Police Behaving Badly

[ill-advised strategy]

Are there any cops who post here? Like, on the forum... not necessarily in this thread.

With as many of us as there are, it would almost be weird if there wasn’t... right?

[stealurface831]

Are there any cops who post here? Like, on the forum... not necessarily in this thread.

With as many of us as there are, it would almost be weird if there wasn’t... right?

if i was a cop, i wouldn't make it known on here.

[abraham]

Are there any cops who post here? Like, on the forum... not necessarily in this thread.

With as many of us as there are, it would almost be weird if there wasn’t... right?

Yes there are, maybe former. Cops or posters.

[ill-advised strategy]

Well it’s worth considering. They’re not aliens after all.
This shit has to be so messed up if you’re a truly good person trying to get through your day in that job, and all the “do I leave and start over because this is messed up or do I stay and try to fix it” kind of stuff.

[glademaster]

Well it’s worth considering. They’re not aliens after all.
This shit has to be so messed up if you’re a truly good person trying to get through your day in that job, and all the “do I leave and start over because this is messed up or do I stay and try to fix it” kind of stuff.

Good people don't get into that line of work.

[ill-advised strategy]

My cousin, who is as good as they come, is a detective who is solving cold case rapes. She was a star college basketball player and wanted an active exciting kind of job. I think my cop uncle, her dad, was a Dick... but she really is 100% not evil or stupid.

[Core Shot]

Good people don't get into that line of work.

Fuck. Off.

And politicians are pure as snow. Gimme a break.

I bet more cops are normal people that join for benefits and pay, or helping out, as opposed to the sociopaths that run for office.

Not to say that the ten or thirty percent of copfucks are also sociopaths.

I’ve known a dozen cops irl. And the only one I disliked was my uncle by marriage, before the divorce p. Ymmv.

[Sirshredalot]

Yes there are, maybe former. Cops or posters.

I used to work for a federal law enforcement agency, but I was an analyst with a desk, not public facing LEO with the pocket commission and/or gun.

And I think this thread is state and local oriented. Feds are a different ball of wax.

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[Harry]

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[Kinnikinnick]

So serious question:

Do people have a right to physically resist arrest?


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[ill-advised strategy]

So serious question:

Do people have a right to physically resist arrest?


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That kind of seems like a question that can illuminate lots of deep divisions in how people view life and policing and society. The whole discourse around the concept of rights is fraught with hardwired conceptual differences. There are going to be people whose primary alignment is toward the law, there are others who primarily take moral or religious or philosophical points of view where the circumstances of the situation dictate thinking about the participants’ rights.

So, I guess, for discussion, setting aside the legal system, is it a natural human right to resist capture and detainment by another human being? My instinct is to say yes, but I have to acknowledge my whole basis in thinking about these kinds of issues comes from a view that we’re one with Nature, the laws of nature are how our molecules form and behave, our evolved responses to stimuli should be recognized as, if not socially positive, at least inherent to our creation as a species. I generally take the view that you never really win the war fighting Nature, you may win some battles but you don’t win the war. So recognizing rights that align with our evolved natural predominant traits makes sense to me. And this resistance to capture is our nature.

But also, the entire setup of overpopulated industrialized human existence is a war with Nature, that we will lose. So our our Nature to control territory and kill enemies and fear strangers and escape capture, all this stuff is constantly at odds with the modern way of life... where rights and boundaries and laws and authorities are established to wage battle after battle in this ongoing war with Nature, which we will eventually lose.

Given the above, I find myself compromising, with the frustrating response: it’s situational. If due process were trustworthy, if jails weren’t hellholes, then I think I’d have an easier time snapping into the idea that anyone should submit to arrest and let the system work. But under the circumstances of an inefficient and corrupt and deeply unjust, almost-predatory legal system, I have a really hard time saying an innocent person doesn’t have a right to escape capture from these police who are essentially functioning as tentacles of a giant predatory machine.

