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  1. #701
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
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    Donner Summit
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    720

  2. #702
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Ventura Highway in the Sunshine
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    21,397
    It's cheaper to pick off customers then to fix the problems. Everybody already hates PG&E, and they are likely to be sold or broken up shortly, so might as well pillage the business for as much as they can before the executtives skip town (or get tarred and feathered.)

    I agree it is a constitutional right for Americans to be assholes...its just too bad that so many take the opportunity...
    iscariot

  3. #703
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    4,491
    it looks like "the suck" is going to begin for me tomorrow morning. we're currently only forecasted for wind with moderate humidity. no NWS-issued wind advisory, red flag warning, or anything like that. teledad may have fresh snow on the ground at his house when he looses power.

    NWS is predicting another dry north wind event next monday! yee-haw!!!

  4. #704
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Ventura Highway in the Sunshine
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    At least here in soCal we have a little rain, if nothing else, at least there is moisture in the air.

    I agree it is a constitutional right for Americans to be assholes...its just too bad that so many take the opportunity...
    iscariot

  5. #705
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    4,491
    it rained up to 0.25" here last night, it's been lightly snowing at donner pass. we have no red flag warning (or wind advisory), humidity is in the upper 30's, and PG&E is scheduled to cut power in the next hour. there are areas nearby that have been under a red flag warning since yesterday (and no rain) that have not been predicted to lose power.

    our power was scheduled to be cut at ~7am. PG&E has now re-scheduled it for ~11am. but by 6-ish, PG&E had not updated their re-schedule timing and all the schools had cancelled for the day and many local businesses had already made the call to not open for the day. and adding to the fun, some of the local area will not lose power. so there are bizes open, but employees need to figure out what to do about their kids who's schools have been cancelled for the day.

    my current theory is that there are some major vulnerabilities that PG&E has discovered (or known about) in some of its transmission or localized distribution systems that it has not been able to address. i'm curious is this is going to go on (regardless of relative humidity) until fuels moisture reaches a certain level or some other threshold is met that PG&E has not been very forthcoming about.

    good times

  6. #706
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    4,491
    And PGE just cancelled the outage in my area. :sigh:

  7. #707
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Duluth
    Posts
    2,684
    Is it still burning, or a big mud pit? Congrats on some rain/snow.
    If the shocker don't rock her, then Dr. Spock her. Dad.

  8. #708
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
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    11,182
    Mud pit. Raining pretty hard right now.
    And I guess that I just don't know

  9. #709
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
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    Posts
    11,182
    California bans insurers from dropping policies.
    https://www.sacbee.com/news/business...238077219.html
    And I guess that I just don't know

  10. #710
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    2 hours from anything
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    8,100
    Quote Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper View Post
    California bans insurers from dropping policies.
    https://www.sacbee.com/news/business...238077219.html
    Only in the areas there were fires in 19. But the California insurance market is a major mess. It’s a pretty basic problem that highlights a bad case of government interference and over regulation. Tell insurers they can’t charge more, then mandate certain super expensive coverages (36 months of alternative living expense), almost mandate full replacement cost, etc. of course the insurers stop writing policies. Insurers are also just completely pulling out of the state. You can’t tell insurers they have to insure a house for $1,000 a year when that house is likely to incur losses of $1,500 a year and expect them to stick around.

  11. #711
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    4,431
    So .... if we got rid go all insurance, would that dissuade people from building explosively combustible residences in known fire traps? For that matter, live more healthily, drive more safely, etc, etc?

  12. #712
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Ventura Highway in the Sunshine
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    21,397
    No, people will build were ever it is reasonable to build. Some areas ha e more exposure then others, but all places ahve their own issues, being floor, tornado, fire, asshole neighbor, et al. There is no safe place to build, just so e areas are less safe then others.

    Just a side note, but the insurance companies are not losing money insuring these homes. First off, they are insured against many of these loses, and secondly, the recover nearly all their loses from lawsuits against the cause of the fire, in California's case, the utilities. Let's just say Edison International's is not losing money.

    I agree it is a constitutional right for Americans to be assholes...its just too bad that so many take the opportunity...
    iscariot

  13. #713
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    truckee
    Posts
    11,426
    "The insurance companies in California lost more money in 2017 -2018 as they made from 1991-2016. From the NYT 12/5:
    The state’s homeowners insurers lost a total $20 billion in the 2017 and 2018 wildfires, according to an analysis published in October by Milliman, an actuary and consulting firm. That’s twice the industry’s cumulative profits since major wildfires in 1991. A line of business that was until recently profitable is now unprofitable, the authors wrote, 'exposed to a severe peril that is neither easily measured nor fully understood.' " As far as reinsurance the reinsurance companies are raising their rates and the homeowners' insurers can't pass the cost to rate payers without approval of the insurance commissioner.

    As far as recovering their losses from PG&E, the settlement announced today will go to victims, some govt agencies, and of course lawyers. None is intended for insurance companies. They are supposed to cover their payouts with premiums. If they fail to charge enough (which of course is controlled by the insurance commissioner) that's their problem.

