Home Remodel: Do, Don'ts, Advice

[old goat]

Okay, so I have this ridiculous noob question that I hope is not below the level of this thread. I have a ~50yr old house on a small lot. I want to add on an attached 2 story garage/shop/home office, and add a large covered front porch/front entryway which would require an additional roofline.

Where does one start with a project like this, a GC? Architect? Arson/insurance? I'm not interested in doing much or any of the legwork on this, want to hire it all out.

We've done it different ways. Architect and we were the GC, framer, finish carpenter. Architect and separate GC a couple of times. Once we got screwed by the GC on costs (I think he got screwed by his subs and screwed us to not lose his shirt. He's no longer in business). Once I used a very good architect friend, not in Truckee--plan checker gave him a lot of grief and his engineer screwed up the snow loads, but it got straightened out. GC did a fabulous job. (Ron Adams in Truckee.)

The main thing is the reputation of who you hire. It really helps if you know people who have had work done who are enthusiastic about who they used. Design build if you can get a solid recommendation, architect and GC if you can get a solid recommendation for those. If you only can get a good recommendation for one they can suggest the other.

[lifelinksplit]

I'll also add that having a GC and architect/engineer who have a good relationship can make worlds of difference that manifests itself towards saving time/money.

[teleee]

I'll also add that having a GC and architect/engineer who have a good relationship can make worlds of difference that manifests itself towards saving time/money.

I like to call that design build. All one team, working towards a common goal. I’m not as familiar with it in the residential world but in the world of bridges it’s the only way.


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[lifelinksplit]

I like to call that design build. All one team, working towards a common goal. I’m not as familiar with it in the residential world but in the world of bridges it’s the only way.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

I guess I think of design build as all under one outfit. Ime typically most GCs have/do work for multiple architects/engineers and some have worked more with certain firms and relationships can vary. It's kinda splitting hairs but I think you can "sometimes" get a better price with an established GC who has multiple good relationships as opposed to some of the design/build outfits I've seen. Again it varies by locations and situations. I think the best advice is to at least see 3 of their last projects and talk to the clients. This shouldnt be an issue for most outfits, but the good guys are booking out at the very least a year and a half.(I think Rootskier mentioned this about a remodel he's doing).

[::: :::]

In commercial or residential, “design/build” is one contract to the owner. Whoever is “prime” varies, depending on the mode of delivery, but typically it is the general contractor. Other players can be developer, construction manager, designers of various types (mech, civil, arch, etc), or other significant subs. These each could be prime too.

Pros/cons depend on who you’re talking to and what skin they have in the game. There’s good and bad for each arrangement. It boils down to what works best for the owner [not the design/build team].

[teleee]

Where does one start with a project like this, a GC? Architect? Arson/insurance? I'm not interested in doing much or any of the legwork on this, want to hire it all out.

This is what really makes design build attractive to the OP, assuming a competent prime point of contact for the design build he wont have to do all the legwork that goes along with getting his project complete. Someone who can coordinate the permitting process, ensure the architecturals are compliant and what you agree to, make sure they engineering is done in a timely manner and not overkill, sheepdog all the subs, etc...
Assuming you have a good lead on your design build team it is by far the best way for you to avoid the legwork.
And like was mentioned, get recommendations and look at past work, talk to past clients. in my world a large part of the selection matrix is based on past resume and reputation. If you get the selection part right that will minimize your legwork!

[Flounder]

Pros/cons depend on who you’re talking to and what skin they have in the game. There’s good and bad for each arrangement. It boils down to what works best for the owner [not the design/build team].

This 100%.

Since Danny said he wants to hire this out and not have to do anything I'd say he's a good candidate for design build. Could be a full design build or a contractor that has an architect/designer they work with. One person to hire, and he won't get caught between an architect and a contractor when one of them screws up.

[old goat]

I would add that if you have a good recommendation from a reliable friend I wouldn't feel the need to get multiple bids. Reputation/reliability/competence matter more than price, and a contractor who underbids may make it up in change orders. It does help to have an idea of what the job should cost, which an architect should be able to tell you, so you don't go with the "I really don't want this job price". I don't know why contactors are never taught how to say--I'm too busy, or this job looks like a pain in the ass, or you're a pain in the ass, and just say no.

Architects are sometimes paid as a percentage of the estimated cost of the job--so they have an incentive to expand the project beyond what you wanted. Be upfront about what you can afford to spend.

And regardless of who you hire, be clear on who is responsible for dealing with permitting. That can be time consuming and require multiple visits. I can't remember who went to the building dept on all our projects but my wife and I spent a fair amount of time on the addition our Sacramento friend designed for us because we're in Truckee and he's not.

With a remodel or addition expect surprises when things are opened up. Sometimes surprises are expensive.

