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  1. #6101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Summit View Post
    I never knew Conan wrote that episode...
    go upside down.

  2. #6102
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    I love how all the butt-hurt summit county "locals" think they can take a public road paid for by tax dollars and restrict use of that road to themselves and their friends.

    YOU chose to buy an overpriced condo in one of the most popular mountain towns in america, 2 hours from a city of 3 million people.

  3. #6103
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    Quote Originally Posted by skiracer88_00 View Post
    I love how all the butt-hurt summit county "locals" think they can take a public road paid for by tax dollars and restrict use of that road to themselves and their friends.

    YOU chose to buy an overpriced condo in one of the most popular mountain towns in america, 2 hours from a city of 3 million people.
    ^

  4. #6104
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    Sep 2010
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    OFFICIAL I70 BITCH THREAD....

    I didnít buy anything and wouldnít be able to use it, if restricted. Iím not local. My DL is Denver. I just think its fucked up that tourists are turning a localís 10 minute drive into a 40 minute drive just so they can shave 5 minutes off their 3 hour drive home or to the airport. Just stay on the highway. Jesus.

  5. #6105
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    Quote Originally Posted by skiracer88_00 View Post
    I love how all the butt-hurt summit county "locals" think they can take a public road paid for by tax dollars and restrict use of that road to themselves and their friends.

    YOU chose to buy an overpriced condo in one of the most popular mountain towns in america, 2 hours from a city of 3 million people.
    YOU chose to move to the city of 3 million people and be a weekend warrior driving I70 to some of the most popular mountain towns in America. Overpriced? Have you check the Denver housing market lately?

    I think the only person suggesting a local's only route was Lindahl, who is probably your neighbor.

    The "locals" would just like a solution to the complete gridlock that occurs every time the highway shuts down when they are just trying to get to work or home. Probably happens 5-10 times a season, and where I live and work, I am rarely affected but I know a lot of people who are and it sucks.

    And our shitty small town newspaper concurs with the causes of the clusterfuck:
    https://www.summitdaily.com/news/wha...maps-to-blame/

  6. #6106
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    Oct 2008
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    Quote Originally Posted by shredgnar View Post
    YOU chose to move to the city of 3 million people and be a weekend warrior driving I70 to some of the most popular mountain towns in America. Overpriced? Have you check the Denver housing market lately?

    I think the only person suggesting a local's only route was Lindahl, who is probably your neighbor.

    The "locals" would just like a solution to the complete gridlock that occurs every time the highway shuts down when they are just trying to get to work or home. Probably happens 5-10 times a season, and where I live and work, I am rarely affected but I know a lot of people who are and it sucks.

    And our shitty small town newspaper concurs with the causes of the clusterfuck:
    https://www.summitdaily.com/news/wha...maps-to-blame/
    Itís pretty simple. People who have moved to CO in the last 20 years will have to leave.
    Including those ďlocalsĒ that are just transplants in mountain towns.

    Problems solved

    :-)


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
    Quote Originally Posted by Benny Profane View Post
    Keystone is fucking lame. But, deadly.

  7. #6107
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    dillon/silverthorne is the worst when the highway closes, people just give up on common sense and stop their car where ever they can, hoping to be first in line to get on the highway when it opens

    I guess my "car culture" isn't that good, but these people who are at home sitting in their car for hours on end without moving it pretty weird, you'd think they'd get out of their cars and do something, but when you have wifi, tv's, and a cell phone why would you get out of your car?

    I know plenty of people who have been screwed by the parking lot effect in dillon/silverthorne, just trying to get somewhere or get to work. One friend just ditched her car and walked over to the movie theatre and watched a movie hoping things would clear and she could drive the three miles to her house. Cdot and the police have tried to get people to go somewhere other than the middle of the road, but it's almost impossible

  8. #6108
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kinnikinnick View Post
    It’s pretty simple. People who have moved to CO in the last 20 years will have to leave.
    Including those “locals” that are just transplants in mountain towns.

