Who here chops off their dog's nuts?

[hutash]

There are a lot of other studies that show an increase in other types of cancers in intact dogs, do pick your poison. I can tell you from 30 years of experience, neutered dogs and cats of both sexes live a lot longer.

Personally, I would never own an intact animal unless for breeding. And, if I ever want to get into dog breeding, somebody please shoot me. Those people are nuts. (Best of Show is a true documentary, regardless of what they intended it to be. )

[hutash]

Got to agree with Jer on this one (pets are about the only thing we agree on )

I deal with this all the time. It is always some muscle head dude who thinks he has a big dick that won't neuter his boy, yet is first in line to spay bitch. It would be funny if I often times didn't see them six months later hit by a car, in a dog fight, or bit the neighbors kid.

If I had a six year old child, I would cut that boy so fast his head would spin. Your liability for all your daughters friends is a lot higher then you think.

Dogs are genetically programed to get to a certain size, nutrition and health permitting. Leaving him intact will not change that. It will change the bulk of him, but not the size. Shiba Inu's have enough propensity to bite, that I would be extremely cautious around kids to begin with, but an intact male is just asking for trouble. He is good now, but when those nuts get active you might have problems. Like I said earlier, once a behavior starts it is much harder to stop, so preventing male behavior is the wise thing to do.

Now if only Jer's mom had neutered him...?

[Dhelihiker]

Whats in your crockpot?

[SterlingSpikeDancer]

With horses, they say a proud cut gelding (getting cut late) will still think he has nuts and will be feisty and crazy like a stallion.
Don't know if that applies to dogs but if you have a breed that is a little nutty, like, say, a Jack Russel might be, chop 'em.
Saves you the grief of finding your dog in the pound, having been picked up ten miles away chasing bitches.

A proud cut horse is one that they did not get all of the testicles. . Usually by accident. Most cannot reproduce, but will behave like stallions. As for gelding age and behavior, a lot of it is training...

The later you cut a dog (or stallion), the more the male traits become behaviors and not just hormonally fueled. Hence why both Splat and mtngirl are correct.
As stated, the only reason to have an intact male (insert species here) is to breed them, otherwise they are a pain in the ass most of the time (applies to humans as well. Read just about any thread at TGR if you want proof.)

Just to clarify, a "proud cut" stallion is an old wives tale. The original procedure was to leave the "squealer" in, aka- the epididymis, in the horse. The thing is, the epididymus doesn't produce a drop of testosterone, so it can't effect behavior (or is it affect behavior, I have always sucked at that rule). IF someone asked for a "proud cut" stallion, then they never corrected those stallion-like behaviors that were present, and the horse "acted" more studly. Also, the longer that they have their balls, the more chances they have had to have the behaviors ingrained (humping, mounting, actual breeding and heat detection/seeking) and the more likely those behaviors will stick around.

I worry about hips problems or other issues if I chop too early. Anyone do extra reading in the subject?

I did some extra reading and talking to my small animal vet friends (literally personally polled 10 different vets on the topic). The information is quite mixed, but we did end up waiting until our pup was 1 year old for orthopedic reasons, and the chance that he could benefit from extra testosterone and growth hormone.

There are a lot of other studies that show an increase in other types of cancers in intact dogs, do pick your poison. I can tell you from 30 years of experience, neutered dogs and cats of both sexes live a lot longer. If I ever want to get into dog breeding, somebody please shoot me. Those people are nuts. (Best of Show is a true documentary, regardless of what they intended it to be. )

Done and done! Once again, listen to the resident small animal expert.

It would be funny if I often times didn't see them six months later hit by a car, in a dog fight, or bit the neighbors kid.
...Dogs are genetically programed to get to a certain size, nutrition and health permitting. Leaving him intact will not change that. It will change the bulk of him, but not the size. Shiba Inu's have enough propensity to bite, that I would be extremely cautious around kids to begin with, but an intact male is just asking for trouble. He is good now, but when those nuts get active you might have problems. Like I said earlier, once a behavior starts it is much harder to stop, so preventing male behavior is the wise thing to do.

Now if only Jer's mom had neutered him...?

And again, listen to/read and follow THIS ^^^

[hutash]

I have know doubt your definition of proud cut is the correct one, but correctness never stopped horse owners. Proud cut is used in many ways, not always correctly, hence my point that both mtngirl, Splat and now you are correct.

I never had to deal with it in my equine days, but some "proud cut" horses were botched castrations. Some idiot left a testicle, or more likely it was in the abdomen. Rather then admit they didn't check first the horse was uniballed leave the other behind. This happened once to a dog I knew. A quack vet in the practice before me neuter the dog, and low and behold a year or two later the dogs was have prostate problem like an intact male. Sure enough I found the testicle the quack left behind. The owner called him and it there was anything unusual about the surgery. He lied through his teeth saying everything was normal, and that yes he took out two testicles. The owner then said, "imagine that, Dr Hutash just took a testicle out of his abdomen, and we both know they don't have three or grow back." Busted.