  14. #714
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    4,491
    Where I live, the heartbreaking stories are multi-decade retired homeowners that have used a single insurer for those decades and are now living on ssd or ssdi that are losing their coverage....
    Last edited by bodywhomper; 12-07-2019 at 12:26 AM.

  15. #715
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
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    2 hours from anything
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    8,100
    Quote Originally Posted by hutash View Post
    Just a side note, but the insurance companies are not losing money insuring these homes. First off, they are insured against many of these loses, and secondly, the recover nearly all their loses from lawsuits against the cause of the fire, in California's case, the utilities. Let's just say Edison International's is not losing money.
    Typically partially reinsured but still significant losses. Almost no one fully reinsures. Secondly, the utilities, or any liable party “only” owes ACV, not replacement, not alternative living expense, code upgrades, etc. Further they have to pay someone (adjusters, lawyers, accountants, and we aren’t cheap) to subrogate all those claims. So a first party insurance company is lucky to recover 25-30%, if the utility doesn’t go bankrupt.

    Quote Originally Posted by old goat View Post
    As far as recovering their losses from PG&E, the settlement announced today will go to victims, some govt agencies, and of course lawyers. None is intended for insurance companies. They are supposed to cover their payouts with premiums. If they fail to charge enough (which of course is controlled by the insurance commissioner) that's their problem.
    The insurers are not party to that suit but still suing as far as I know. Insurers are entitled to recover the acv.

  16. #716
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    Dec 2005
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    An article, in an interesting format, about eucalyptus and fire in California.
    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...ironment-comic

    Just goes to show how emotional these issues can get.
    And I guess that I just don't know

  17. #717
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    Jan 2008
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    truckee
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper View Post
    An article, in an interesting format, about eucalyptus and fire in California.
    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...ironment-comic

    Just goes to show how emotional these issues can get.
    It's not just eucalyptus. the native grasses of CA were drought adapted and stayed green all summer--presumably less flammable. The "golden" hills are covered with introduced grasses that crowded out the native plants.
    People have also got used to the idea that forests are dense growths of trees you can barely walk through, let alone drive a covered wagon through. They get upset when they find out what forest thinning for fire prevention actually means, even though they can't get insurance.

  18. #718
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    4,491
    currently, the insurance companies do not seem to care whether private property meets (or exceeds) the 100-foot defensible space requirements.

    regarding that comic, something worth mentioning was that part of that project proceeded with federal FEMA $$. there were a lot of problems with the euc projects in the east bay hills. one of the bigger problems: the biomass of the eucs would mostly remain in place (chipped) and not be hauled away. another was that the NGO established in support of the project was lead by the contractor that helped to develop/plan the projects with the UC, who was also known to be awarded the competitive bids to complete the work, which had previously been documented to not implement the project/treatment that they had developed.

  19. #719
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    Dec 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by old goat View Post
    It's not just eucalyptus. the native grasses of CA were drought adapted and stayed green all summer--presumably less flammable. The "golden" hills are covered with introduced grasses that crowded out the native plants.
    Same thing all over the west. Death to cheatgrass.

    People have no idea that forests are not naturally dense growths of trees you can barely walk through, let alone drive a covered wagon through. They get upset when they find out what forest thinning for fire prevention actually means, even though they can't get insurance.
    Fixed
    And I guess that I just don't know

  20. #720
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    4,491
    i missed that point earlier about forest density. lots of truth to that. one of my adjacent property neighbors, a boomer and (now admittedly misinformed) treehugger... she and her husband had the most minimum clearance necessary in the early 70's to build their home in a dense pondo stand. 45 years later, that stand of trees grew w/o any efforts made to thin, until all the trees (over 70 on a half-ish acre) died from pine beetle. The dead trees were harvested a few years ago and that half acre (no maintenance done since the timber harvest) is now filling in with scotch broom.... good times!

  21. #721
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    truckee
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    11,426
    Quote Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper View Post
    Same thing all over the west. Death to cheatgrass.


    Fixed
    you said it better. thanks

  22. #722
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Posts
    29,936
    So I guess the blackouts extended all the way to the Sierra summit, as I just heard about a guy with an indoor weed crop around the Sugar Bowl area who said his $20K worth of plants froze when the lights went out.

  23. #723
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    4,491
    Isn’t Sierra summit near Fresno?!

    And the answer is yes. They de-energized that transmission line.

  24. #724
    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    Posts
    6
    Wow, it isn't funny.

  25. #725
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Donner Summit
    Posts
    720
    Quote Originally Posted by splat View Post
    So I guess the blackouts extended all the way to the Sierra summit, as I just heard about a guy with an indoor weed crop around the Sugar Bowl area who said his $20K worth of plants froze when the lights went out.
    Shit just got real...

    Just got my home insurance bill, premium almost doubled from last year (same policy, no new claims). Guess I should be happy they didn't drop me.

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