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  1. #51
    Join Date
    May 2009
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    Van-groovey
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    200
    Quote Originally Posted by rangerjake View Post
    I find these full rocker skis you don't really ski the "tail stiffness" like a cambered ski would. In my Vwerks Katana, I never feel much of a ski beyond the mid body. Just ordered my BMT94, so will tell you more about that next week. Though I can't give you any praxis scale relativity
    Thanks ranger do let me know what you think. FWIW praxis has a comparison here: http://www.praxisskis.com/pages/cons...omparison.html and the katana was a "stiff"

  2. #52
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    VT
    Posts
    201
    Scored last year's BMT 122 186's with kingpin 13's for $850. Boot's mountain labs. My sole use is dawn patrol when it snows and I can't take the day off to go lift served. Set up light compared to my everyday ride black crow Corvus, pivot 14's, Mach ones. Have 15 2,100 foot skins on them in 6" to 18". No surprise they float great, surprised how they can make short turns when the trees get tight & how well they hold an edge & arc turns on the run out. Totally satisfied especially considering the price paid.

  3. #53
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    $teaux
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    1,285
    Quick question for anyone here who mounted their own BMTs (any width):

    I am planning on mounting a Dynafit, well aware of the non-H mounting pattern. I have V-werks Katanas that I put Dynafits on and felt that the mount was bomber. Skied 10 days on them so far with zero issues. Should I be more concerned about doing this with the BMT 94 with the fewer carbon sheets used in construction? Or do we think that a strong mount, epoxy, should hold just fine.

    FWIW, I am not huge and won't be skiing these balls to the wall. 5'9 170lbs. TLT 6 boot. 186 ski.

  4. #54
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Van-groovey
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    200
    Got these mounted and ridden yet ranger? Looking for feedback as it feels like I might need to step up and get them soon while still in stock at $719 CAD

  5. #55
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
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    $teaux
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    Quote Originally Posted by indyjones View Post
    Got these mounted and ridden yet ranger? Looking for feedback as it feels like I might need to step up and get them soon while still in stock at $719 CAD
    Got them mounted. But, sadly, it snowed like 40" here. So they aren't getting much court time at the moment, Vwerks Katana instead.

    I will make sure to put some thoughts out there after some skiing, assuming (and hoping) my epoxied Verticals don't rip right out.
    't

  6. #56
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
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    $teaux
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    Skied these today for the first time. Hardly an in depth review.

    Packed powder/Machine groomed conditions. Skinned 1800ft, skied a total of about 8 runs on them.

    I really like the skis. At low-medium speeds they are effortless to engage into a turn and transition out of a turn. At higher speeds on the harder, somewhat variable snow surface the skis would deflect and get bounced around a bit more. But they had plenty of stability on the edge that as I took the speed higher (40-50mph) they never felt terrifyingly nervous, the edge would just skidder a bit more.

    I find stiffness really hard to quantify on these. @186cm, skiing with a TLT6, my mount is about .8cm ahead of the recommended line (I mounted for a larger boot in the circumstance that I sell and someone wants the binding- most people wear larger than my 287mm). The full rocker for me just begs to be skied in a way that you aren't pushing so hard into the ski, but that you roll it into and out of turns and the "preflexed" nature of the full rocker does the rest.

    Where I could tell a bit more was in the tail. Being forward a bit made the tail feel a little longer than ideal, but after a couple runs I was used to it. I felt supported and some power from the tail (a combination of extra length and stiffness) but also never felt so locked in to a turn that the ski was hesitant to disengage from the turn.

    I usually don't put much stock into the online reviews I read for skis. But one thing I read really sums this ski up well- if I could only have one ski to tour on this would be a great option. It seems to do most everything very well, but I don't think it'll excel at anything. A ZeroG def carves and holds a better edge than this ski does. I am certain that more pronounced rocker from a Sportiva Vapor Nano will slice through soft snow better. But for a mish mash of possible conditions I would feel very comfortable having this ski.

    If you have more specific questions I can try and chime in with thoughts. This is a very quick summary.

  7. #57
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Van-groovey
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    200
    Many thanks ranger. I'll think I will be pairing this with my 112 wailers for my touring quiver.

  8. #58
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
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    $teaux
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    I will add that today I had these things in about 10" of freshly fallen powder with a little bit of wind effect on it. These skis ski powder better than a 94mm ski should. By far the best soft snow performance of any ski this narrow I have ever skied. Certain shortcomings that any sub 95mm ski would have in deeper snow, but truthfully I was blown away how adept this was in the the snow. Very fun and hardly the bummer I thought it would be when what I thought was 3-4" turned into 8-12".

  9. #59
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Squaw valley
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    How do they compare to the katana vwerks in firm snow or wind affected?