In some cases, if you want a basic box without anything fancy you might be able to go to an engineer to draw up the plans based on your drawings. Probably cheaper.

The other thing that comes up is the specs and cost allowance for finishes and fixtures. In our projects we have left those out of the contract. We buy and pay for the fixtures, letting the seller know what contractor we're working with. I do the finish carpentry so that makes it simpler. Obviously not everyone wants to go that way, but it's nice to not to have to make too many decisions at the outset. I have no experience with having the designer put cost allowances for that stuff in the contract so I don't know the pitfalls of that.

[dannynoonan]

Damn y'all, great info here, thank you. My deal mostly is, I don't know shit. And I don't know what to watch out for working between a whole bunch of dudes who might want to fuck me or at least skate out on their responsibilities. So I'm liking the idea of a single neck to wring. Time to start buying lotto tickets I guess.

[GimpToo]

Saw posted recently - good advice!

“A CONVERSATION ABOUT PERCEIVED VALUE:

A customer asked a contractor friend of mine how much it would cost to do this project.

My friend gave him a proposal: $4500

The customer responded: That’s seems really high.

My friend asked: What do you think is a reasonable price for this job?

The customer answered: $2500 maximum

My friend responded: Ok, then I invite you to do it yourself.

The customer answered: I don't know how to.

My friend responded: Alright, then how about for $2500 I'll teach you how to. So besides saving you $2000, you'll learn valuable skills that will benefit you in the future.

The customer answered: Sounds good! Let’s do it!

My friend responded: Great! To get started, you are going to need some tools. You will need a chop saw, table saw, cordless drill, bit set, router, skill saw, jig saw, tool belt, hammer, etc..

The customer answered: But I don't have any of those tools and I can't justify buying all of these for one job.

My friend responded: Ok. Well then for an additional $300 I can rent my tools to you to use for this project.

The customer answered: Okay. That’s fair.

My friend responded: Great! We will start the project on Monday.

The customer answered: I work Monday through Friday. I’m only available on the weekends.

My friend responded: If you want to learn from me then you will need to work when I work. This project will take 3 days so you will need to take 3 days off work.

The customer answered: That means I’m going to have to sacrifice my pay for 3 days or use my vacation time!

My friend responded: That’s true. Remember, when you do a job yourself you need to account for unproductive factors.

The customer answered: What do you mean by that?

My friend responded: Doing a job completely from start to finish includes time spent to plan the project, pick up materials, travel time, gas, set up time, clean up, and waste disposal amongst other things. That’s all in addition to the actual project itself. And speaking of materials, that’s where we will start on Monday so I need you to meet me at the lumberyard at 6:00am.

The customer answered: At 6am?!! My work day doesn’t usually start until 8am!

My friend responded: Well then you’re in luck! My plan is to start on the deck build by 8am. But to do so we have to start at 6am to get materials picked up, loaded and delivered to your job site.

The customer answered: You know, I’m realizing that a lot more goes in to a job than what a customer sees in the finished project. Your proposal of $4500 is very reasonable. I would like you to handle the project.

CONCLUSION:

When you pay for a job, especially a custom job, (whether it’s a physical project or digital project) you pay not only for the material and the work to be completed. You also pay for:

✔️ Knowledge
✔️ Experience
✔️ Custom Skills
✔️ Tools
✔️ Time to plan
✔️ Time to prepare
✔️ Professionalism
✔️ Work Ethic
✔️ Excellence
✔️ Discipline
✔️ Commitment
✔️ Integrity
✔️ Taxes
✔️ Licenses
✔️ Sacrifices
✔️ Liabilities
✔️ Insurance

If you request a proposal for custom work to be done, please don’t disrespect a service provider by trying to get them to lower their prices.

If their proposal exceeds your budget, there’s nothing wrong with getting other proposals.

Just remember.. you get what you pay for.

���� SERVICE PROVIDERS: Know your worth and be confident in it.

���� CONSUMERS: Recognize their worth and be respectful of it.

Sharing this to support all my friends, family and clients who are Entrepreneurs, Business Owners and Tradesman.”

[old goat]

Damn y'all, great info here, thank you. My deal mostly is, I don't know shit. And I don't know what to watch out for working between a whole bunch of dudes who might want to fuck me or at least skate out on their responsibilities. So I'm liking the idea of a single neck to wring. Time to start buying lotto tickets I guess.

Chances are your state contractors license board will have a section for consumers about how to go about hiring a contractor, what is a legal remodel contract, things to watch out for like mechanics liens, etc. I strongly recommend you read it. It's better if you don't have to wring any necks.

[Timberridge]

Bunch of pussies in Massachusetts.

