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  1. #8176
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    inpdx
    Posts
    19,532
    NeverthelessÖIíd check on whether & how thatís been tested

  2. #8177
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Your Mom's House
    Posts
    8,156
    Quote Originally Posted by fatnslow View Post
    It's a single slot subpanel that has ONE double pole 20/20. Trying to find out IF I can just replace with a quadplex and be done rather than replace the current one that accepts a quadplex. My house has a combo of glass screw in fuses and some breakers.
    That sounds like a disconnect, not a subpanel.
    What wire gauge feeds it? Where is it fed from, and what size breaker/fuse is on the feed?

  3. #8178
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    3,069
    Quote Originally Posted by adrenalated View Post
    That sounds like a disconnect, not a subpanel.
    What wire gauge feeds it? Where is it fed from, and what size breaker/fuse is on the feed?
    I think I'm answering my question by reading your responses. First image is the label from the Murray box, it states 40 amp max which is the 20 amps on each leg of the double pole breaker it currently uses. My assumption is it is fed by 6 gauge ? I'll need to source a different box that's rated for 80 amps that will fit a quadplex and run appropriate gauge supply line to it. The most this circuit will pull will be 25-30 amps since the cadet unit is tiny and only runs in the winter for a unused bedroom, maybe 2-3 day a month. the other device is a mini split that pulls about 15 amps. Max draw is about 15 amps but this will be used all year AC and heat pump.

    Click image for larger version. 

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  4. #8179
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Your Mom's House
    Posts
    8,156
    It is a 240V, 20A circuit. The voltage is additive, not the amperage.
    Not to be a jerk but you should strongly consider hiring an electrician. 240V wiring is nothing to fuck with.

  5. #8180
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    base of the Bush
    Posts
    14,627
    This ^^

    Glass fuses ect, haven't seen that since I was a kid on the farm. How many pennies in the box
    www.apriliaforum.com

    "If the road You followed brought you to this,of what use was the road"?

    "I have no idea what I am talking about but would be happy to share my biased opinions as fact on the matter. "
    Ottime

  6. #8181
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    3,069
    Quote Originally Posted by adrenalated View Post
    It is a 240V, 20A circuit. The voltage is additive, not the amperage.
    Not to be a jerk but you should strongly consider hiring an electrician. 240V wiring is nothing to fuck with.
    Probably going that way when I need to add the second device. My initial plan was I could use the existing box and just get a quadplex but it looks like that's a no go.

  7. #8182
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    SLC, Utah
    Posts
    3,765
    As of today the remodel is officially complete. I need to install a stove, and I still want to do a new deck, but the actual remodel portion is done.

    Never again.

    Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using Tapatalk

  8. #8183
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    In a van... down by the river
    Posts
    12,400
    Quote Originally Posted by tgapp View Post
    Never again.
    QFT.

  9. #8184
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Į\_(ツ)_/Į
    Posts
    10,978
    Quote Originally Posted by tgapp View Post
    As of today the remodel is officially complete. I need to install a stove, and I still want to do a new deck, but the actual remodel portion is done.

    Never again.

    Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using Tapatalk
    Hell yeah. Looks great!

    And same. Never again!

  10. #8185
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Dystopia
    Posts
    19,870
    Quote Originally Posted by adrenalated View Post
    It is a 240V, 20A circuit. The voltage is additive, not the amperage.
    Not to be a jerk but you should strongly consider hiring an electrician. 240V wiring is nothing to fuck with.
    480 is nothing to Fuck with. 240 is fine. Every panel is 240. Every double breaker is 240 (or 220, depending on your dialect).

    Iíd replace the panel just based on the button fuses.

    Adding a sub panel (or heíll, replacing the main panel) ainít hard or dangerous if you just unscrew the meter. But you have to make sure you donít overload your service drop.

    PS. If you replace the sub panel donít get a quadplex. The cadet is 20 and the split is 15 amps. Just use two breakers. Wired a split two years ago and couldnít believe I was using 14 gauge wire.
    PPS how is the sub panel fed? Off a breaker or direct clamp at the top of the main panel?

  11. #8186
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    3,069
    Quote Originally Posted by Core Shot View Post
    480 is nothing to Fuck with. 240 is fine. Every panel is 240. Every double breaker is 240 (or 220, depending on your dialect).

    Iíd replace the panel just based on the button fuses.

    Adding a sub panel (or heíll, replacing the main panel) ainít hard or dangerous if you just unscrew the meter. But you have to make sure you donít overload your service drop.

