM #38
And then there's this guy
http://unofficialnetworks.com/2015/1...et-heli-skiing
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02-27-2016, 11:39 AM #39Registered User
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As others have stated, if your goal is to move to a ski town and you don't have any real marketable skills: become a dirt pimp.
If your goal is to come to a ski town and own your own successful business and be able to ski.....Become a roofer, master plumber, or electrician and open up your shop and build a book of business.
10 years in Aspen makes me wonder why wasn't I a tradesman for construction friends during those Ohio summers. Would have learned a real skill that makes money, and is transferrable to these mountain communities.
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