"Follow all applicable local plumbing codes when setting the high temperature limit stop. To prevent scald injury, the maximum output temperature of the shower valve must be no higher than 120°F. In Massachusetts, the maximum output temperature can be no higher than 112°F."

[Skidog]

Bunch of pussies in Massachusetts.

"Follow all applicable local plumbing codes when setting the high temperature limit stop. To prevent scald injury, the maximum output temperature of the shower valve must be no higher than 120°F. In Massachusetts, the maximum output temperature can be no higher than 112°F."

do they make a limiter or something? I mean After inspection you just go turn it up??? My shit will burn hands that arent used to it on high hot. Just like I like it.

[old goat]

I set my water heater on 130 on the theory that the hot water will last longer because you use less hot per minute mixed with more cold.

[Timberridge]

You'd go to jail in MA.

[climberevan]

Chances are your state contractors license board will have a section for consumers about how to go about hiring a contractor, what is a legal remodel contract, things to watch out for like mechanics liens, etc. I strongly recommend you read it. It's better if you don't have to wring any necks.

As a contractor, the main things I'd recommend to beginner clients are 1: to get really solid reference (s) from people you trust; and 2: have realistic expectations and a VERY clear understanding of what your contract includes and what it does not. The only time I've had to lien someone was when she decided, despite a clear contract that did not mention it at all, that completely redoing her laundry room would be included in the kitchen remodel.

The design-build option is the way to be least involved, which can be great if that's your preference. It can also result in a design that you're not super stoked on (but which is easy for the contractor), so pay attention. Custom means you can have whatever you're willing to pay for.

Also, be open with whomever you hire about the fact that this is your first time. I always appreciate it when people do that, as it lets me know to give them a little extra hand holding and to not assume they know how things work. (And sometimes, TBH, it lets me know to walk away if they seem like trouble.)

[Timberridge]

[climberevan]

That's a good example of how not to set tile.

[fastfred]

was really high when I met with this customer a couple weeks ago course they wanted a cost while I was standing there thinking about chicken nuggets big tits and making a payment to the man so I said 30k the bitch keeps bugging me about the estiamte start date and all this shit so I do an estimate and it comes out to 90k send it off she gets all pissed cause I said it'd cost 30k then I said I forgot that I didn't include the asbestos remdial learning so that would be an extra 10k she thought I was stupid thankfully I got to the shop and my partner had his mountain bike out and we did bong hits at sat at the confrence table and talked about how stupid people are

[old goat]

That's a good example of how not to set tile.

My wife is good at tile. Laying tile is easy. Laying out tile is hard.

[Vt-Freeheel]

That dumbfuck needs to attach Caligulas tongue to that Rigid and get after that bitch.

[ntblanks]

That dumbfuck needs to attach Caligulas tongue to that Rigid and get after that bitch.

i like the cut of your jib

[Timberridge]

That dumbfuck needs to attach Caligulas tongue to that Rigid and get after that bitch.

Yes, she's made a few mistakes in setting the tile but there's another travesty here. Everybody knows that Fein makes the best oscillating tools. No pro would be using a Rigid. It's probably ok for a second home tool chest, but seriously, get the Fein. It's the Porsche of oscillating tools.

[Timberridge]

was really high when I met with this customer a couple weeks ago course they wanted a cost while I was standing there thinking about chicken nuggets big tits and making a payment to the man so I said 30k the bitch keeps bugging me about the estiamte start date and all this shit so I do an estimate and it comes out to 90k send it off she gets all pissed cause I said it'd cost 30k then I said I forgot that I didn't include the asbestos remdial learning so that would be an extra 10k she thought I was stupid thankfully I got to the shop and my partner had his mountain bike out and we did bong hits at sat at the confrence table and talked about how stupid people are

Fred, wtf is going on out there? Are you putting quotes on the back of a bar napkin? Get yourself an iPad. When you go out to do the estimate start pecking away furiously at the iPad as the chick is talking. It doesn't matter what you are doing. Hit up the Padded Room and check out Viva's Titty Tuesday posts if you want. After she's done, tell her you need to go out to the truck and make a few calls. Multiply the s.f. by $500, $750 or whatever the fuck they are charging in Breck these days. Email her the quote before you pull out the driveway. Trust me here, the iPad lends an air of legitimacy to whatever number you come up with.

[RootSkier]

Yes, she's made a few mistakes in setting the tile but there's another travesty here. Everybody knows that Fein makes the best oscillating tools.

There's nothing at all special about the Fein except that it had the patent so was the only player for a long time. See, e.g., the Festool Domino.

I rock an oscillating tool that I got at Harbor Freight and in the sad pantheon of Harbor Freight power tools, this thing is a superstar, and you'd have to be a fucking moron to pay a premium for a tool that does nothing but oscillate.