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  1. #3776
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    ^ Doesn't matter... No one is funding any transportation anyway. Maybe they can build 70% of another lane through denver, plant trees in the middle of it, and charge people $10 a trip to weave in and out of it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hugh Conway View Post
    Hugh Conway sucks
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    I guess stfu might be right about steel toed boots
    Quote Originally Posted by pedoherp69 View Post
    I know actual transpeople.
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    We is got a good military, maybe cause some kids get to shooting sports early here.

  2. #3777
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    I've started to accept the fact that I70 can stay just how it is for the foreseeable future. Toll the tunnel and reinvest the money into improving current road infrastructure on the corridor.

    Summit can't handle any more people, and increasing highway access to the mountains won't help anyone. Growing population on the front range doesn't translate to growing town in the mountains. We are close to build out and don't have the infrastructure for the amount of people who want to come here.

  3. #3778
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    Quote Originally Posted by shredgnar View Post
    We are close to build out and don't have the infrastructure for the amount of people who want to come here.
    I lol'd. I must not appreciate how tough it is to build 4+ story buildings in CO.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hugh Conway View Post
    Hugh Conway sucks
    Quote Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper View Post
    I guess stfu might be right about steel toed boots
    Quote Originally Posted by pedoherp69 View Post
    I know actual transpeople.
    Quote Originally Posted by rokjoxx View Post
    We is got a good military, maybe cause some kids get to shooting sports early here.

  4. #3779
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    Quote Originally Posted by stfu&gbtw View Post
    I lol'd. I must not appreciate how tough it is to build 4+ story buildings in CO.
    Hard to tear down old functional two or three story building to build new 4 story. Or historical, or in open space, or.... You ever hear about a ski town trying to build a fucking parking garage? Fuggetaboutit...

  5. #3780
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    Quote Originally Posted by stfu&gbtw View Post
    I lol'd. I must not appreciate how tough it is to build 4+ story buildings in CO.

    And what would a 4 story building do for us? Give more rooms to house people to overcrowd restaurants and ski areas?

  6. #3781
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    lol... CO can't imagine how to build a railway through an existing route for less than $25B. In the same time CO has been wringing their hands about how tough it is in the mountains, for $12B, the swiss dug a 35 mile tunnel straight through a fucking mountain and are sending trains through it at 250kph. 35 fucking miles... As in "Idaho Springs to Silverthorne". Nice job getting owned by the swiss, Natives.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hugh Conway View Post
    Hugh Conway sucks
    Quote Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper View Post
    I guess stfu might be right about steel toed boots
    Quote Originally Posted by pedoherp69 View Post
    I know actual transpeople.
    Quote Originally Posted by rokjoxx View Post
    We is got a good military, maybe cause some kids get to shooting sports early here.

  7. #3782
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    Euros rock a building tunnels. Tunnels for days!
    Quote Originally Posted by blurred
    skiing is hiking all day so that you can ski on shitty gear for 5 minutes.

  8. #3783
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    Quote Originally Posted by stfu&gbtw View Post
    lol... CO can't imagine how to build a railway through an existing route for less than $25B. In the same time CO has been wringing their hands about how tough it is in the mountains, for $12B, the swiss dug a 35 mile tunnel straight through a fucking mountain and are sending trains through it at 250kph. 35 fucking miles... As in "Idaho Springs to Silverthorne". Nice job getting owned by the swiss, Natives.
    Doesn't solve the fact that there isn't enough of anything else once they actually get here. It won't get any better by just pumping more people into these mountain valleys. There isn't enough land, housing, hotels, restaurants, parking, or even skiing. Why spend billions to fuck it up even more?

    I say toll the tunnel and use funds to improve current highway footprint to increase safety while speeding efficiency. Then wait for self driving car tech to allow for more organized and efficient travel along the existing route.

  9. #3784
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    Quote Originally Posted by shredgnar View Post
    Doesn't solve the fact that there isn't enough of anything else once they actually get here. It won't get any better by just pumping more people into these mountain valleys. There isn't enough land, housing, hotels, restaurants, parking, or even skiing. Why spend billions to fuck it up even more?

    I say toll the tunnel and use funds to improve current highway footprint to increase safety while speeding efficiency. Then wait for self driving car tech to allow for more organized and efficient travel along the existing route.
    So $12B or $25B or whatever for rail seems unreasonable... Are you aware that introducing 5 million self driving vehicles and a "smart" highway carries a ~$500B price tag?
    Quote Originally Posted by Hugh Conway View Post
    Hugh Conway sucks
    Quote Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper View Post
    I guess stfu might be right about steel toed boots
    Quote Originally Posted by pedoherp69 View Post
    I know actual transpeople.
    Quote Originally Posted by rokjoxx View Post
    We is got a good military, maybe cause some kids get to shooting sports early here.