  10. #60
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    Mar 2009
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    $teaux
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    You can feel the stiffer flex, more robust build, of the Katana VW in chopped up snow and other rodeo conditions. In hard snow I still think I have a slight preference for the BMT 94. Though it does feel a little more docile and fragile on hard snow conditions I just prefer the feel of the edge right under my foot as opposed to getting less leverage on my edge on a ski almost 20mm wider. The added stiffness of the Katana VW doesn't outweigh the fact that wide skis on hard snow just aren't preferable to me when compared with a pretty similar narrower ski.

    In any powder, wind affected or otherwise, I would take the Katana VW. Though I was a little uncertain on it at first (been a few years since I have skied consistently on a full rocker ski) I have grown to absolutely LOVE it, especially in any powder. The variety of turn shapes it can make easily and with pleasure is truly impressive. Big fast arcs? No problem. Very quick wiggles? Equal ease. The BMT 94, as I said, really overperforms it's dimensions in soft snow- to the point that I was thoroughly impressed this morning. And that praise doesn't come easy from me. But, literally all other things between these two skis are equal (design wise) and in that case the 112mm make a big difference in untracked snow, and a huge difference in chopped up snow.

    FWIW, I would also say that a full rocker design has many pros, and also many cons. But skiing wind affected snow is one thing that a full rocker ski just nails compared with any other profile design (camber, tip rocker, camber w/ tip and tail rocker). So any Vwerks ski like these in odd, crusty conditions are really a design that is what I would choose over any other hands down.

  11. #61
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Squaw valley
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    4,658
    Quote Originally Posted by rangerjake View Post
    You can feel the stiffer flex, more robust build, of the Katana VW in chopped up snow and other rodeo conditions. In hard snow I still think I have a slight preference for the BMT 94. Though it does feel a little more docile and fragile on hard snow conditions I just prefer the feel of the edge right under my foot as opposed to getting less leverage on my edge on a ski almost 20mm wider. The added stiffness of the Katana VW doesn't outweigh the fact that wide skis on hard snow just aren't preferable to me when compared with a pretty similar narrower ski.

    In any powder, wind affected or otherwise, I would take the Katana VW. Though I was a little uncertain on it at first (been a few years since I have skied consistently on a full rocker ski) I have grown to absolutely LOVE it, especially in any powder. The variety of turn shapes it can make easily and with pleasure is truly impressive. Big fast arcs? No problem. Very quick wiggles? Equal ease. The BMT 94, as I said, really overperforms it's dimensions in soft snow- to the point that I was thoroughly impressed this morning. And that praise doesn't come easy from me. But, literally all other things between these two skis are equal (design wise) and in that case the 112mm make a big difference in untracked snow, and a huge difference in chopped up snow.

    FWIW, I would also say that a full rocker design has many pros, and also many cons. But skiing wind affected snow is one thing that a full rocker ski just nails compared with any other profile design (camber, tip rocker, camber w/ tip and tail rocker). So any Vwerks ski like these in odd, crusty conditions are really a design that is what I would choose over any other hands down.
    Thanks. I was curious about the bmt.
    I own the katana, my backcountry ski for all conditions, including spring.

    I had narrower skis, but I find a wider one I'd more versatile, since most of the time I ski bad snow.
    I looked at the bmt 108, but it was less stiff torsionally, and I was concerned about hold on ice.

  12. #62
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    Mar 2009
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    $teaux
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    I have had the great fortune in the past 2 months of owning the VW Katana, and 1 week of the BMT 94, having skied virtually no truly hard snow. A little packed powder with each, some ski trail hardpack mixed in, but truly rough stuff hasn't come yet.

  13. #63
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Winthrop, WA.
    Posts
    1,596
    I've had BMT 94's since last spring and really like them on everything but bullet proof. Used them quite a bit for resort skiing this winter and they did way better than expect at just about everything I put them into. As far as hardpack goes the have plenty of edge grip but I get that kind of teetering feeling, prefer cambered skis on the hard stuff. I get the same feeling with just about all full-reverse designs. As long as the snow, including groomers, is soft enough for the edges to dig in just a little they are fantastic. Like rangerjake said, they exceed expectations (wildest hopes) in deeper snow even when its a little on the heavy or crusted side. Point and shoot. If you prefer a cambered ski I can heartily recommend Salomon Mtn Explores in the sub-100mm class.

  14. #64
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    3,429
    I see ranger is at about +.8 where is everybody else mounted? BMT 94s are coming in on Tuesday.

  15. #65
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Winthrop, WA.
    Posts
    1,596
    I've got mine at -1 and would do it again. Got that recommendation from wildsnow. On harder snow it makes me stay on the front of the ski and with the rearward mount they carve well when driven like that. Had them up last week at Crystal in everything from refrozen base with pushed up mounds to corn and breakable crust....all I can say is that they exceeded expectations for a 94 underfoot touring ski. There are certainly better skis for each of the individual conditions above but the BMT's held their own all the way around.

