PSA: Repair you own fucking edge compression

[shirk]

What ski is that? Pretty sure it's old Movement? Pow Pows? Or Gladiators maybe?

[tuco]

What ski is that? Pretty sure it's old Movement? Pow Pows? Or Gladiators maybe?

Movement Goliath

[shirk]

If you want a brand spanking new pair in the plastic for $179 plus shipping...

http://www.roostoutfitters.com/content/goliath-f09

[spanky]

Old thread, but useful. Bump.

I just repaired a sidewall compression/edge delam on my Volkl 100Eight using the techniques shown here. Thanks to tuco and the others for the details.

Here is the ski heating in my “vise”:


Ski is sandwiched between 2x4 and steel plate wrapped in plastic wrap (bottom) and 1x4 on top. It was a bit of a challenge to get the top vice “plate” flat against the top of the ski given the 3D Ridge shape on the ski. The 1x4 flexed enough to not slide off the topsheet.

[tuco]

Old thread, but useful. Bump.

I just repaired a sidewall compression/edge delam on my Volkl 100Eight using the techniques shown here. Thanks to tuco and the others for the details.

Here is the ski heating in my “vise”:


Ski is sandwiched between 2x4 and steel plate wrapped in plastic wrap (bottom) and 1x4 on top. It was a bit of a challenge to get the top vice “plate” flat against the top of the ski given the 3D Ridge shape on the ski. The 1x4 flexed enough to not slide off the topsheet.

Cut kerfs into repair plate to facilitate curvature.

[cycology1]

This is awesome! Don't have a need but getting tired of everything being thrown away for sometimes minor issues

...even leaning conservative, so much stuff we discard seems to have a relatively easy fix. The're tools not jewels! Cous in-law in from Utah said that this weekend. I personally have over pampered my gear of all sports and heavily discounted it's usefulness for relatively minor flaws...

Next goal to get down to every other week trash pick up. Sounds ridiculous that not only do 2 people discard that much but that it has to be a priority

[Lord Thomas]

[tuco]

^PM'd

[swissiphic]

Thanks for the thread. Lots of useful procedural and materials tips.

I kinda have a weird one. Bought some used volkl kuros cheap. Received them and noticed huge edge/base compression on one ski behind heel. The impact was severe enough to crack the sidewall into multiple cracks and actually bend the tail of the ski by about 10mm. Looking down the pipe, the ski is not twisted torsionally.

Sooo, i contacted the seller, he was super sorry. Said he got the skis off a buddy, skied em a few times loved em in deep pow and nothing else so sold them and didn't really check them before selling. Anyways, he said he'd take the skis back and refund me the cash if i wanted to.

I really wanna keep the skis cause realistically they're special use and can't see skiing them more than 10 days/season so, any repair that could prevent further compromise of core is all i want. Being a pow ski, i doubt I could feel any on snow difference between damaged/good skis.

Sooo, any tips on what i should do to repair the sidewall and deep dish in the base? If really need be, I can easily rebend the correct camber/rocker shape so that won't be an issue.

Thanks!

[Lord Thomas]

[tuco]

LT- that's what I thought I was seeing. You could probably get away with epoxying and clamping, but it wouldn't address your base damage. I would remove and patch the rock damage and you can prep the area where the cracked edge is. If you can source some clear base material, it will give you a 'window' into what is happening under your base because that crack will always be a hinge point and you will never be able to fully seal water out.

Remove toe piece. Size up how much of your base need replacement. Cut and remove damaged base, cut your repair base material at same time so patch will fit Clean everything up. Always do a dry run, so you're not trying to figure it out while you have heated epoxy curing. Heat the ski, and with delam opened up like your picture, pour mixed epoxy into delam along the length of it. You're going to use some epoxy for that repair so I would use a small mixing cup(like the kind that comes with childrens medicine). Also be ready for a mess and after you make sure you wet everything out try to wipe up as much epoxy as you can. With wet epoxy in delam, wedge oyster knife(or something similar) into delam and twist, the opening and closing of the delam with drive epoxy all the way in. Then clamp, put in front of heat source and clean up. Of course make sure you read the 1st page of this thread because the directions I just typed are missing the small details

and of course--new outside edge

Phic- That's fixable dude! Very similar to the original repair in this thread. I get to go to work right now but can go over it later.