    Problems solved

    :-)

    ]
    I"m ready to go, just can't get my mouth off the million dollar tit I have, once I ween myself off the money I'll go

  9. #6109
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    If I were in one of those gridlocked cars at 2PM on Loveland Pass, chances are VERY high that I just came from Breck or Keystone, so I'd pull off and ski Abasin... but people don't do that.

    Yea you would think people would choose to go see a movie, or keep skiing until 4 then go to apres and get some dinner... but they choose to sit in their cars inching along for hours. Is there some business opportunity here to open some other apres activity business that people would come to?

    Spending 45 minutes crawling through a residential neighborhood doesn't seem entertaining. Google/Waze cannot be expected to help... the computerized voice will say "alternate route will save 2 minutes... rerouting..." It doesn't say "fucking over everyone who just wants to go to work or needs to get their kid some dimatap from the store." What are some real practical solutions to encourage behavior change?

    Locals are quite peeved... the traffic jam is the front page story today in the newspaper...
    Quote Originally Posted by blurred
    skiing is hiking all day so that you can ski on shitty gear for 5 minutes.

  10. #6110
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    Quote Originally Posted by shredgnar View Post
    YOU chose to move to the city of 3 million people and be a weekend warrior driving I70 to some of the most popular mountain towns in America.
    This was a conscious decision. I love Denver for what it is, i.e., the best combination of economic opportunity and outdoor recreation on this continent. I totally understand why so many people want to live here. At the same time, I will advocate for measures that will make it an even better place to live (such as upgrading infrastructure). The mountains are big enough for everyone to enjoy. There are millions of acres of them that almost nobody visits. The problem is not that Colorado is too crowded, the problem is that Coloradans refuse to upgrade our infrastructure to 21st century standards.

  11. #6111
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    Based on figures provided by the Colorado Department of Transportation, this weekend was particularly bad for travel with 54,730 vehicles passing through the Eisenhower Tunnel on Sunday alone, only 3,000 shy of the single-day record.
    Don't forget the fact that it was really fucking busy! I love that Coloradan's have this super awesome perspective of everybody should change but me but really change can't happen because you know...change can't happen.

    "Road Closed - local traffic only" why not?

    "Congestion Charge 1pm to 7pm $30 - 4 or more people, commercial vehicles no charge" why not?

    "Meter traffic leaving the ski areas" why not?

  12. #6112
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    OFFICIAL I70 BITCH THREAD....

    Quote Originally Posted by skiracer88_00 View Post
    This was a conscious decision. I love Denver for what it is, i.e., the best combination of economic opportunity and outdoor recreation on this continent. I totally understand why so many people want to live here. At the same time, I will advocate for measures that will make it an even better place to live (such as upgrading infrastructure). The mountains are big enough for everyone to enjoy. There are millions of acres of them that almost nobody visits. The problem is not that Colorado is too crowded, the problem is that Coloradans refuse to upgrade our infrastructure to 21st century standards.
    This.

    Am I reading that article right? Sunday was 3,000 cars shy of the single day record for summer and winter? Thatís fucking crazy!

  13. #6113
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    Quote Originally Posted by skiracer88_00 View Post
    The problem is not that Colorado is too crowded, the problem is that Coloradans refuse to upgrade our infrastructure to 21st century standards.
    Sanctimony. Nobody should whine because we aren't throwing BILLIONS at infrastructure that likely won't do a ton for peak tourist traffic? There are no major infrastructure plans on the table that will solve the problem of EB I70 backing up into mountain towns during peak traffic. If 109 and 110 had raised taxes and taken out billions more in bonds, NOTHING would have been done to address this problem and the vast majority of the money stays in the front range. CDOT's project on the table for Eisenhower-Golden is one to make it theoretically easier for more people to get TO the mountains by taking I70 to 2.5 with a half toll lane WB.

    Yes, there is a crowd management problem.

    There are low cost solutions that MAXIMIZE our current infrastructure, but we are doing them half ass or not at all. Some traffic management would go a LONG way, and it is CHEAP, but oh my gosh... there might be some politics involved... well how about the politics of spending billions on projects with 4-20 year leads? Why is the latter so facile in your mind but not the simple, immediate, cheap solutions?