For me, if you want innocent people to submit peacefully to arrest, you better fucking fix the legal system so they have confidence they’ll be processed correctly and released unharmed. Otherwise “get the fuck away from me, get the fuck off me” is an entirely understandable response from somebody who knows this huge machine is trying to eat them, they get captured and digested by this huge macro-organism “the legal system”...”the correctional system”... they’re just food or fuel for that machine. As a right, I don’t know, but it’s pretty natural to resist becoming food or fuel for that predatory process.

[Bunion 2020]

Good people don't get into that line of work.

Really now? How many do you actually know?

I patrolled with a FT MT State Trooper and a Gallatin County Sheriffs Deputy and they are two of the best people I have ever been around.

[jono]

That kind of seems like a question that can illuminate lots of deep divisions in how people view life and policing and society. The whole discourse around the concept of rights is fraught with hardwired conceptual differences. There are going to be people whose primary alignment is toward the law, there are others who primarily take moral or religious or philosophical points of view where the circumstances of the situation dictate thinking about the participants’ rights.

So, I guess, for discussion, setting aside the legal system, is it a natural human right to resist capture and detainment by another human being? My instinct is to say yes, but I have to acknowledge my whole basis in thinking about these kinds of issues comes from a view that we’re one with Nature, the laws of nature are how our molecules form and behave, our evolved responses to stimuli should be recognized as, if not socially positive, at least inherent to our creation as a species. I generally take the view that you never really win the war fighting Nature, you may win some battles but you don’t win the war. So recognizing rights that align with our evolved natural predominant traits makes sense to me. And this resistance to capture is our nature.

But also, the entire setup of overpopulated industrialized human existence is a war with Nature, that we will lose. So our our Nature to control territory and kill enemies and fear strangers and escape capture, all this stuff is constantly at odds with the modern way of life... where rights and boundaries and laws and authorities are established to wage battle after battle in this ongoing war with Nature, which we will eventually lose.

Given the above, I find myself compromising, with the frustrating response: it’s situational. If due process were trustworthy, if jails weren’t hellholes, then I think I’d have an easier time snapping into the idea that anyone should submit to arrest and let the system work. But under the circumstances of an inefficient and corrupt and deeply unjust, almost-predatory legal system, I have a really hard time saying an innocent person doesn’t have a right to escape capture from these police who are essentially functioning as tentacles of a giant predatory machine.

For me, if you want innocent people to submit peacefully to arrest, you better fucking fix the legal system so they have confidence they’ll be processed correctly and released unharmed. Otherwise “get the fuck away ftom me, get the fuck off me” is an entirely understandable response.

Yup. Which means violating the rights of an arrested person threatens all peaceful arrests. So violations of suspects' rights (whether by the courts or officers or guards) are the single greatest threat to the safety of police officers. Those who don't train and hold each other accountable for that fact are either ignorant, stupid or have something they value more than the safety of police officers. Many of those are sociopaths but they're all behaving badly.

[old goat]

We have a neighbor who does bomb disposal for the California Highway Patrol. I don't care if he's the biggest jerk in the world (he's not, although lately he's taken to hanging a very large American flag on the front wall of his house)--if he's willing to do that kind of work then I'm a fan.

[Gerome]

Fuck



Driving while black. In a service uniform

Wow, fuck those fucking piece of shit pigs. Did they forget that they have to provide reason for the stop?


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[Dantheman]

So serious question:

Do people have a right to physically resist arrest?

The point that you seem to be missing is that it's not uncommon for brown people to fully comply and get shot anyway. Regardless, unless a suspect is a mass murderer trying to flee should not give an officer the right to kill you.

[m2711c]

“stop resisting” is a phrase commonly heard coming out of a cops mouth while he’s pummeling a man on the ground that’s not moving.