Sorry for the slow response. Long days right now!

[jackstraw]

This thread reminds me of how I got a few pair of free skis. Guys would come into the Taos shop with a blown edge and I'd give them a quote and explain the time frame as it's a multi step process to be done correctly. Or since these skis are pretty beat you could just buy a new "sick" pair and be the best skier on the mountain. Most bought new. Then it was do you want me to throw these skis out for you? Some skis were tossed, but I'd fix the decent boards and ride them. Taos, especially the west basin eats skis.

[tuco]

Phic- That's fixable dude! !

One thing that would worry me though is the fact previous owner was not aware of delam and how much water core has seen.

[swissiphic]

One thing that would worry me though is the fact previous owner was not aware of delam and how much water core has seen.

Yeah exactly...the present owner claims he's only skied em a few huge powder days...but who knows about the o.g. owner. Thanks for the tips Tuco and any other specific advise you could give is much appreciated.

I actually work at a ski tech at a very basic rental shop. No formal training, self taught and a born tinkerer. In the past i've repaired blow out sidewalls and delaminated edges on some rock skis as experiments just using tools/materials I had on hand.

First I would cut out the damaged sidewall and expose the core. Then manually bend and shape the edge to as straight as I could get it. Then epoxy and clamp the edge and any delaminated base and/or cracked core layers. Then scrape off exposed epoxy in sidewall area and roughen with sand paper. Then use my ptex gun with really high density ptex to slowly build up the sidewall to have the repaired area have extra material bulging out compared to the sidewall adjacent fore and aft. Then use a panzer file to file the ptexed repair area flush. Kept the repairs as a rough finish cause they're rock skis.

I used those skis for a few seasons of rock and bush bashing skiing and the damn repair held up so far. Pretty stoked.

However, that was just a "guess and intuition repair". If I don't have access to actual sidewall repair material; in your opinion, would my ghetto fix be a good option for the Volkl Kuro repair.?

As for your original comment above, based on the wear and tear of the skis' appearance (top sheet minimal scratches, base no damage other than compression area, original structure still clean and crisp, edges still factory sharp aside from some oxidation/corrosion and no rock hits just minimal dings/nicks) i really don't suspect that the skis were skied much at all...having said that...they were used in whistler and we all know that whis snow can be waterlogged...

How much free water the core has been exposed to is a true question mark.

I think I'll keep the skis. I don't start ski tech work for a while so in the meantime, i'm just gonna clean and roughen the sidewalls and smear the appropriate epoxy over and into the cracks as a temporary weather seal until i have access to my proper ski shop tools and bench.

[swissiphic]

Repaired the cracked sidewall on my Kuro's a few days ago. Also bent the tail back to within factory specs. Tail bent easily and held true for last few days of abusive skiing. So did the sidewall repair.

Sidewall: Took a grinder and gouged out maybe 3 mms of the exterior surface of the cracked area. Tilted ski to side and filled the gouged area with shoe goo. Didn't have to construct a 'dam' to retain the shoe goo. It was viscous enough to remain in place. Smeared a bit over the topsheet edge and down around the base edge. Let dry 24 hours. The intention was to temporarily seal the cracked area from the elements and melting snow until I have the time/patience to do a more permanent job. Took utility knife and tried precisely cut material off base/side edge and shaved the sidewall flush...but the knife blade was not "new sharp" and I didn't have spares; so some dried goo remained on top of side edge. I didn't wanna hack at it with a less than sharp blade and chunk out the sidewall. Will have to carve that turkey mo betta later.

Took em out skiing. Beat the shit out of the skis on refrozen wet snow crud, inverted railway tracks and death cookies. Put some time in on roly poly fresh soft cord groomers. Amazed at the edge hold of these fat puppies on 38 degree hard refreeze, even after a good tip to tail detune (I hate sharp edges on any of my skis over 90mm waist) They chattered a bit but not much. Might smear some shoe goo down the tops sheet to lower the resonance frequency of the skis. Also amazed at their soft cord slaying ability. Carved some nice trenches and great pop/energy from turn to turn; powered through end of turns with heel pressure. Not a damp ski but quite stable. The torque required to move these babies side to side put some strain on the knees by the end of the day so definitely will be more focused on using these as my pow quiver selection. But had to give em a thorough test to ensure the repairs held and the bent tail rebend didn't reveal any weird handling quirks.

