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  1. #176
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Mantooth View Post
    My desire to try flats is almost purely for jumping and handling the bike in the air. I love clips for really technical stuff (techy climbing is probably my biggest strength on a bike) and I see the advantage there to being able to quickly move the bike laterally and/or vertically instead of just forward or backwards. I've been riding clips since I was 12 so I can easily ditch the bike therefore it's not really a confidence thing for me - I find when I need to bail I'm out of the pedals without thinking about it. But as soon as I get in the air I find myself dead sailoring or pulling up on my pedals to get extra height to clear landings which tells me a) I'm not properly loading up on the ramp b) I'm not releasing off the lip properly and c) I'm not gripping the bike in the air properly. So when I get into bigger jumps or have to bunny hop something legitimately high I lose control pretty quickly. As a result I feel like my progression there has plateaued and I think clips allow me to get away with those bad habits that ultimately limit progression. I also think I'll feel less confident in high speed chunk with flats which will push me to have a better body position.

    I think there's a huge advantage to overall bike control if you can ride both flats and clips equally effectively (albeit different styles) and make the decision based on which one you prefer, not which one you know. Right now I'm not even close to that point with flats so I feel like my riding will benefit from being expanded in a slightly different way. In reality I'll probably fucking hate it but who knows
    Your experience sounds similar to mine with clipless.

    In fact, I'd probably still be on clipless had I not forgotten my shoes on a trip to Moab and purchased an inexpensive pair of flats and discovered that I really preferred them. And it only took me a few days to realize.

    But yeah - 1st time I hit a trail with jumps on it... holy shit. Hang on to your hat.

  2. #177
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    Well I survived day 1 on flats (not that anyone cares). It was not as wildly different as I was expecting which I guess is a good thing. I noticed differences in unanticipated bumpy areas and off jumps but everything else was relatively the same. Immediately upon starting the descent I was all over the place and couldn't control the bike until I planted my heels down hard and then it was fine. Off jumps I'm definitely relying on the clips to get extra height but I was still able to get airborne and clear the usual kickers without flying off the pedals - next step is working on getting the extra height with flats. Overall I definitely didn't feel as confident since I felt less connected to the bike and it was more work on my legs to keep pressure on the pedals

    I'll try them out at the local trail that is super technical since so far the bumpy stuff seems to be the biggest adjustment, especially when seated. I don't think flats are a one stop shop to getting better at riding but I do think they expose small bouts of laziness when it comes to body position and line choice so it's a good training exercise for clipless lifers like myself
    Quote Originally Posted by other grskier View Post
    well, in the three years i've been skiing i bet i can ski most anything those 'pro's' i listed can, probably

  3. #178
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Mantooth View Post
    Well I survived day 1 on flats (not that anyone cares). It was not as wildly different as I was expecting which I guess is a good thing. I noticed differences in unanticipated bumpy areas and off jumps but everything else was relatively the same. Immediately upon starting the descent I was all over the place and couldn't control the bike until I planted my heels down hard and then it was fine. Off jumps I'm definitely relying on the clips to get extra height but I was still able to get airborne and clear the usual kickers without flying off the pedals - next step is working on getting the extra height with flats. Overall I definitely didn't feel as confident since I felt less connected to the bike and it was more work on my legs to keep pressure on the pedals

    I'll try them out at the local trail that is super technical since so far the bumpy stuff seems to be the biggest adjustment, especially when seated. I don't think flats are a one stop shop to getting better at riding but I do think they expose small bouts of laziness when it comes to body position and line choice so it's a good training exercise for clipless lifers like myself
    What kind of shoes? Kinda like skiing, "it's all about the boots" Flat pedals really need a dedicated flat pedal shoe. Flat stiff soles that have a soft texture that grip the pins. Trying flats with hard cleated sole hiking boots or worse, trad bike shoes for clipless is not a good test...........

  4. #179
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quadzilla View Post
    What kind of shoes? Kinda like skiing, "it's all about the boots" Flat pedals really need a dedicated flat pedal shoe. Flat stiff soles that have a soft texture that grip the pins. Trying flats with hard cleated sole hiking boots or worse, trad bike shoes for clipless is not a good test...........
    Fully agree. The shoes are *critical*...