  16. #66
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    395
    Anyone played around with edge angles or detuning? These are just such different skis on hardpack, I'd like to tone them down a little, but don't want to jack things up too bad. Incredible edge grip, but I find I really have to carve them all the way through to the next turn. In the b/c on harder/refrozen snow I don't like to constantly be on my game and making technical turns. In soft snow they're more accepting of different types of turns and varying aggressiveness, so no problems there.

    I'll probably start with a little detuning, but I'm curious what the factory edge angles are, and if anyone has tried something different. Thanks!

  17. #67
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    3,429
    Quote Originally Posted by dub_xion View Post
    Anyone played around with edge angles or detuning?
    Mine were feeling a bit squirrelly and I wasn't sure if it was the ski, the tune, or my mounting location. I ended up doing a little base flattening work and reset the edge bevels. I then went after detuning the tips and tails.

    I actually think detuning made the most difference.

    I also built an aluminum binding shift plate that would allow me to try different mounting locations and skied at -2 yesterday. The ski felt great - better than any of my other experiences on this ski.

    I think detuning made a huge difference, but I also think getting further back on the ski is allowing me to drive the ski better with my style of skiing. I'm not sure if I will remount or just keep skiing with the shift plate for now, but I definitely think the line is too far forward for this ski for my style of skiing.

    Seth

  18. #68
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    395
    Thanks! Got a edge/wax from a shop, with a little detune, and they seem to be doing well. Dawson seems to concur on the -2 mount position... I might be getting some different boots with a longer bsl and may end up at about -1.

  19. #69
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    8
    The 94 is a great ski. I am on the V-Werks Katana and have skied the 94 recently and they are great but I am waiting for the V-Werks Mantra out for next season. Ski looks fantastic and 100 under foot with my 112 Katana seems perfect.

  20. #70
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Squaw valley
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    4,658
    Quote Originally Posted by Chpfly View Post
    The 94 is a great ski. I am on the V-Werks Katana and have skied the 94 recently and they are great but I am waiting for the V-Werks Mantra out for next season. Ski looks fantastic and 100 under foot with my 112 Katana seems perfect.
    How good is it on ice or wind affected snow?

    Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using TGR Forums mobile app

  21. #71
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Winthrop, WA.
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    1,596
    94 is OK (survivable) on ice and surprisingly good in wind affected. I'm always amazed at how versatile/universal the 94 is in the back country. In fact, I just pulled the KP's off the 122's yesterday and put them back on the 94's for the remainder of the spring season, cuz evidently it is never going to snow again and I might as well get ready for spring season.

    if you were referring to the V-Werks Mantra in wind affected, I don't know didn't have any wind affected available. But I can say it does way better than expected on bulletproof. Took one lap on the 179 at Mission during the NW demo last week and was astonished how well it held and carved on refrozen, scratched off groomers. The feel on the snow is classic V-Wereks/BMT, just more damp. Super cool ski. This is the carver of the V-werks series.

  22. #72
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    SLC, Utah
    Posts
    4,308
    resurrecting this old thread with a mount question:

    i just picked up a pair of these sweet skis, and i'd like to throw a pair of atk's on 'em. unfortunately, it looks like i'll likely miss the titanal mounting area unless i spring for a pair of alpinists or use a different binder on them.

    i'm 155lbs, not an aggressive skier, etc. am i gonna die if i miss the titanal plate?

  23. #73
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    PNW -> MSO
    Posts
    7,905
    There's no plate. The H pattern was Marker marketing bullshit.

    Be prepared to still find voids when drilling, even within the H zone. Use good glue and let them cure upsidedown.

  24. #74
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    girdwood
    Posts
    489
    Quote Originally Posted by tgapp View Post
    resurrecting this old thread with a mount question:

    i just picked up a pair of these sweet skis, and i'd like to throw a pair of atk's on 'em. unfortunately, it looks like i'll likely miss the titanal mounting area unless i spring for a pair of alpinists or use a different binder on them.

    i'm 155lbs, not an aggressive skier, etc. am i gonna die if i miss the titanal plate?
    I have ATK HRs on mine. Going on 3 years of heavy use. Haven't died yet. Thought they were within the U-shaped plate, though. Maybe I'm wrong?

  25. #75
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    SLC, Utah
    Posts
    4,308
    Quote Originally Posted by STLHD View Post
    I have ATK HRs on mine. Going on 3 years of heavy use. Haven't died yet. Thought they were within the U-shaped plate, though. Maybe I'm wrong?

    huh right on, you don't happen to know the mount pattern of those offhand do you?

    IIRC HR = bd helio200 so it would be samesies as what i'm plannin' on doing.

    glad ur not ded btw

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