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  1. #51
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    [QUOTE=spanky] It's like riding a bike... [QUOTE]

    Double word!

    I found a deal on a Gemini about two weeks post-op that I couldn't pass up. Ride ready 7" bike for $900. It sat in my living room, no pedals on it so as not to create temptation, all fucking summer taunting me. Finally lent it to Basom just to get it out of my sight for a while.

    This past Friday was 16 weeks post-op. Surgeon, nurse-practitioner, and PT folk all cleared me to go riding. Said I had no concerns about wear and stress on the shoulder just from uneven terrain. Only concern is no trauma to my arm in the upright and back position- so I can't take a ganrly spill. So I go slow- new 8" rotors make it easy. Anyway, I've ridden 4 of the last 7 days, my shoulder is rediculously sore- but stable! Its so nice I can't even explain.

    Word to rehab.

    Stay High- If no insurance, go to a gym and either ask nicely and get lucky or straight up pay a personal trainer for one session of advice. A solid program will be planned out for you. A few insuranceless friends have done just this and done great on their own. Good luck.
    Last edited by biggins; 10-01-2005 at 12:51 PM.

  2. #52
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    Talking

    Can I borrow your bike now?

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by biggins

    Word to rehab.

    Stay High- If no insurance, go to a gym and either ask nicely and get lucky or straight up pay a personal trainer for one session of advice. A solid program will be planned out for you. A few insuranceless friends have done just this and done great on their own. Good luck.
    This sounds like a good idea. Also if you can find a trainer that is also a Physical Therapist even better. Probably would be able to extend your range of motion a little by "popping" a few of the lesions which may have developed and still keep the shoulder tight in the labrium if you find a good PT/Trainer. I did a go back after a few months of stopping PT after my second surgery and was glad I did.
    "Don't drive angry."

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  4. #54
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    Minor Update-

    Have hit a bit of a PT plateau- getting really frustrated only lifting 5/10 lbs in my excercices, but am not strong enough to up the weight. On top of this- soreness is becoming more of a daily thing than it was. I want to believe this is merely a sign of developing muscle, but man I'm wicked sore all the time.

    Otherwise no major snags- still on the bike (no falls- slow and smooth) and getting pretty stoked for a snow season with two functional wings.

    Word to balance.

    And I think I'll probably stay on a PT routine for... ever?

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by biggins
    Minor Update-

    Have hit a bit of a PT plateau- getting really frustrated only lifting 5/10 lbs in my excercices, but am not strong enough to up the weight. On top of this- soreness is becoming more of a daily thing than it was. I want to believe this is merely a sign of developing muscle, but man I'm wicked sore all the time.

    Otherwise no major snags- still on the bike (no falls- slow and smooth) and getting pretty stoked for a snow season with two functional wings.

    Word to balance.

    And I think I'll probably stay on a PT routine for... ever?
    Sorry to hear about the soreness biggins. How often are you exercising the shoulder. I'm working mine with weights 3 days/week max (and different excercises on 1 out of the 3 days). Maybe you want to rest the shoulder for a week or so.
    Because rich has nothing to do with money.

  6. #56
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    5 Months Post-Op Update (22 weeks to the day).

    I'm continuing with the rehab in the gym and the strength is building. I'm definitely not 100% yet though and keeping the weights relatively light. Specific shoulder exercises are as follows:

    Machine Shoulder Press
    Dumbbell Side Raises
    Dumbbell Front Raises
    Machine Reverse Fly
    Dumbbell Internal/External Rotation

    Range of motion is good, but still not as good as the non-operative shoulder and I'll get a little discomfort if I try to push the shoulder beyond it's range.

    The best thing recently is I'm starting to think less and less about the shoulder when going about my everyday movements.

    I go for a check-up with my surgeon next week. Hopefully I'll get the all clear to ski in about a month (fingers crossed on an early East Coast opening).
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  7. #57
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    And another thing... Although I'm not a Jets fan, seeing Chad Pennington re-injure his rotator cuff and end his season is very disheartening. It just goes to show that even after 6+ months of rehab, you're still prone to re-injury.
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  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by spanky
    5 Months Post-Op Update (22 weeks to the day).

    I'm continuing with the rehab in the gym and the strength is building. I'm definitely not 100% yet though and keeping the weights relatively light. Specific shoulder exercises are as follows:

    Machine Shoulder Press
    Dumbbell Side Raises
    Dumbbell Front Raises
    Machine Reverse Fly
    Dumbbell Internal/External Rotation

    Range of motion is good, but still not as good as the non-operative shoulder and I'll get a little discomfort if I try to push the shoulder beyond it's range.