  5. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quadzilla View Post
    What kind of shoes? Kinda like skiing, "it's all about the boots" Flat pedals really need a dedicated flat pedal shoe. Flat stiff soles that have a soft texture that grip the pins. Trying flats with hard cleated sole hiking boots or worse, trad bike shoes for clipless is not a good test...........
    I used my giro chamber shoes with the cleats removed. So obviously not ideal right off the bat due to the cleat cutout but they have a flat stiff sole with a wide forefoot and a decently tacky texture with a similar pattern to flat pedal dedicated shoes. I found the pins locked in the shoe quite well actually to the point where it was difficult to reposition my foot while riding due to the grip. I'm sure they're not as good as a dedicated flat shoe but I didn't want to put more money into this experiment unless the shoes were a complete nightmare right off the bat

    I think the instances where my feet did come off the pedals or slide around were more technique/line choice related than shoe, like hitting a rock while climbing that bounces the rear end laterally a few inches. With clips you can zone out and spin with light pressure in bumpy terrain and have no consequence but I felt like I had to be much more dialed with flats. Once going downhill with my heels dropped I had zero sensation of losing grip
    Quote Originally Posted by other grskier View Post
    well, in the three years i've been skiing i bet i can ski most anything those 'pro's' i listed can, probably

  6. #181
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Mantooth View Post
    I used my giro chamber shoes with the cleats removed. So obviously not ideal right off the bat due to the cleat cutout but they have a flat stiff sole with a wide forefoot and a decently tacky texture with a similar pattern to flat pedal dedicated shoes. I found the pins locked in the shoe quite well actually to the point where it was difficult to reposition my foot while riding due to the grip. I'm sure they're not as good as a dedicated flat shoe but I didn't want to put more money into this experiment unless the shoes were a complete nightmare right off the bat

    I think the instances where my feet did come off the pedals or slide around were more technique/line choice related than shoe, like hitting a rock while climbing that bounces the rear end laterally a few inches. With clips you can zone out and spin with light pressure in bumpy terrain and have no consequence but I felt like I had to be much more dialed with flats. Once going downhill with my heels dropped I had zero sensation of losing grip
    Get some good flat shoes - they are WAY cheaper than hospital bills. For real. Do it. You won't regret it. You will ride way safer and in more control.

    Overall, over than that, you're doing the right stuff - mainly, drop your heels.

    Finally...I gotta ask ----- wtf is with "world's first 'analrapist' " ?? Usually, people don't claim to carry out criminal and violent sexual acts, so...??
    sproing!

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  7. #182
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    Quote Originally Posted by meter-man View Post
    Finally...I gotta ask ----- wtf is with "world's first 'analrapist' " ?? Usually, people don't claim to carry out criminal and violent sexual acts, so...??

  8. #183
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    Quote Originally Posted by meter-man View Post
    Get some good flat shoes - they are WAY cheaper than hospital bills. For real. Do it. You won't regret it. You will ride way safer and in more control.

    Overall, over than that, you're doing the right stuff - mainly, drop your heels.

    Finally...I gotta ask ----- wtf is with "world's first 'analrapist' " ?? Usually, people don't claim to carry out criminal and violent sexual acts, so...??
    I'm fully in the camp of having the right gear for the task and I do abide by that pretty soundly. BUT I am curious how different my shoes really are than dedicated flat shoes. Sure if I were wearing my sidi road weenie shoes with cleats off I'd be asking for a hospital bill and if I were wearing floppy skate shoes I'd be asking for super sore feet, but the chambers are designed to be like a flat shoe and the soles are built to grip supplemental pins on pedals like mallets or saints. Obviously the cleat cutout is the glaring thing here but what else makes a flat shoe so different from the chamber?

    Also I was so confused what you were talking about since I made this account when I was like 16 but yeah what HAB said...
    Quote Originally Posted by other grskier View Post
    well, in the three years i've been skiing i bet i can ski most anything those 'pro's' i listed can, probably

  9. #184
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    Been riding in skate shoes on flats and my feet almost never come off the pedal. And it is the iMotion composite with removable metal pins I bought for $25, after spending six months reading every pedal review and being unable to decide how much to spend on which pedal. Choose the cheap off brand option to replace my full plastic pedal the bike came with. Honestly can imagine buying anything more expensive down the road. Also have a cheap alloy pedal that is convex like the OneUp but have not tried those yet.

    Fwiw not getting any serious air or hitting super techy stuff on my trek hard tail. But still having fun hitting some of the more well known downhill routes in my back yard.

