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  1. #601
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    Quote Originally Posted by riser3 View Post
    Sweep the forest dude.
    Sweep the leg!!

  2. #602
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    Lytton is a super hot and super dry with lotsa wind

    having said that there was the paddling trip on labor day when it snowed

    3 of us were very fucking cold sharing a derelict shack at the takeout with a dead cat
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  3. #603
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    Quote Originally Posted by pureantigravity View Post
    I did. I was just responding about the idea that these events cannot happen in a pre Eye-Of-Sauron world. They can and do. The media, read CBC, is headlining _Climate Change_ with all this. Today they edited some of the headlines to be more objective. It may or may not but that isn't the problem. I think the problem is that our society depends too much on a select group of agencies to protect against these events. Fire departments can only do so much. We need more grass roots fire prevention and mitigation. There is no reason Lytton needed to fall to this event being they are right beside a huge fresh water river. Vibes to all of Lytton. We love little Lytton.
    This is climate change. Good on the CBC.

    Unfortunately, we are all going to have to switch to a different method of fighting this because of the ignorance of the last 10, 20, 30 + years. After loosing everything in the 2003 fires, I've learnt that with these extreme events, it is too much for any of our organizations to handle. Soon we'll need a volunteer "army" do deal with these extremes..

  4. #604
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    Quote Originally Posted by alive View Post
    Soon we'll need a volunteer "army" do deal with these extremes..
    Train people to provide fire support service and first responder service. Just like other countries have civilians trained in military matters. We just can't depend on a select bunch of trained people scarcely and bureaucratically assigned to communities as a way to fend off these events in the future. We need to adapt to be able to withstand the new climate pressures.
    OH, MY GAWD! ―John Hillerman  Big Billie Eilish fan.
    But that's a quibble to what PG posted (at first, anyway, I haven't read his latest book) ―jono
    we are not arguing about ski boots or fashionable clothing or spageheti O's which mean nothing in the grand scheme ― XXX-er

  5. #605
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    ^^ Checking in from NorCal where we know a few things about devastating fires. Once those things get raging in heavy winds, there’s really only so much you can do. See Paradise, CA outside of Chico. Town is gone and from what I’ve read the Lytton incident seems pretty similar.
    I ski 135 degree chutes switch to the road.

  6. #606
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    Quote Originally Posted by TahoeJ View Post
    ^^ Checking in from NorCal where we know a few things about devastating fires. Once those things get raging in heavy winds, there’s really nothing much you can do. See Paradise, CA outside of Chico. Town is gone and from what I’ve read the Lytton incident seems pretty similar.
    FIFY, vibes to those affected.
    I have been in this State for 30 years and I am willing to admit that I am part of the problem.

    "Happiest years of my life were earning < $8.00 and hour, collecting unemployment every spring and fall, no car, no debt and no responsibilities. 1984-1990 Park City UT"

  7. #607
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    Oh well. We're fucked.
    OH, MY GAWD! ―John Hillerman  Big Billie Eilish fan.
    But that's a quibble to what PG posted (at first, anyway, I haven't read his latest book) ―jono
    we are not arguing about ski boots or fashionable clothing or spageheti O's which mean nothing in the grand scheme ― XXX-er

  8. #608
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    lol at the notion BC is unprepared for fires. Conair and Air Spray have about two dozen tankers spread out in strategic locations ready to fly at a moment's notice. Plus, the government has contracts with helicopter operators all over the province to fly rap crews.

    The problem is that people want to live where forest fires are likely to occur.

  9. #609
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    the air tractors sortie from out of Smithers they suck and drop about 30 loads before coming back to fuel and do it again

    the racetracks and go rounds were confusing at first , didnt I just see that airplane ... no cuz there is 4 of them

    they have a table reserved at the Bulkley for beers every night where they toast a good day of flying

    ever body wants them to bring back the Mars but its fuckign archaic for fighting fires in BC
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  10. #610
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Striker View Post
    The problem is that people want to live where forest fires are likely to occur.
    I agree with this in general. But Lytton is only a few hundred people, at the confluence of major rivers (Fraser and Thompson), has a rail line through it. Homes are confined to the valley floor and are tightly packed. This is exactly where human beings should live for infrastructure purposes, at least in small numbers.

    Compare this to Paradise, population 20k+. Sprawling developments through arid forests. No real reason to live here other than you don't want to live in more urban environments. This is exactly where humans shouldn't be living.

  11. #611
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    ^^ Agree with that. I just meant the way the fires both took off and destroyed each town. No amount of preparation with citizens or whatever was going to change the eventual outcome. Sometimes you're just plain fucked.
    I ski 135 degree chutes switch to the road.

  12. #612
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    Quote Originally Posted by TahoeJ View Post
    ^^ Agree with that. I just meant the way the fires both took off and destroyed each town. No amount of preparation with citizens or whatever was going to change the eventual outcome. Sometimes you're just plain fucked.
    Why can't preparation mitigate the likelihood of such events? Why can't measures be taken to immediately protect a village?
    OH, MY GAWD! ―John Hillerman  Big Billie Eilish fan.
    But that's a quibble to what PG posted (at first, anyway, I haven't read his latest book) ―jono
    we are not arguing about ski boots or fashionable clothing or spageheti O's which mean nothing in the grand scheme ― XXX-er

  13. #613
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    Quote Originally Posted by pureantigravity View Post
    Why can't preparation mitigate the likelihood of such events? Why can't measures be taken to immediately protect a village?
    It’s called a firestorm. The whole of Lytton was on fire in less than 30 minutes. Maybe you and Cono Este can form a rapid response bucket brigade.


