Crooked Dynafit Toe - Pins not lining up

**tsk01** · 12-17-2014, 05:44 PM

So I went ahead and mounted my Speed Radicals, first ski turned out fine. On the 2nd the toe is slightly crooked - 1-2mm, therefore the back heel pins don't line up. I can step the boot in, but am worried about the excess torque on the toe.

The front 2 screws are what is causing the problem. I can get the back 2 (on the toe) snug, but if I try either of the front toe screws it just twists back into place - crooked. I've searched and couldn't find anything concrete on the options I could do to solve this. I don't want to remount the toe, I don't really have the space due to hole interference.

Any advice?

**Shorty_J** · 12-17-2014, 05:54 PM

Picture?

It sounds like one of the holes for the toe isn't in exactly the correct location. If that's the case, I think your best bet is to install a heli-coil or tap-in insert at the location.

You'd have to drill a larger hole and the tricky part would be relocating the middle of the hole somewhere other than the original hole... it will want to pull the bit into it. You could use a hollow core or forstner bit if you have one (or can get one).

**tsk01** · 12-17-2014, 05:55 PM

So this is with the toe straight so the heel will line up properly - the main issue is obviously the screw in the top left, but even if I tighten the top right screw - it slides it back to the left making it crooked again.

**tsk01** · 12-17-2014, 05:58 PM

Thanks Shorty - yeah, one of the hole's is definitely slightly off.

I was thinking of doing that, but like you mentioned the tough part is making the hole bigger but moving the centre to the new location.

**davep** · 12-17-2014, 05:58 PM

what happens if you torque the "good" 3 screws down hard first, then tighten the bad screw last? Looks like its not so far off as to be beyond hope...

**tsk01** · 12-17-2014, 06:00 PM

Originally Posted by davep

what happens if you torque the "good" 3 screws down hard first, then tighten the bad screw last? Looks like its not so far off as to be beyond hope...

If I tighten either of the top 2 - including the top right, which isn't nearly as bad, it pulls it right back into place.

It's tough to tell in that picture, but the top right is also slightly off, it's a bit to the inside when the toe is straight.

**PNWbrit** · 12-17-2014, 06:01 PM

Originally Posted by davep

what happens if you torque the "good" 3 screws down hard first, then tighten the bad screw last? Looks like its not so far off as to be beyond hope...

This.

It doesn't seem so bad.

**tsk01** · 12-17-2014, 06:04 PM

Originally Posted by PNWbrit

This.

It doesn't seem so bad.

When I tighten down the bottom 2 and the top right screw - it's just as bad as all 4 being tight. The heel pins are off about 3-5mm in the back to one side when I do that.

**davep** · 12-17-2014, 06:07 PM

Also, you should probably remove the pube from the upper left corner of the binding. THAT'S likely your problem.

**PNWbrit** · 12-17-2014, 06:08 PM

Originally Posted by davep

Also, you should probably remove the pube from the upper left corner of the binding. THAT'S likely your problem.

He was trying to show that it was only a cunt hair off?

**tsk01** · 12-17-2014, 06:09 PM

Originally Posted by davep

Also, you should probably remove the pube from the upper left corner of the binding. THAT'S likely your problem.

I thought this as well, no luck.

So I'm thinking my only options would be to redrill the holes slightly bigger and use inserts. Or to oblong the holes on the toe to allow the screw to be straight and the binding to straighten as well. My concern with this is obviously the structural integrity of the toe if I were to file down the metal.

**davep** · 12-17-2014, 06:12 PM

Originally Posted by tsk01

When I tighten down the bottom 2 and the top right screw - it's just as bad as all 4 being tight. The heel pins are off about 3-5mm in the back to one side when I do that.

Hmm, bummer.
I'd still try a few more things before re-drilling if the back 2 holes are aligned well.
- schmear epoxy under the toepiece, torque the rear 2 screws tight, leave to dry over night, then tighten front 2 screws gently in the morning?
- torque rear 2 screws for alignment, and use longer screws with flat washers for the front 2 holes?

**LeeLau** · 12-17-2014, 06:16 PM

hmmm that's a tough one. The usual fix is to put in a boot onto the toe then use the torque of the boot to hold the toe in place while you tighten the offending screws down. You might be off enough that won't work

**MagnificentUnicorn** · 12-17-2014, 06:24 PM

Originally Posted by tsk01

When I tighten down the bottom 2 and the top right screw - it's just as bad as all 4 being tight. The heel pins are off about 3-5mm in the back to one side when I do that.

Then the 2 rear screws and the top right screw are poorly aligned. 3-5 mm is unacceptable.