    The best thing recently is I'm starting to think less and less about the shoulder when going about my everyday movements.

    I go for a check-up with my surgeon next week. Hopefully I'll get the all clear to ski in about a month (fingers crossed on an early East Coast opening).
    Be carefull of one muscle group gaining strength faster than the opposing muscle group. This is what makes rehab for shoulders so tricky as opposed to other joints. When the muscles don't develop evenly things can get thrown out of balance and lead to pain. I'm not saying this is what is causing your pain but just a word of advice as you increase the weight with which you are working out.

    You also might want to add something like push ups on one of those big yoga balls. I found that was a great rehab excercise since it creates the unbalanced/unstable situations that your shoulder will face when skiing.
    "Don't drive angry."

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  9. #59
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    Sigh... detached anterior labrum here. Oh the joy. Shoulder is dynamically pretty stable thought and no rotator probs.

    I am going to PT the hell out of it, ski this winter, hope for the best and maybe get sliced in the spring if I feel I need it.
    Last edited by descender; 10-05-2005 at 06:09 PM.

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by sea2ski
    Be carefull of one muscle group gaining strength faster than the opposing muscle group. This is what makes rehab for shoulders so tricky as opposed to other joints. When the muscles don't develop evenly things can get thrown out of balance and lead to pain. I'm not saying this is what is causing your pain but just a word of advice as you increase the weight with which you are working out.

    You also might want to add something like push ups on one of those big yoga balls. I found that was a great rehab excercise since it creates the unbalanced/unstable situations that your shoulder will face when skiing.
    Oh I'm doing other muscle groups as well. I was just calling out the specific shoulder exercises I've been doing. I'm on a 6 day/week exercise cycle now; working out Chest/Shoulders/Triceps, Back/Biceps/Shoulders (rotations only), and occasional leg work. As well as mixing in alternating days of cardio exercise.

    As for the pain, it's just with me pushing the arm to the limits of the ROM which I'm not worried about. I doubt it's caused by a strength imbalance.
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  11. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by descender
    Sigh... detached anterior labrum here. Oh the joy. Shoulder is dynamically pretty stable thought and no rotator probs.

    I am going to PT the hell out of it, ski this winter, hope for the best and maybe get sliced in the spring if I feel I need it.
    Sorry to hear about that. How'd it happen? You should be fine skiing this winter. I skied with my injury most of last season (albeit with a little discomfort).
    Because rich has nothing to do with money.

  12. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by spanky
    Sorry to hear about that. How'd it happen? You should be fine skiing this winter. I skied with my injury most of last season (albeit with a little discomfort).
    I crashed MTBing.

    The only thing I am worried about skiing wise is bailing and potentially dislocating it. You didn’t have any problems? Did it hold you back?

  13. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by spanky
    Oh I'm doing other muscle groups as well. I was just calling out the specific shoulder exercises I've been doing. I'm on a 6 day/week exercise cycle now; working out Chest/Shoulders/Triceps, Back/Biceps/Shoulders (rotations only), and occasional leg work. As well as mixing in alternating days of cardio exercise.

    As for the pain, it's just with me pushing the arm to the limits of the ROM which I'm not worried about. I doubt it's caused by a strength imbalance.
    I think you are misunderstanding what I'm saying. When I'm talking about opposing muscle groups I was refering only to shoulder exercises. The 6 excercises that you listed all work different muscle groups in the shoulder. For instance, the dumbbell internal rotation works one group of muscles and the dumbbell external rotation works the opposing muscle group. You do not want the weight that you are using for one excercise to be much greater proportionally than the weight for the other exercise since this will cause the opposing muscles to be out of balance. With some muscle groups you regain your strength much faster, so you need to pay attention. For instance, using the example of internal and external dumbbell rotation. Let's say you started out your rehab using 5 lbs for your internal and 10 lbs for your external. After four weeks you were up to using 10 lbs for internal and 20 lbs for external. This will not cause problems. However, if after four weeks your are up to 8 lbs for your internal and 60 lbs for your external, you are developing the muscles in a way that will cause problems because you have not developed opposing muscle groups equally.