    PS. If you replace the sub panel donít get a quadplex. The cadet is 20 and the split is 15 amps. Just use two breakers. Wired a split two years ago and couldnít believe I was using 14 gauge wire.
    PPS how is the sub panel fed? Off a breaker or direct clamp at the top of the main panel?
    I do some business with electrical companies and plan on consulting pros on exactly how it's currently set up and how to lay things out to make this legit. Right now the cadet isn't hooked up, I just wired the mini split in its place.
    Holy shit this MF'er just fought me every step of the way all the way with my fuck ups starting with ordering wrong size lines to my old manifold gauge dial being fucked up when I had to pull vacuum on the new lines and air handler before topping off refrigerant. Finally wrapped up last night and it's gonna be sweet having cool summers and warm winters. I should have known when I walked out of a guys garage with a $50 mini split with pretzels for lines.
    Pro installs start at $2k for simple back/back but this involved an upstairs unit mounted on a interior wall with some tricky line bending. Ordered a ratcheting tube bender for the task and it made making turns very easy without kinking lines trying to hand bend 5/8 copper.
    Still have some cosmetic shit to take care of but the unit is cooling like it's mid winter on a ski hill.

  12. #8187
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    slc
    Posts
    17,176
    Quote Originally Posted by tgapp View Post
    As of today the remodel is officially complete. I need to install a stove, and I still want to do a new deck, but the actual remodel portion is done.

    Never again.

    Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using Tapatalk
    Looks great!

  13. #8188
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Ogden
    Posts
    8,643
    Quote Originally Posted by tgapp View Post
    As of today the remodel is officially complete. I need to install a stove, and I still want to do a new deck, but the actual remodel portion is done.

    Never again.

    Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using Tapatalk
    Nice, what will you do with all of your free time now?

  14. #8189
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Location
    59715
    Posts
    6,721
    I've been saying "never again" every year since I can't fucking remember.

  15. #8190
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    truckee
    Posts
    22,226
    Quote Originally Posted by zion zig zag View Post
    Nice, what will you do with all of your free time now?
    Make furniture

  16. #8191
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Posts
    12,111
    As I gear up to retain the deck again this summer I faintly remember saying "Never Again" last time I stripped and sanded it. This time it is just a maintenance coat though. Next time I'm going trex or something low maintenance.

  17. #8192
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    SLC, Utah
    Posts
    3,765
    now I spend all my free time cleaning all this space instead of living in a construction zone

    not sure if i came out ahead or not on this one

    Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using Tapatalk

  18. #8193
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    seatown
    Posts
    3,963

    Home Remodel: Do, Don'ts, Advice

    needs more coffee paraphernalia

    lookin good mang! cool to see it finished up

  19. #8194
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    SLC, Utah
    Posts
    3,765
    Quote Originally Posted by shroom View Post
    needs more coffee paraphernalia

    lookin good mang! cool to see it finished up
    ahahahaha don't encourage me

    next time you come to Utah I'll have a legit guest bedroom, come ski jp next year

    Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using Tapatalk

  20. #8195
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    3,069
    Adventures in mini-split installation. My next door neighbor recently installed central air at their home and the OTHER neighbor decided to cut down a tree that provided some decent shade to my upstairs area increasing the temp to an already warm in the summer /cold in the winter of my 1930 Tudor house. I have been using a window unit for the last 15 years and in the best scenario it's kind of a PITA with the noise and all things associated with it. Keep in mind my wife works from home in this space as well as this where our bedroom is located.
    We had toyed with the idea of a mini split and I start shopping a bit and find they offer DIY versions for not too much dough, $1200-2000.
    Being a cheap bastard I start scouring all the usual used spots, Craigslist, Offerup, FB... I find a guy selling a system for $300 and set up a time to take a look. The details of the unit are kind of funny and when I google the model/serial not much is available so i reach out to the MFG and have a brief conversation. Turns out this is a gray market unit they specifically sold through indoor grow supply houses IE targeting indoor weed growers. I have another conversation with the owner and he tells me he actually bought it at a local "garden supply" store for $2k and it was pulled out of his house for a remodel and now his house is for sale and won't be reinstalling it. I asked if he ever used in a grow op and he answers that was his initial plan but used it residentially. Sounds good enough, Ill take a look. I show up and it's in a garage shoved into a corner along with ALL HIS OTHER SHIT . The units(indoor/outdoor) look clean and I don't smell any funk but the line set is bent like a pretzel with kinks all over the lines. Nice enough guy and i was honest and said the messed up line set sacred me and I was going to pass BUT if doesn't sell it to let me know and I would make a low ball offer at that time. he looks at me and says, " how about $50, I just want it gone." So I give him his $50, load it up and drive away.......That's when the real adventure begins.

    I unload the thing in my garage, connect the lines(these are the DIY quick connect variety), poach 240 out of my breaker box using romex just to test and it fires up cools like crazy and heats as well.