You said you could get it within a mm, if that's the case I wouldn't worry too much.

Have you tried both boots in the binding?

**shafty85** · 12-17-2014, 06:30 PM

Fill front holes with machinable epoxy. Let set. Sand down so flat. Redrill?

You could even use the binding, with the 2 rear to screws in, as your guide so that the new front holes were in the correct location.

**tsk01** · 12-17-2014, 06:31 PM

Originally Posted by AaronWright

Then the 2 rear screws and the top right screw are poorly aligned. 3-5 mm is unacceptable.

You said you could get it within a mm, if that's the case I wouldn't worry too much.

Have you tried both boots in the binding?

Yup, both boots are almost identical. I wouldn't want to use it how it is right now, I could, but sure wouldn't want too.

I can get it almost perfectly lined up with the 2 rear screws in, but as soon as I tighten down either of the top two it shifts.

**tsk01** · 12-17-2014, 06:33 PM

Originally Posted by shafty85

Fill front holes with machinable epoxy. Let set. Sand down so flat. Redrill?

You could even use the binding, with the 2 rear to screws in, as your guide so that the new front holes were in the correct location.

From what I know, I thought the material you fill the hole with has to be the exact same density as the surrounding material, otherwise the drill bit will wonder. I could be wrong, but this is what I thought.

**whatsupdoc** · 12-17-2014, 07:10 PM

Couple of options that could work:

1. Fill the front 2 holes with machinable epoxy. Let it set. Use the binding itself as a template. Mount the binding with the rear 2 screws so the pin alignment is perfect. Mark the new front holes very precisely with a center punch. If you're worried about the bit wandering, then you can drill a pilot hole with a very small bit and then use a ski bit. The pilot hole should prevent it from wandering. Tap the machinable epoxy, install.

2. You could also do option #1, drill the pilot holes so they're exactly where you need them, then place helicoils in these holes. Helicoils are bomber if installed correctly. You also would be placing the helicoils in the ski material itself instead of relying on the screw/machinable epoxy interface.

IMO it's important to fill the hole, punch the new location precisely, drill pilot, and then drill as you normally would if you're putting in an insert or helicoil and trying to move the mount slightly. If you try to use the existing holes as a guide for inserts/helicoils without altering them, it will be nearly impossible to move the hole position significantly when making the hole bigger. The bigger bit will just want to fall into the old hole no matter what.

Personally I'd do option #2.

**gregL** · 12-17-2014, 07:11 PM

If putting in the upper right screw pulls the entire toe out of line, the bottom two are not that tight. Try replacing the Torx20 screws with Pozi #3 screws, use a good grippy Pozi driver, and crank them down more. If you can get the upper right one in without twisting the toe, you'll probably be fine filling the upper left one with JB Weld and redrilling, or dropping an insert in just that hole.

**I've seen black diamonds!** · 12-17-2014, 07:12 PM

Originally Posted by tsk01

From what I know, I thought the material you fill the hole with has to be the exact same density as the surrounding material, otherwise the drill bit will wonder. I could be wrong, but this is what I thought.

Know anybody with a drill press? I would fill the holes and re-drill with drill press. If I were worried about the amount of filler material around the screw I would then install inserts, as the larger hole required would probably eliminate all the filler.

**tsk01** · 12-17-2014, 07:34 PM

Thanks for all the replies guys. I've filled the holes with epoxy and will be using a method very similar to what whatsupdoc suggested, hoping by using a small bit for a centre hole and working up to a big enough bit will prevent it from wondering.. Waiting till tomorrow night for the epoxy to set fully, I'll report back, hopefully with good news.

**wooley12** · 12-17-2014, 07:49 PM

And this time tighten the screws in a cross pattern and keep checking the heel/pin fit so that if all the holes are off a smidge it doesn't end up a big miss in the last one you tighten.

I've redistributed a single miss like yours among the other holes successfully a time or 3 with a careful cross pattern tightening down.

**shafty85** · 12-17-2014, 09:23 PM

Originally Posted by tsk01

Thanks for all the replies guys. I've filled the holes with epoxy and will be using a method very similar to what whatsupdoc suggested, hoping by using a small bit for a centre hole and working up to a big enough bit will prevent it from wondering.. Waiting till tomorrow night for the epoxy to set fully, I'll report back, hopefully with good news.

If you want to be super accurate, use the binding as your drill guide. Tighten the rear screw so there is no wiggle. Choose the bit that is the same size as the binding hole and use that to drill a small dimple. Remove the binding and use the dimple as your centre punch and complete the hole using the correct size bit.