  10. #185
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Mantooth View Post
    I'm fully in the camp of having the right gear for the task and I do abide by that pretty soundly. BUT I am curious how different my shoes really are than dedicated flat shoes. Sure if I were wearing my sidi road weenie shoes with cleats off I'd be asking for a hospital bill and if I were wearing floppy skate shoes I'd be asking for super sore feet, but the chambers are designed to be like a flat shoe and the soles are built to grip supplemental pins on pedals like mallets or saints. Obviously the cleat cutout is the glaring thing here but what else makes a flat shoe so different from the chamber?

    Also I was so confused what you were talking about since I made this account when I was like 16 but yeah what HAB said...
    AH gotcha. Those shoes are probably not terrible, but I bet true flat shoes would better. I'd guess they are stiff where the cleat goes. Probably would have better grip here with a more pliant sole. But if it works, it works.
    sproing!

    FS: 2003 Lancelite 845 truck camper: https://reno.craigslist.org/rvs/d/fl...315653655.html

  11. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes Mantooth View Post
    I'm fully in the camp of having the right gear for the task and I do abide by that pretty soundly. BUT I am curious how different my shoes really are than dedicated flat shoes. Sure if I were wearing my sidi road weenie shoes with cleats off I'd be asking for a hospital bill and if I were wearing floppy skate shoes I'd be asking for super sore feet, but the chambers are designed to be like a flat shoe and the soles are built to grip supplemental pins on pedals like mallets or saints. Obviously the cleat cutout is the glaring thing here but what else makes a flat shoe so different from the chamber?

    Also I was so confused what you were talking about since I made this account when I was like 16 but yeah what HAB said...
    The main thing is the sticky rubber and flat pedal area with lots of rubber for grip. Makes a nice combo for confident grip.

  12. #187
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    My 9yo has basically destroyed the plastic pedals flats that came with his bike and needs some new ones. I have a set of metal with pins (I have no idea what they are called as I ride clipless). I think those are too aggressive and he's end up with some pretty bloody shins.

    I started to remove the pins but now they they will be too slick without them. What's a good kids flat pedal that won't injure him but stand up to some abuse?

    Sent from my SM-N986U using Tapatalk

  13. #188
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    good info on the shoes. I have been riding for 4 years now just using hiking shoes. Want to improve was wondering if shoes would help. I guess I will try them.
    off your knees Louie

  14. #189
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    Quote Originally Posted by sethschmautz View Post
    My 9yo has basically destroyed the plastic pedals flats that came with his bike and needs some new ones. I have a set of metal with pins (I have no idea what they are called as I ride clipless). I think those are too aggressive and he's end up with some pretty bloody shins.

    I started to remove the pins but now they they will be too slick without them. What's a good kids flat pedal that won't injure him but stand up to some abuse?

    Sent from my SM-N986U using Tapatalk
    I took dozens of wellgo beartraps to my shins on my GT Mach 1 when I was a kiddo.... He will learn quick.


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  15. #190
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    Feb 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by sethschmautz View Post
    My 9yo has basically destroyed the plastic pedals flats that came with his bike and needs some new ones. I have a set of metal with pins (I have no idea what they are called as I ride clipless). I think those are too aggressive and he's end up with some pretty bloody shins.

    I started to remove the pins but now they they will be too slick without them. What's a good kids flat pedal that won't injure him but stand up to some abuse?

    Sent from my SM-N986U using Tapatalk
    Race Face Ride are the pedals youíre looking for. $35, sealed bearings, well sized for kids, and surprisingly grippy despite not having metal pins.

  16. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by BFD View Post
    good info on the shoes. I have been riding for 4 years now just using hiking shoes. Want to improve was wondering if shoes would help. I guess I will try them.
    Stiff sole on good flat shoes put more power into the pedals as well.


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  17. #192
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    ^^ Good info on those Ride's, might have to pick up a pair.

    My daughter is on some Odyssey which have been working pretty well, but are a bit thick. My son's Vitus came with some excellent ones, but not sure what brand they are. They're really quite thin but no label/marking I could find.