    I spend some time plotting where to run power, place the outdoor unit and mount the air handler inside. Well it turns out I can't install the exterior facing wall due to windows and need to do a interior wall mount requiring some copper tube bending. I mess with the existing lines to reuse them but it's a lost cause because they must have at least 20m kinks in them and I need to have a 14' straight run. No big deal, I'll order a new set of lines and have the proprietary connectors brazed on the new lines . I make a shopping list and get on Amazon: new lines, tube bender some misc other shit. I look a bit into braising and it requires an acetylene torch BUT I find they sell quick connectors for ac lines for a reasonable price. I head to the supply house with a wall of them BUT they tell me they can't sell to me cause I got no license or nota HVAC company. Fuck them, order on line and good to go so I think. As I wait for all my new toys to arrive I plot my power run. It's fairly simple because I have a subpanel with 240 feeding a small cadet heater and the new mini only needs 20 amps. I have to run wire through a celig with lathe/plaster and trying to prevent cutting a hole in it. To make this happen I have to drill through a joist brace that's 80" from the closest opening. No problem, I have a 54" flex bit and they sell 54" extensions- 54+54=108, plenty of length to spare. I drill an access hole from the exterior, slide in the bit/extensions until I hit the wood. start drilling, get some purchase and next it stops turning. back it out a turn, then forward UNTIL no movement. Try backing it out again and then free spin. Extract my setup to find the bit/extension has separated. WTF was I thinking this was going to work. Slide my borescope in there and the bit is augured a good 1 1/2 in a corner where the joist meets the brace. Fuck me ! I won't bore anyone with failure #2 cause I ultimately ended up cutting a small hole and ran the wire where it needed to go after wasting alot of time with other just as stupid ideas only to give up and come back to cutting a hole in the ceiling.
    After the power fiasco is cleared up my supplies shows up. Turns out I'm not very good and measuring diameter of copper lines because ordered the wrong size lines which means my connectors also are the wrong size and the tube bender I ordered won't work because they max out at 1/2" and the correct lines are 3/8 and 5/8. Holy mother of HVAC gods I wasn't trying to cheat the guy out of his $250, I passed and he offered it to me for $50.....

    Thank god for Amazon and their liberal return policy-all the wrong Items are returned without eating restock/freight charges and correct items are ordered. Wait until they show up and now with a fancy ratchet copper tube bender to make this thing look pro. Saturday comes around with enough time for me to attack this bad boy. Hang the interior unit, hole saw some siding, use the pimp bending tool to make a bunch of 90 degree bends inside and outside because OF COUSE I have a first floor window to go around. Lines all installed ! All I have to do is pull vacuum, open the condenser gas ports and top off some refrigerant my friend gave me a few years back.(I'm a fucking pack rat have some weird shit like refrigerant in my garage). My old manifold gauge set I inherited from my uncle decides the dials will be fucked up messing with me and not be able to verify vacuum(very critical step to show I don 'have a leak), I end up having to borrow a set .
    Pull vacuum, hold for 30 minutes !!!!! I start the unit and it ends up drinking much more refrigerant than I thought it would need. BUT It's cold like a Noreaster' in January in my bedroom now and happy/cool wife will give a coupe of fuck ups of free forgiveness in the near future.
    This might have been the most f'ed up project I have ever done due to my own incomitance but it all worked out in the end for about $500 and countless hours and MF'ers screamed will have saved me about $2-3K.
    Still not fully finished - need to use some vinyl downspout to cover the lines and paint to match exterior and add a subpanel to hold another 20/20 breaker for the cadet heater and patch the hole in my ceiling. Maybe done by 2024 ?

  21. #8196
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    3,343
    In the battle of time vs. money... you have lost this round.

  22. #8197
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    3,069
    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post
    In the battle of time vs. money... you have lost this round.
    I'm not a dentist, my kids are out of the house so I have free time these days and college tuition/wife is expensive.

  23. #8198
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    SF & the Ho
    Posts
    8,505
    I just set aside 3k and scratched any plausible desire of getting a deal on a split and doing a self install!

  24. #8199
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Dystopia
    Posts
    19,870
    FYI short runs on a split are bad.
    I was told to coil extra copper in the wall on a short run for my last install.

    Impressed that you vac and charge your own shit. That’s the one part I’ve had to hire out.

  25. #8200
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    3,069
    Quote Originally Posted by Core Shot View Post
    FYI short runs on a split are bad.
    I was told to coil extra copper in the wall on a short run for my last install.

    Impressed that you vac and charge your own shit. That’s the one part I’ve had to hire out.
    I've done a lot of auto ac work and pulled vacuum countless times. It's the exact same process with a free loaner pump from O'Reilly's or AutoZone. BUT there's a chance I over charged this MF'er. manifold low side gauge that won't work so I borrowed a set but it looks like the low side gauge on that one wasn't too accurate. The units working fine but I don't want to risk burning out the compressor.
    I just ordered one from Amazon just to verify before I call a pro. I actually have a HVAC rabbi I consult before I do anything. An older guy I used to do business with who is retired and lives over an hour away. I basically run down my plan with him before I do anything.
    I'm not completely flying blind. Just made a bunch of mistakes like a blind man.

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