    I only say this because after having 5 dislocations and 2 surgeries in a four year span, I learned more about rehabing a shoulder than I really ever wanted to know. The thing I probably learned the most is there are a lot of PT's that really don't know what they are doing and don't pay attention to issues like this. When I finally found a really good PT and explained that I wanted to go skiing, he designed a very different program for me. He was also very clear in telling me to make sure not to keep raising the weight on one exercise without also raising the weight on the exercise for the opposing muscle group. If you're like I was, you'll have a tendency to think the stronger I make my muscles the better off I am. This is fine as long as you remember to develop the opposing muscle group equally.
    "Don't drive angry."

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  14. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by spanky
    Sorry to hear about the soreness biggins. How often are you exercising the shoulder. I'm working mine with weights 3 days/week max (and different excercises on 1 out of the 3 days). Maybe you want to rest the shoulder for a week or so.
    Took a week off and the shoulder feels great again. Biking is getting less painful and I'm starting to get some more confidence doing roll-downs and such (still pretty much a wuss though).

    I'm pretty much back to every other day with my shoulder excercises and then the one big blowout day/week at PT. Will definitely be skiing when the snow starts falling, just sticking to groomers for a month or so.

    Sea2Ski- thanks for the insights. I'm gonna review my rehab plan with my PT for advice on long-term care. Heal well all. Winters comin'.

  15. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by sea2ski
    I think you are misunderstanding what I'm saying. When I'm talking about opposing muscle groups I was refering only to shoulder exercises. The 6 excercises that you listed all work different muscle groups in the shoulder. For instance, the dumbbell internal rotation works one group of muscles and the dumbbell external rotation works the opposing muscle group. You do not want the weight that you are using for one excercise to be much greater proportionally than the weight for the other exercise since this will cause the opposing muscles to be out of balance. With some muscle groups you regain your strength much faster, so you need to pay attention. For instance, using the example of internal and external dumbbell rotation. Let's say you started out your rehab using 5 lbs for your internal and 10 lbs for your external. After four weeks you were up to using 10 lbs for internal and 20 lbs for external. This will not cause problems. However, if after four weeks your are up to 8 lbs for your internal and 60 lbs for your external, you are developing the muscles in a way that will cause problems because you have not developed opposing muscle groups equally.

    I only say this because after having 5 dislocations and 2 surgeries in a four year span, I learned more about rehabing a shoulder than I really ever wanted to know. The thing I probably learned the most is there are a lot of PT's that really don't know what they are doing and don't pay attention to issues like this. When I finally found a really good PT and explained that I wanted to go skiing, he designed a very different program for me. He was also very clear in telling me to make sure not to keep raising the weight on one exercise without also raising the weight on the exercise for the opposing muscle group. If you're like I was, you'll have a tendency to think the stronger I make my muscles the better off I am. This is fine as long as you remember to develop the opposing muscle group equally.
    Got it. Thanks.
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  16. #66
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    Hi!

    I got arthroscopic surgery coming up in a few weeks. I've injured myself a couple years back on the slopes of Jay Peak... Since then, i dislocated my shoulder 5 times. Everytime, i need medical assistance to get it back to normal.

    The one thing that bothers me is that it doesn't hurt right now... It doesn't prevent me from mountain biking... I'm able to sleep on both sides with no problem...

    However, the shoulder does feel loose... and i've been staying away from rails and parks and jumps also. Regardless of that, last winter, i dislocated my shoulder again just by touching a tree with my loose hand in the woods... Shoulder popped right out! For the 5th year in a row, i found myself missing the best of the winter...

    This season will be completely different... I will get surgery to repair all the loose ligaments (apparently, i don't have much to repair in there), then i'll get the maximum PT i can get in order to get back in shape... This winter, i'll be snowshoeing... I'll climb mountains in order to get a physical exercice... By february, i should be able to ride gently (according to doctor) but i won't push it... My main goal is to be alright for the biking season (may).

    In the meantime, does anyone know if i'll be able to pedal on my home trainer after surgery? I'll need to burn calories because being seated will not only drive me nuts but might also make me fat!

    I'm taking the next six months to get back in shape... I won't be over-exercising... I will have lots of time off... I'll just go to work... and enjoy a relaxed week-end!

    Thanks for your feedback!

    @spanky: thanks for the reassuring words!

  17. #67
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    Hey there BigJay,

    You won't be able to use the handle bars on the bike trainer for about 4-6 weeks post-op. After that you should be fine.

    In the meantime, you'll be in a brace for around 4 weeks, and in that time you DONT want to move your arm much.