  18. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by meter-man View Post
    AH gotcha. Those shoes are probably not terrible, but I bet true flat shoes would better. I'd guess they are stiff where the cleat goes. Probably would have better grip here with a more pliant sole. But if it works, it works.
    That's what I'm thinking. The chambers have a super stiff sole which might actually be too stiff. I can see it being a fine line between too flexy where you don't get proper power transfer and so stiff where you can't really wrap your foot around the pedal or feel it well. I felt more in camp 2 with the chambers
    Quote Originally Posted by other grskier View Post
    well, in the three years i've been skiing i bet i can ski most anything those 'pro's' i listed can, probably

  19. #194
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    Quote Originally Posted by sethschmautz View Post
    My 9yo has basically destroyed the plastic pedals flats that came with his bike and needs some new ones. I have a set of metal with pins (I have no idea what they are called as I ride clipless). I think those are too aggressive and he's end up with some pretty bloody shins.
    This might be helpful: https://thebikedads.com/kids-pedals/

    Main thing I'll say is to make sure they like the color. My daughter still has scars from starting riding with pins 3-4 years ago but the pedals were cool so she stuck with it.

  20. #195
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    Quote Originally Posted by teledad View Post
    This might be helpful: https://thebikedads.com/kids-pedals/

    Main thing I'll say is to make sure they like the color. My daughter still has scars from starting riding with pins 3-4 years ago but the pedals were cool so she stuck with it.
    So I shouldn't have just bought the cheap green Rides on Amazon?

    Sent from my SM-N986U using Tapatalk

  21. #196
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    Quote Originally Posted by sethschmautz View Post
    So I shouldn't have just bought the cheap green Rides on Amazon?

    Sent from my SM-N986U using Tapatalk
    They made the list so you're all good

  22. #197
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    For flat pedals I still got a set of axo dualies in good condition, the soles are ribbed (for pleasure) so the pedal pins fit in between the ribs and the traction is pretty good

    also the high tops provide a lot of protection to the ankles a few times I have sandwiched a foot between the bike and a rock and thot that would have hurt

    IME a great shoe from 15 yars ago , i don't think they make em anymore
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  23. #198
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    Tell me about flat pedals

    Started with one up composite pedals, kind of thick but the price was right for putting on to start back riding again. After a couple months went to one up alloy, light thin good grip big platform. There now on the ebike.

    Tried clipless 3 different months over 3 years now and its a hard no go. So many stupid crashes. Then I started noticing all the clip related crashes in our rides. Flats for life.

    Like the canfields but bearing bolt with nylock nut needs attention way to often. My xc hardtail and wifes bike have them. Medium platform and thin.

    Just put hope pedals on my new Hei hei. Like them so far med/large platform, little thicker than the skinniest of the others. Biggest bummer was having to install the pins myself not pre done.

    Got to try the kona pedals on my buddies big honzo tonight. Huge platform pretty thin. Hes a size 15 shoe so is trying for a while, he ride s clipless usually but I been setting prís and KOMís on flats on our main spot so heís interested.

    510 free riders for me, and usually knee pads and long socks for poison oak protection. Major shin strikes have only happened in garage tripping over bikes or other loading unloading bike stand stuff, no trail scars. Got the wife the tall padded socks till she built confidence, no trail scars for her either. 510 freerider pro shoes.

    I do think oval chain rings help a little more with the pulling up on the back stroke clipless claims. It seems easier to transition power from foot to foot and less dead spot at the bottom of the stroke.
    Drink to remember not to forget!
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  24. #199
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    Interesting re: oval chainrings, makes sense although most of my flat pedal experience has been on a bike w/ oval chainring so don't have a comparator. I'm solidly in the camp that I have to dial my riding way back on flats after ~25+yrs clipped in, but still give try to spend time on flats. I do recommend giving that Ryan Leech flat pedal challenge a go for those like me.

  25. #200
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    Ok for those of you like me who didn't want to buy flat pedal specific shoes as you tried out flats - just shut up and do it. I started to get the hang of flats with my chambers sans cleats but yesterday tried a pair of 510 freeriders and had my mind blown. The grip literally felt like I was in clips again if not better. The chambers had decent grip on the pins but nothing compared to 510s, and mainly the softer sole on the 510s allowed me to feel the pedal way more and grab the pedals with my feet. Main advantage areas were bunny hopping and jumping since I felt like I could pop the bike and hold it in the air, even adjust direction in the air. My feet also got knocked out of position less especially when climbing techy sections. Honestly from my experience flats with good shoes and pedals don't feel that different from clips. Still not sure which one I like better but the fact that I'm already asking that after only 2 weeks on flats tells me something
    Quote Originally Posted by other grskier View Post
    well, in the three years i've been skiing i bet i can ski most anything those 'pro's' i listed can, probably

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