  10. #3785
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    Quote Originally Posted by stfu&gbtw View Post
    So $12B or $25B or whatever for rail seems unreasonable... Are you aware that introducing 5 million self driving vehicles and a "smart" highway carries a ~$500B price tag?
    And just as with any technology that price comes down significantly over time?

  11. #3786
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    Quote Originally Posted by shredgnar View Post
    And just as with any technology that price comes down significantly over time?
    Right, which is why rail costs 5% as much to build as a "smart" highway, and lasts 10x as long. It's a mature technology that continues to reduce costs and increase efficiency every year. But I get it... building stuff in the mountains is so much harder than anyone can imagine...That's why we should build a system that hasn't even been invented yet, and might only be 200x more expensive in a best case scenario.

    They should make "Dude, I think this whole transportation department is high..." t- shirts. I'd buy one. Maybe you could fund the smart highway with them!
    Quote Originally Posted by Hugh Conway View Post
    Hugh Conway sucks
    Quote Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper View Post
    I guess stfu might be right about steel toed boots
    Quote Originally Posted by pedoherp69 View Post
    I know actual transpeople.
    Quote Originally Posted by rokjoxx View Post
    We is got a good military, maybe cause some kids get to shooting sports early here.

  12. #3787
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    OFFICIAL I70 BITCH THREAD....

    Quote Originally Posted by stfu&gbtw View Post
    lol... CO can't imagine how to build a railway through an existing route for less than $25B. In the same time CO has been wringing their hands about how tough it is in the mountains, for $12B, the swiss dug a 35 mile tunnel straight through a fucking mountain and are sending trains through it at 250kph. 35 fucking miles... As in "Idaho Springs to Silverthorne". Nice job getting owned by the swiss, Natives.
    The Swiss owned it when they fucking tunneled and got a railway in the Eiger. Badass.

  13. #3788
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    HB-1242, the sales tax increase ballot measure to fund some CDOT projects, is being heard today. Latest is it's not looking likely to even make it to voters, where I think it'd still be a tough sell. We'll find out later today.
    "High risers are for people with fused ankles, jongs and dudes who are too fat to see their dick or touch their toes.
    Prove me wrong."
    -I've seen black diamonds!

    throughpolarizedeyes.com

  14. #3789
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bean View Post
    HB-1242, the sales tax increase ballot measure to fund some CDOT projects, is being heard today. Latest is it's not looking likely to even make it to voters, where I think it'd still be a tough sell. We'll find out later today.
    I'm having a hard time with this, increased sales tax? Breck is already over 9% and I'm sure other places in the state are close. It'll be dead in the water by five o'clock tonight

    Why can't we just add 25 cents to a gallon of gas, raise car registration fees, and hit all these hybred electric cars with a massive registration fee to offset them not paying a gas tax? It's all logical to me. But a sales tax increase wtf

    Why to politicians always try to sugar coat things instead of telling the truth and presenting things like they should be

  15. #3790
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    Quote Originally Posted by fastfred View Post
    I'm having a hard time with this, increased sales tax? Breck is already over 9% and I'm sure other places in the state are close. It'll be dead in the water by five o'clock tonight

    Why can't we just add 25 cents to a gallon of gas, raise car registration fees, and hit all these hybred electric cars with a massive registration fee to offset them not paying a gas tax? It's all logical to me. But a sales tax increase wtf

    Why to politicians always try to sugar coat things instead of telling the truth and presenting things like they should be
    Democrats: GOP wants the sales tax option to shift and undue portion of the burden to poor people who might not even drive cars or just use public transit!
    Republicans: Everyone benefits from commerce supported by the roads, just like everyone else... roads benefit more than just drivers!

    Anyone quantified the gas tax loss from hyrbrids/electrics for CO?
    Quote Originally Posted by blurred
    skiing is hiking all day so that you can ski on shitty gear for 5 minutes.

  16. #3791
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    Screw the Eisenhower, let's go big!
    This tunnel is going to be huuddggeee.

    Click image for larger version. 

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  17. #3792
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    Quote Originally Posted by Summit View Post
    Anyone quantified the gas tax loss from hyrbrids/electrics for CO?
    Probably, I haven't seen any numbers but can't imagine it's much. Even ignoring air pollution improvements, a push towards newer electric (which will increasingly mean autonomous/connected) cars will pay dividends. A means to collect road user fees from electric cars is coming, they've just got to sort out which is the least-bad option for it.

    I find it odd that the powers that be decided to push for increasing sales tax rather than gas tax on this one. I'll be surprised if it makes it past today, and if it does, even more surprised if it passes in November. A gas tax increase seems a lot more palatable to me, especially with gas relatively cheap right now.
    "High risers are for people with fused ankles, jongs and dudes who are too fat to see their dick or touch their toes.
    Prove me wrong."
    -I've seen black diamonds!

    throughpolarizedeyes.com

  18. #3793
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bean View Post
    Probably, I haven't seen any numbers but can't imagine it's much. Even ignoring air pollution improvements, a push towards newer electric (which will increasingly mean autonomous/connected) cars will pay dividends. A means to collect road user fees from electric cars is coming, they've just got to sort out which is the least-bad option for it.