    Yes we could talk about doing BOTH, and I believe in infrastructure investment, but when we talk about solutions like scheduled traffic segregation at peak (heavy vehicle hold), peak tolls, and vigorously enforced snow tire laws, we are talking projects with huge effect that cost mere millions and can be put into place as soon as the political will pushes bureaucracy to action.
    Quote Originally Posted by blurred
    skiing is hiking all day so that you can ski on shitty gear for 5 minutes.

  14. #6114
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    Jan 2014
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    Gaperville, CO
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    Quote Originally Posted by The SnowShow View Post
    This.

    Am I reading that article right? Sunday was 3,000 cars shy of the single day record for summer and winter? That’s fucking crazy!
    Thats how I read it. Which means 95% of highest capacity day ever. In the middle of winter. That's frankly impressive.

  15. #6115
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    A buddy of mine left Leadville Sunday night at 11, still took him 2:45 to get to Denver.
    "fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
    "She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin

  16. #6116
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kinnikinnick View Post
    Itís pretty simple. People who have moved to CO in the last 20 years will have to leave.
    Including those ďlocalsĒ that are just transplants in mountain towns.

    Problems solved
    <whew>

    Made the cutoff.


  17. #6117
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    Nov 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by Summit View Post
    If 109 and 110 had raised taxes and taken out billions more in bonds, NOTHING would have been done to address this problem and the vast majority of the money stays in the front range.

    The Floyd Hill to Idaho Springs reconstruction was the single biggest project on Prop 109. $800M in total improvements for the corridor.

    That covers Floyd Hill , toll lane to 40, additional lanes on Vail Pass, additional lane between Frisco & Silverthorne and redoing the interchanges at 203 and 205.
    Last edited by hatchgreenchile; 01-29-2019 at 10:18 AM.

  18. #6118
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    Quote Originally Posted by Summit View Post
    Sanctimony. Nobody should whine because we aren't throwing BILLIONS at infrastructure that likely won't do a ton for peak tourist traffic? There are no major infrastructure plans on the table that will solve the problem of EB I70 backing up into mountain towns during peak traffic. If 109 and 110 had raised taxes and taken out billions more in bonds, NOTHING would have been done to address this problem and the vast majority of the money stays in the front range. CDOT's project on the table for Eisenhower-Golden is one to make it theoretically easier for more people to get TO the mountains by taking I70 to 2.5 with a half toll lane WB.

    Yes, there is a crowd management problem.

    There are low cost solutions that MAXIMIZE our current infrastructure, but we are doing them half ass or not at all. Some traffic management would go a LONG way, and it is CHEAP, but oh my gosh... there might be some politics involved... well how about the politics of spending billions on projects with 4-20 year leads? Why is the latter so facile in your mind but not the simple, immediate, cheap solutions?

    Yes we could talk about doing BOTH, and I believe in infrastructure investment, but when we talk about solutions like scheduled traffic segregation at peak (heavy vehicle hold), peak tolls, and vigorously enforced snow tire laws, we are talking projects with huge effect that cost mere millions and can be put into place as soon as the political will pushes bureaucracy to action.
    Aaron, I am for all of the things you suggest (except maybe the heavy vehicle hold...commerce is one of the most important functions of the interstate highway system).

    Improvements should be multi-faceted for the largest impact. I thought the EB toll lane was brilliant, was relatively inexpensive and will pay for itself in time.
    At the end of the day, there is a capacity problem. The corridor needs 3 lanes each direction (at least one of which will be tolled), Denver to Frisco. The Eisenhower tunnel desperately needs a third bore and WB Floyd Hill needs to be reconfigured completely. That curve at the bottom is not even up to current highway safety standards...they can't even replace that old, rusty bridge in its current form.

    If Coloradans won't approve tax increases, toll everything, use bonds to pay for it now and pay them back with toll revenue, similarly to the original construction of US 36.

  19. #6119
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    Quote Originally Posted by skaredshtles View Post
    <whew>

    Made the cutoff.