    Consider maybe putting the surgery off 'till the spring (pending your doctors approval) if you really want to ride this winter. I did just that, wore a neoprene brace all winter, and was pretty much OK riding (Jay Peak as a matter of fact). Then I had surgery in May and will be back at about 90% this December.

    In the end it all depends on what kind of damage you have. Talk to a doc, get an MRI and then make a plan.


    Best of Luck. Heal fast.

  18. #68
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    The operation should be in a couple of weeks, i went to the hospital today for the pre-op check up. Apparently, i should be able to ride within 8-12 weeks because there isn't much to do to fix my shoulder... The doctor told me i should be able to go to spinning classes after 6 weeks MAX... 1 days after the operation i have to start moving (that's really scary!) my wrist and elbow... then, 1 week after, i have to start moving my arm really gently from side to side and then from front to back with no external rotations...

    The doctor told me that i'm in really good shape so i should heal and recover very quickly... however, i will follow the doctor's order and not jump it, believe me!

    Thanks for the info!


    PS: I don't mind wasting a winter doing hiking and snowshoeing... I want to be ready for the next biking season... The ski season is shorter then the biking season... and the warm summer isn't a good time for an operation... being sticky and not being able to play outside... that would just kill me i think! In the winter, when it's -30C outside after a mid-january rain, i won't mind being stuck inside! LOL! By the way, the snow forecaster are calling the upcoming winter "really average" on the east coast... I'll be back on the board for the mid-feb/march storms!
    Last edited by BigJayVT; 10-17-2005 at 05:16 PM.

  19. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by biggins
    Hey there BigJay,

    You won't be able to use the handle bars on the bike trainer for about 4-6 weeks post-op. After that you should be fine.

    In the meantime, you'll be in a brace for around 4 weeks, and in that time you DONT want to move your arm much.

    Consider maybe putting the surgery off 'till the spring (pending your doctors approval) if you really want to ride this winter. I did just that, wore a neoprene brace all winter, and was pretty much OK riding (Jay Peak as a matter of fact). Then I had surgery in May and will be back at about 90% this December.

    In the end it all depends on what kind of damage you have. Talk to a doc, get an MRI and then make a plan.


    Best of Luck. Heal fast.
    biggins,

    Wondering your experiences riding with an injured shoulder... did it effect your skiing/riding? Any dislocations?

    I have a torn anterior labrum with little pain and no rotator cuff damage so I am not getting sliced until the spring, if at all, depending on how it heals up. I have a brace and I am currently in PT. I don't think normal skiing mechanics will bother it -- bailing is my only concern at this point. But I don't want to hold back all the time either, at some point, I will bail.

  20. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by descender
    biggins,

    Wondering your experiences riding with an injured shoulder... did it effect your skiing/riding? Any dislocations?

    I have a torn anterior labrum with little pain and no rotator cuff damage so I am not getting sliced until the spring, if at all, depending on how it heals up. I have a brace and I am currently in PT. I don't think normal skiing mechanics will bother it -- bailing is my only concern at this point. But I don't want to hold back all the time either, at some point, I will bail.
    My experience was good/bad. Good in the sense that the brace served as a solid reminder not to extend my arm upward/backwards. Bad in the sense that I still managed to pop my arm out a number of times over the course of the winter (though far less than the previous one thanks to the brace). I'm a snowboarder also, so pole planting wasn't a concern.

    Your biggest concern will probably be falling and unwillingly extending your arm up and back. i recommend three things:

    1. The brace. This WILL NOT prevent anything- but will help you get in the habit of tucking your arm when you fall so as to avoid trauma. It really helped me reduce the number of dislocations last winter over the previous winter (I waited two and a half years to get my shoulder surgically repaired). I might also not wear your pole straps (?), this way when you bail there won't be anything contorting your arm.

    2. Talk to your doc about the extent of further damage you could do. Are you a candidate for PT alone? If so, then you might want to strengthen the shit out of your shoulder before you risk trauma from a fall. I was beyond simple PT healing- my tear was such that i could strenghten for months and then one little swing up of the arm and it poppoed out sending me back to square one. My doc suggested that I couldn't likely do any more damage, and thus could ski, dislocate a few times, and be no worse for wear the following spring when I had scheduled my surgery.

    3. Learn how to pop the arm back in. It hurts like a MFer, but after a quick tutorial on how to do it on the fly- I was able to do it in a matter of seconds, and never be out-of-commision when the shoulder popped on the mtn.