    I find it odd that the powers that be decided to push for increasing sales tax rather than gas tax on this one. I'll be surprised if it makes it past today, and if it does, even more surprised if it passes in November. A gas tax increase seems a lot more palatable to me, especially with gas relatively cheap right now.
    That is what I suspected. Makes sense to me
    Quote Originally Posted by blurred
    skiing is hiking all day so that you can ski on shitty gear for 5 minutes.

  19. #3794
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bean View Post
    Probably, I haven't seen any numbers but can't imagine it's much. Even ignoring air pollution improvements, a push towards newer electric (which will increasingly mean autonomous/connected) cars will pay dividends. A means to collect road user fees from electric cars is coming, they've just got to sort out which is the least-bad option for it.

    I find it odd that the powers that be decided to push for increasing sales tax rather than gas tax on this one. I'll be surprised if it makes it past today, and if it does, even more surprised if it passes in November. A gas tax increase seems a lot more palatable to me, especially with gas relatively cheap right now.
    I polled like 2x higher (OK, that may be an exaggeration, but it was significant)... which is one of the most important stats

    Also takes away from gas so seen by some as somewhat 'future proofed'
    www.dpsskis.com
    www.point6.com
    formerly an ambassador for a few others, but the ski industry is... interesting.
    Fukt: a very small amount of snow.

  20. #3795
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    ^ that really surprises me, since my feelings are 100% opposite.

    We're headed towards some sort of VMT system but we aren't there yet (and I guarantee sales taxes won't be the main transportation funding stream), no reason to ignore a perfectly workable and easy option now.
    "High risers are for people with fused ankles, jongs and dudes who are too fat to see their dick or touch their toes.
    Prove me wrong."
    -I've seen black diamonds!

    throughpolarizedeyes.com

  21. #3796
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bean View Post
    ^ that really surprises me, since my feelings are 100% opposite.

    We're headed towards some sort of VMT system but we aren't there yet (and I guarantee sales taxes won't be the main transportation funding stream), no reason to ignore a perfectly workable and easy option now.
    VMT goes to big brother oversight and there are many here in CO that don't like the feel of that.
    It's been contemplated though.

    Sales tax is OK for capital improvement, but I don't love it for replacement and maintenance.

    If the economy isn't doing great, you can postpone building another lane, but you can only keep kicking the 2" overlay down the road before it's a 4" or complete rebuild.
    www.dpsskis.com
    www.point6.com
    formerly an ambassador for a few others, but the ski industry is... interesting.
    Fukt: a very small amount of snow.

  22. #3797
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    But once again, what would be the end result of any kind of proposed improvements to the I70 corridor? To get more people to Summit county and Vail? Faster? More more more? If we increased the amount of visitors in Summit county by even 25% who does that really benefit? I really can't imagine this place being any more crowded than it already is. Where will we put these people once they are here? On ski lifts? At what point are we just ruining it for everyone? Have we already crossed that threshold and should we just go into full on sell out mode?

    Pave it all, ski lifts everywhere, Denver West and all that. Have fun. I guess my property value will continue to rise so I will just rent out our house for $5k a month and live off the proceeds on an island in the south pacific.

  23. #3798
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    I was bringing up HB-1242 as a general transportation issue, it wouldn't do much along the mountain corridor. Regardless, Summit County is already lost. Time to move father from Denver if you want to get away from the junkshow.

  24. #3799
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    Quote Originally Posted by shredgnar View Post
    But once again, what would be the end result of any kind of proposed improvements to the I70 corridor? To get more people to Summit county and Vail? Faster? More more more? If we increased the amount of visitors in Summit county by even 25% who does that really benefit? I really can't imagine this place being any more crowded than it already is. Where will we put these people once they are here? On ski lifts? At what point are we just ruining it for everyone? Have we already crossed that threshold and should we just go into full on sell out mode?

    Pave it all, ski lifts everywhere, Denver West and all that. Have fun. I guess my property value will continue to rise so I will just rent out our house for $5k a month and live off the proceeds on an island in the south pacific.
    No offense but this is an attitude that's going to frustrate you for a long time and really offers no ideas or insight into possible solutions to problems that are going to get worse as our front range population continues to boom. I meet a lot of people with this similar mindset at the public hearings I get to attend for work.

  25. #3800
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    Quote Originally Posted by shredgnar View Post
    But once again, what would be the end result of any kind of proposed improvements to the I70 corridor? To get more people to Summit county and Vail? Faster? More more more? If we increased the amount of visitors in Summit county by even 25% who does that really benefit? I really can't imagine this place being any more crowded than it already is.
    Your lack of imagination disturbs me...

    Summit County can get WAY more crowded.

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