Unfortunately the quack still is practicing, and even runs the spay/neuter clinic at a local humane society. Hopefully he has figured out how to do it correctly by now.

[SterlingSpikeDancer]

I haven't ever heard the term used in that way, but I HAVE run across the same scenario, and found cryptorchid stallions. ONE testes was dropped, the other was either truly retained (cryptorchid) or a "high flanker" (stuck in the inguinal canal). Either way, usually those horses are sterile (wrong temp for sperm production), but still have testosterone to act like a stud. Totally unethical to castrate anything and not take both nuts, but we do know that some idiots (and now she-idiots) do that crap. Anyhow, just thought I would chime in and clarify for the crazy horse people.

Hutash, what is your recommendation on best age to castrate? I fit in the camp of "as soon as both of them are present" for MY job, and ran into half of the polled vets I spoke with that said the same. Just curious, as always. Oh, and SHOOT ME if I ever have a show dog too.

[hutash]

I prefer about six months of age. By then 99.9 % of testicles have dropped, but mostly I feel it is a very safe age for anesthesia. I don't mind waiting a little longer especially in you breeds if deciduous teeth are still present. Up to a year is not bad, but by then most dogs are feeling their nutz and starting to act like males. As we both have commented once a behavior starts it is harder to stop.

[mtngirl79]

I just made murphy an appointment in a little over a week, he will be 5.5 months, and still is losing baby teeth, should I postpone? He needs his dog license at 6 months and its 5 bucks if chopped, 250 if not... plus they dropped and I want them gone...

[4matic]

Hutash: We rescued an old Tom cat and his head was huge! We even named him Fat Face. When we had him altered the vet said his head would shrink and sure enough, his head is "normal" now. Why is that? Much nicer pet now. Never leaves the yard. The ladies come to him in droves every spring..but they leave disappointed.

[irul&ublo]

Hutash: We rescued an old Tom cat and his head was huge! We even named him Fat Face. When we had him altered the vet said his head would shrink and sure enough, his head is "normal" now. Why is that?

Its the Barry Bonds effect


2004

2014

[hutash]

^^^Pretty much this. I like I said size won't change with or without neutering, but bulk will. Some cats will retain that fat tom cat face after neutering. I am not sure why, but I suspect they had it so long that is just because fibrous tissue, kind of scar like.

As to baby teeth, if all the canine teeth are gone you are likely good to chop away. If not wait a little. I don't know about your area, but I occasionally write a deferment for neutering if there is a valid reason so my client to get charged extra. Also, if he still has baby teeth he might be younger then you think.

[mtngirl79]

His grown up teeth are coming in, too, and his babies are coming out fast, but a lot of them have both baby and adult. Sunday I pulled one out on accident playing tug.

I asked her about his teeth and neutering and she said it was fine... he has three canines left, but adults are in, too and bigger. He looks like he needs braces.

[hutash]

If the adult teeth are in, and the baby teeth are still there, they most likely need to be pulled (the baby teeth). I will fudge a little, but if the adult tooth is well in, the baby teeth are not likely to fall out on their own (they were supposed to get pushed out by the adult tooth.) If done early the adult tooth will likely shift back into its normal position. Wait too long and the tooth stays were it is.

[mtngirl79]

She looked at his teeth and said that she thought they would come out fine. Hopefully she is right...

[mtngirl79]

Down to 2 canines left!

[PNWbrit]

She looked at his teeth and said that she thought they would come out fine. Hopefully she is right...

They're castrating your dog orally?

That's some new school canine dentistry.

[Tippster]

Dis is why:

[DasBlunt]

Funny tipp.

Finally saw the vet. He said bone growth will basically end at 12 months. So I will wait. Checked out healthy happy and poop sample was negative.

[Kenny Satch]

I deal with this all the time. It is always some muscle head dude who thinks he has a big dick that won't neuter his boy, yet is first in line to spay bitch.

this really got me thinking

was Jer and Tippster calling me out on something I didn't want to acknowledge ?

truth be told we never had the need to neuter our Dogs because we lived in the middle of nowhere. If we lived closer to or had many neighbors we would have done that and yes we would have spayed a female to prevent fighting with our males

I understand the bigger picture and it was wrong of me to come across implying if you do that to your Dog you're stripping him of dignity. I never treated Dogs like humans and hate when people put Dogs before Humans but in my defense I believe how I treat animals is a reflection on me. My Karma beliefs can get the better of me

my apologies and peace

[Tippster]

OK, but neutering them isn't mistreating them, like cropping their ears for purely aesthetic reasons.

[Jer]

...and there are many good reasons to neuter ( which have been mentioned ) besides preventing more puppies.

...and I DO put dogs before most humans. In fact I think human s/n should be manditory . Starting with everyone on TGR. Get the dumb/problem ones first!

[SB]

Dis is why:

Timmy Turtle the Testicle Taster