    IKR

    (made the Colorado cutoff, not if we're just talking front range, but I'm more core because I have mountain town cred)
    "fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
    "She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin

  20. #6120
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    Quote Originally Posted by hatchgreenchile View Post
    The Floyd Hill to Idaho Springs reconstruction was the single biggest project on Prop 109.
    I guess we'll have to keep waiting.
    You mean $670M to add a 3rd WB lane down Floyd, widening the bridge, and adding a toll lane WB past Idaho Springs to make it easier to pack more people into the mountains?

    Needed, but, as I said: If 109 and 110 had raised taxes and taken out billions more in bonds, NOTHING would have been done to address this problem, this problem being EB I70 backing up into mountain towns.

    FTR, I voted YES on 109, no on 110. Prop 109 was an option that kept proportionally more funding in the mountains (some needed projects like the VP wildlife overpass), and I like bond funding for infrastructure.
    Quote Originally Posted by blurred
    skiing is hiking all day so that you can ski on shitty gear for 5 minutes.

  21. #6121
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    Quote Originally Posted by Summit View Post
    You mean $670M to add a 3rd WB lane down Floyd, widening the bridge, and adding a toll lane WB past Idaho Springs to make it easier to pack more people into the mountains?

    Needed, but, as I said: If 109 and 110 had raised taxes and taken out billions more in bonds, NOTHING would have been done to address this problem, this problem being EB I70 backing up into mountain towns.

    FTR, I voted YES on 109, no on 110. Prop 109 was an option that kept proportionally more funding in the mountains (some needed projects like the VP wildlife overpass), and I like bond funding for infrastructure.
    I edited late; the interchange improvements in Frisco & Silverthorne and aux lane between the two would help.

    I voted YES on 109 as well.

  22. #6122
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    Nov 2002
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    5,980
    Here is a question, "Are the ski areas getting a free ride on this?" If you are the Denver Broncos or the promoter of Dicks at Phish or the organizer of a festival do you pay a tax or fee that is usually passed on the the attendee that is used to pay for the public resources for the event?

  23. #6123
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danno View Post
    IKR

    (made the Colorado cutoff, not if we're just talking front range, but I'm more core because I have mountain town cred)
    I'd actually be OK with a 25-year cutoff, now.


  24. #6124
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    Quote Originally Posted by skiracer88_00 View Post
    I am for all of the things you suggest (except maybe the heavy vehicle hold...commerce is one of the most important functions of the interstate highway system).
    This is the triage of traffic management.

    OTR Commerce shits the bed when it is stuck in traffic due to a storm or tourist peak traffic. It literally wastes millions of dollars each time. Many professional drivers have proven themselves as thoughtless as all the tourists who queue up to sit in I70. These commercial drivers are hours limited and need to maximize mileage, yet they aren't planning around the vagaries of traffic or storms because nobody is pressuring them do so (just like the tourists).

    Chain enforcement is so obvious... make the fine high enough, or put enough enforcement out there, that the fine*perceived chance of being caught is > the perceived savings for chain skipping. That makes sense right?

    We want tourists to travel at non-peak times. You can effect this with steep peak tolls, but a $50 toll is nothing to truckers (or people driving $80K pickups towing $200K RVs) who happily risk $1000 fines to skip chains. Yet, truckers would be able to cover WAY more miles if they aren't sitting in Saturday morning traffic or Sunday evening traffic (and helping to cause it).

    Scheduled peak restrictions on heavy vehicles that must climb/descend at speeds significantly slower than the speed limit make absolute sense to maximize highway throughput with known traffic volumes AND vehicle elements! This is basic traffic engineering. Heavy vehicles would plan around it, because it is scheduled, and it would be more efficient than the current chaos both for the truckers AND everyone else! How is it any different than Arizona maximizing water efficiency by restricting lawn watering to nighttime etc?
    Last edited by Summit; 01-29-2019 at 01:15 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by blurred
    skiing is hiking all day so that you can ski on shitty gear for 5 minutes.

  25. #6125
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    If only there was some way to get robots to drive the big trucks. And the passenger cars.


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