[ex-powderbroker]

GET OUT OF THE CAR RIGHT NOW, SLOWLY, PUT YOUR HANDS OUTSIDE OF THE WINDOW, GET OUT OF THE CAR, WHAT'S YOUR RANK, I SAID GET YOUR HANDS OUT OF THE WINDOW OUT OF THE CAR!

UH OH I DIDN'T SAY SIMON SAYS

[simple]

GET OUT OF THE CAR RIGHT NOW, SLOWLY, PUT YOUR HANDS OUTSIDE OF THE WINDOW, GET OUT OF THE CAR, WHAT'S YOUR RANK, I SAID GET YOUR HANDS OUT OF THE WINDOW OUT OF THE CAR!

UH OH I DIDN'T SAY SIMON SAYS

I used that same analogy today. pyschopath cop simon says and your life depends on it.

[thedude2340]

My old man was a cop for 27 years, last third in homicide in an “active” burb of Denver. He’s a great human, we have fascinating conversations about these issues.

In summary, there are good and bad humans in all walks, coos no exception. He also states that he, nor his colleagues, signed up for the job to get killed. So that’s always hovering on the psyche. But there’s also no excuse for obvious, nefarious behavior.

That’s all to say that like all things, policing and human interaction is nuanced. The “bad guys” don’t have rules nor play by them. It’s no doubt a mindfuck. Sadly cops die too, and also do really great things. My old man put away some really bad people and seemingly did it the right way. Got into some nasty scuffles but never fired in the line of duty and was proud of his restraint. And no, not a racist, not a meathead, not an any other stereotype you can drum up. Skinny and in shape in fact!

To say that “all cops” are this/that is basic and disingenuous. But that’s all been said. He’s sad about the current state of affairs, but we can discuss each individual situation in the news and with nuance and common sense come to conclusions that vary.

[concretejungle]

Wow, fuck those fucking piece of shit pigs. Did they forget that they have to provide reason for the stop?


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Um, he’s black.

[ex-powderbroker]

I used that same analogy today. pyschopath cop simon says and your life depends on it.

Ha, it's a good one. I'll never forget the Philando Castile shooting, it was the same thing.

KEEP YOUR HANDS WHERE I CAN SEE THEM AND GIVE ME YOUR ID

i am reaching into my pocket to get you my id

I SAID KEEP YOUR HANDS WHERE I CAN SEE THEM AND GIVE ME YOUR ID

sir, i am reaching into my pocket to get you my id

DONT YOU FUCKING MOVE AND GIVE ME YOUR ID


------


fuck

[seano732]

Chicago about to go through some things.....CPD shoots unarmed 13 year old and kills him:

https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/15/us/ad...era/index.html

[Hopeless Sinner]

My old man was a cop for 27 years, last third in homicide in an “active” burb of Denver. He’s a great human, we have fascinating conversations about these issues.

In summary, there are good and bad humans in all walks, coos no exception. He also states that he, nor his colleagues, signed up for the job to get killed. So that’s always hovering on the psyche. But there’s also no excuse for obvious, nefarious behavior.

That’s all to say that like all things, policing and human interaction is nuanced. The “bad guys” don’t have rules nor play by them. It’s no doubt a mindfuck. Sadly cops die too, and also do really great things. My old man put away some really bad people and seemingly did it the right way. Got into some nasty scuffles but never fired in the line of duty and was proud of his restraint. And no, not a racist, not a meathead, not an any other stereotype you can drum up. Skinny and in shape in fact!

To say that “all cops” are this/that is basic and disingenuous. But that’s all been said. He’s sad about the current state of affairs, but we can discuss each individual situation in the news and with nuance and common sense come to conclusions that vary.

Thank you, wrote something to the same effect, but in the end didn't even think the statement was worth replying to. And I've had more than my share of very negative experiences w cops.

[seano732]

And then there’s this, out of Baltimore:

“Cops carried toy guns to plant on people they shot.” For fuck sake.....

https://www.vice.com/en/article/8xvz...-reveals-vgtrn