    Note- I'm no doctor or PT, just a fellow who's tired of only having one useful arm.

    Good luck. Hope the season goes well.

  21. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by descender
    biggins,

    Wondering your experiences riding with an injured shoulder... did it effect your skiing/riding? Any dislocations?

    I have a torn anterior labrum with little pain and no rotator cuff damage so I am not getting sliced until the spring, if at all, depending on how it heals up. I have a brace and I am currently in PT. I don't think normal skiing mechanics will bother it -- bailing is my only concern at this point. But I don't want to hold back all the time either, at some point, I will bail.
    Sounds good Descender. Best of luck, heal fast, and enjoy the shoein'.

  22. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigJayVT
    PS: I don't mind wasting a winter doing hiking and snowshoeing... I want to be ready for the next biking season... The ski season is shorter then the biking season... and the warm summer isn't a good time for an operation... being sticky and not being able to play outside... that would just kill me i think! In the winter, when it's -30C outside after a mid-january rain, i won't mind being stuck inside! LOL! By the way, the snow forecaster are calling the upcoming winter "really average" on the east coast... I'll be back on the board for the mid-feb/march storms!
    Just the opposite thinking of me. I waited till the ski season was over and sacrificed most of the riding season to be back in form for this winter. We all have different priorities. Best of luck.
    Because rich has nothing to do with money.

  23. #73
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    Saw the doc today for my 5 month (24 weeks to be exact) post-op check-up. He said I'm doing real well (better than expected) and gave me clearance to start "contact sports" at the 6 month point. I asked if "contact sports" included skiing and he said, "of course".

    He also told me to make sure I ease back into any new activity and let my body tell me what I can and can't do. Only instructions were to continue the weight training and not come back to his office!
    Because rich has nothing to do with money.

  24. #74
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    How much y'all puttin up?

    Alrigtht shoulder cats (like Thunder Cats but not as cute, no Snarf)-

    What is your injury/How long post-op are you/How much weight are y'all lifting these days in PT?

    Me: Torn Labrum, Capsular shift, three tacs/I'm 21 weeks, PT for about 13/...

    60lbs pull downs
    60lbs rows
    15lbs each arm bicep curls
    5 lbs each arm everything else (triceps, shoulders)
    No benching (scared)

    Had no muscle mass pre-surgery as the arm was out for a good two years. I feel like I'm progressing- but its slow.

    How about the rest of you? Spanky, WSD, Wong, Steezus, etc?
    Curious and out-of-my skull working at 12:30 in the am.

  25. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by biggins
    Alrigtht shoulder cats (like Thunder Cats but not as cute, no Snarf)-

    What is your injury/How long post-op are you/How much weight are y'all lifting these days in PT?

    Me: Torn Labrum, Capsular shift, three tacs/I'm 21 weeks, PT for about 13/...

    60lbs pull downs
    60lbs rows
    15lbs each arm bicep curls
    5 lbs each arm everything else (triceps, shoulders)
    No benching (scared)

    Had no muscle mass pre-surgery as the arm was out for a good two years. I feel like I'm progressing- but its slow.

    How about the rest of you? Spanky, WSD, Wong, Steezus, etc?
    Curious and out-of-my skull working at 12:30 in the am.
    I'm still leary of pushing heavy weights, so most sets are around 12-15 reps. Here's some of the weights I've been working with (checks log)...

    Bench: 15 to 30 lb dumbbells
    Flyes: 10 lb dumbbells
    Shoulder Press (machine): 30 to 50 lbs
    Internal/External Rotations: 5 lb dumbbells
    Reverse Flyes (machine): 50 to 60 lbs
    Side Raises: 5 to 8 lb dumbbells
    Front Raises: 5 lb dumbbells
    Cable Pushdowns: 35 to 55 lbs
    Cable Pull Downs: 50 to 70 lbs
    Machine Rows: 40 to 60 lbs
    Curls: 15 to 25 dumbbells

    I hear you about the benching fear. I spent quite a bit of time with just 15 lb dumbbells, then slowly started increasing the weight. Like my doc says, "Let your pain be your guide." What I mean is, the discomfort after the workout. I make sure I avoid pain while doing any lifting.

    On the topic of post-workout pain, I find that a 5 minute warm-up on the arm bike really helps with the the post-workout pain. On days where I've skipped the warm-up, I was much more sore.
    Because rich has nothing to do with money.

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