Rebend of tail/compressed base area: Could not tell the difference in the least from ski to ski. Swapped back and forth to see if outside/inside ski would make a difference. No difference in ski feel/performance.

So, if the shoe goo holds and doesn't delaminate, i'm just gonna run these babies as they are. Might cut away some base material near the compressed edge area and seal with epoxy and fill with ptex gun ptex but at this point, not a priority. I was quite surprised at how tenaciously the shoe goo gripped onto the metal edge...me thinks the bond is good...hopefully lasts long term. We'll see.

[XXX-er]

i don't give a rats ass about ski wieght

heavier the better for dh performance

[swissiphic]

i don't give a rats ass about ski wieght

heavier the better for dh performance

Said XXX'er never.

[tuco]

PSA: Coming Soon
Project Resuscitation Rustler 11---Down but not Out

[thefortrees]

Seeing this thread for the first time. Useful info here! Subscribed. Carry on.

[tuco]

Straightened 2 compressions. Used a small screwdriver to minimize further sidewall damage. The compression w/ the delam, I was going to cut a patch so I could clean it out(edge was rusty in this area, so I'm sure it's rusty under base), but I'm going to see how well the g- flex works, out of curiosity. Especially since there really is no base damage.
I had to cut a pretty big base patch to start the fix on the core damaged coreshot. Since it was so big and right in the center, I had to make a jig/template. Put some index marks to align jig so you cut in the proper place and cut. Dry fit it 1st to make sure it's gonna work.
The balsa core of this ski is damaged/crushed. I have layed into it flexing it and it's all good. I'm going to consider my options on fixing this and figure out what I'm going to use to replace the damaged composite that stuck to base upon removal. You can see the composite stuck to underside of base. Piece next to it is how it should look.
Glue up is next phase!

[gregorys]

@Tuco et al...

It's my opinion that simple edge compressions that don't damage the core/sidewall are probably best left alone.
[My opinion is, essentially, that unless you're a world class skier, and mostly skiing on *super-firm* snow (ice) you'll never notice the edge compression anyway. And if you're worried, you can always put the compression on the outside edge and it will be impossible to feel there.

Do you generally agree?

Here's an example; [Metal scraper held up to base as a "straight-edge" to emphasize/show the compression.]

[tuco]

@Tuco et al...

It's my opinion that simple edge compressions that don't damage the core/sidewall are probably best left alone.
[My opinion is, essentially, that unless you're a world class skier, and mostly skiing on *super-firm* snow (ice) you'll never notice the edge compression anyway. And if you're worried, you can always put the compression on the outside edge and it will be impossible to feel there.

Do you generally agree?

Here's an example; [Metal scraper held up to base as a "straight-edge" to emphasize/show the compression.]

Generally yes,
I would also say that a lot of compressions come with an associated delam(these^^ 2 did, so I went ahead and fixed them), even if there does not appear to be one. When the edge is pushed in, the areas of the edge at the outermost of compression will actually get pushed away from the composite because the metal stretches. Might be small, but if it lets water in, at some point it can be a problem

[S.B.]

I got a pair of Moment PB&Js for cheap and found this near the tail. I'm not worried about the edge but the bubble that the base material has made is a bit worrisome. Any thoughts?

Sent from my SM-G960U using TGR Forums mobile app

[tuco]

Edge pushed in. That's an edge tab that's pushing up the base. Base delammed. You should fix that, because water will get in there.

[detuned]

I picked up some free Ranger 98's that were attached to some p14's I bought off gear swap. I knew the condition of the skis prior to delivery so I was not shocked when I inspected the edge compression...

That said, many thanks to tuco for his insight and direction as I tackle this repair

So far I have removed material from the sidewall and base, moved edge back to straight, cleaned out as best I could and I am ready to dry fit my base patch then epoxy all back together. The question I have is do I need anything in between the base patch and the edge keys? Or can I just slap the patch in with epoxy, clamp and cure?