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  14. #614
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    Quote Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn View Post
    It’s called a firestorm. The whole of Lytton was on fire in less than 30 minutes. Maybe you and Cono Este can form a rapid response bucket brigade.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
    Couldn't an AI camera detect the first instance of flame and then trigger sprinklers in the vicinity? That's just one idea.
    OH, MY GAWD! ―John Hillerman  Big Billie Eilish fan.
    But that's a quibble to what PG posted (at first, anyway, I haven't read his latest book) ―jono
    we are not arguing about ski boots or fashionable clothing or spageheti O's which mean nothing in the grand scheme ― XXX-er

  15. #615
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    Quote Originally Posted by pureantigravity View Post
    Couldn't an AI camera detect the first instance of flame and then trigger sprinklers in the vicinity? That's just one idea.
    Fire may equal no power which may equal no water
    When you see something that is not right, not just, not fair, you have a moral obligation to say something. To do something." Rep. John Lewis


    Kindness is a bridge between all people

    Dunkin’ Donuts Worker Dances With Customer Who Has Autism

  16. #616
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    Quote Originally Posted by altasnob View Post
    Lytton is only a few hundred people, at the confluence of major rivers (Fraser and Thompson), has a rail line through it. Homes are confined to the valley floor and are tightly packed. This is exactly where human beings should live for infrastructure purposes, at least in small numbers
    Yeah, I've been there. Just speaking in general terms, as you noted.

    And since firefighting budgets are bang for buck, the Lyttons of the world are more like to be decimated than Kelowna or California.

  17. #617
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Striker View Post
    The problem is that people want to live where forest fires are likely to occur.
    My fire science prof at UBC was interviewed on the news after a destructive fire in Kelowna in 2003 and straight up blamed the residents who lost homes for living in a wildland urban interface area that is known to be fire prone.

    Not sure what we can do about this though - most communities across the west have some level of wildland urban interface. Those within the forest like Paradise are obviously at greatest risk but there are plenty of examples of fires burning into denser suburban areas as well. Bottom line is there is nothing that can stop a massive fast moving fire from plowing into any nearby community.

    Fire crews will fight to protect communities when they can. Ultimately it will be economics that will start to push people away from these areas in the long term. The most at risk areas won't be able to get fire insurance. Some residents will go without and will be fine until that fire hits. A lot of others will be forced to move because lenders will require insurance, which they won't be able to get any longer. It will be harder and more expensive to build or re-build as fire codes will add cost.

    Of course in the end this all means it will be the only the rich who can afford to live in these areas and they will demand fire protection, so maybe the cycle just continues...

  18. #618
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    The only solution is zero population growth, which won't happen. Everything else will be mitigation.

  19. #619
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    my money guy in kelowna said all the houses that got burnt were 25 -30 yrs old needing work and so some people may have benifited from the insurance coverage of a good fire
    Last edited by XXX-er; 07-03-2021 at 01:29 PM.
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  20. #620
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    Quote Originally Posted by XXX-er View Post
    my money guy in kelowna said all the houses that got burnt were 25 -30 yrs old needing work and so some people may have benifited from the insurance coverage of a good fire
    Left the doors and windows open on purpose?

  21. #621
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    No not on purpose but buddy claimed that a lot of the houses that burned were needing a new shake roof, carpets , paint, deck

    so everything was worn out rotted or dated on a 30 yr old hosue in the mission instead it was all covered by insurance
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  22. #622
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    Quote Originally Posted by XXX-er View Post
    No not on purpose but buddy claimed that a lot of the houses that burned were needing a new shake roof, carpets , paint, deck

    so everything was worn out rotted or dated on a 30 yr old hosue in the mission instead it was all covered by insurance
    No one who lives in their home feels that way. Losing all your stuff and memories sucks.

  23. #623
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    Well yea, if you have proper insurance you are almost always better off with the house you have after the fire vs before. Not sure that it really is worth it for the heartache, displacement, etc.


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  24. #624
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    Quote Originally Posted by neufox47 View Post
    Well yea, if you have proper insurance you are almost always better off with the house you have after the fire vs before. Not sure that it really is worth it for the heartache, displacement, etc.


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    I can vouch for this
    Let me lock in the system at Warp 2
    Push it on into systematic overdrive
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  25. #625
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    Quote Originally Posted by pureantigravity View Post
    Couldn't an AI camera detect the first instance of flame and then trigger sprinklers in the vicinity? That's just one idea.
    Certainly it could work... with enough pumps, water, sprinklers, and power to run them. The problem with most ideas will come down to the cost of implementing them. There's also technical issues when you look into the details. E.g. once a house is on fire, the roof protects the fire, and no amount of sprinklers will put it out.

    A quick Google says you can install sprinklers for about $10,000 per acre. To protect a one mile square town, plus a mile radius around it would run $6.4 million for the town, plus 7.14 sq miles surrounding, comes to about $50 million. Add for annual testing, maintenance, and replacement every 10-20 years (more in frosty climates?). If 1,000 homes are packed in to that town, that's $50k each for system installation - I bet the politics will be tough. And of course there's numerous assumptions and issues not addressed in this paragraph (including could it even work)

    There was a place on the outskirts of Paradise that used a combination of firesafe construction, raking the forest, and sprinklers to survive that fire.

    Might be possible.

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