Why won't Loveland host a Banked Slalom???

**pbourdon** · 09-04-2013, 05:32 PM

I'm posting this thread with the hopes that it will generate enough interest/pressure to get Loveland Ski Area to host Colorado's first annual banked slalom event. While these events are traditionally the realm of knuckle-draggers, I think a weekend long event with one day for the skiers and one day for the riders would be awesome! Ideally, there'd be prizes, live music, beer, and good times; why not roll it into the spring fling?

I wrote Loveland's head of Marketing last season a couple of times while I was hurt and this was his response

We got the first e-mail you sent….and you sent it on the 21st, so it hasn’t even been a week yet.

It is a good idea and it is one we have discussed in the past. We did a very small one for an event last spring. It would be fun, but not sure if we are going to do one next season. Still got quite a bit of this season to go before we start planning the next one.

We appreciate your enthusiasm, but this is probably going to go on the back burner for a bit while we finish out the season. If we are looking at next spring, we still have a year to plan this thing out if we decide to host one.

Thanks for the e-mails. Please be patient and we will keep you posted. Hope you are getting healed up!

Thanks,

John Sellers
Marketing & Communications Director
Loveland Ski Area
POB 899
Georgetown, CO 80444
[P] 303.571.5580 X172
[F] 303.571.5580
johnsellers@skiloveland.com

I've wrote him once again at the beginning of the '12/'13 season but never heard back from him.

I don't really understand why they don't want to host an event like this? The gully under chair 9 skiers right of the headwall #4 would be perfect for a banker event. I have several friends in the industry who work for companies that would love to be involved in something like this in Colorado. A lot of people around the Loveland scene say that John "isn't the most fun guy" and kinda sucks at what he does. So I figure maybe by putting the idea out to more people, maybe we can get one put together for some fun times this spring. I mean, why the hell not? Its not like a freestyle comp where the chance for injury is high. Its a laid-back good times event to get people to come out to Loveland for a good time. From a marketing perspective, I see this as a total win for the hill. What gives?

If you don't know what a banker event looks like, here are a few vids.

The original: The Legendary Baker Banked Slalom

The Young gun: Drink Water's The Rat Race on Mt. Hood

The good guy: The Dirksen Derby on Mt. Bachelor (proceeds get donated to charity)

So lets have a banker at the Love!!! Who's with me?

**MakersTeleMark** · 09-04-2013, 05:35 PM

Because chinese downhills are way more entertaining.

**Mike_Records** · 09-04-2013, 06:11 PM

Loveland is a funny place: its a cool mountain, has a great local community, and is in a really convenient place to ski/ride. It also has some awesome employees like Dustin and Duncan who go out of their way to make it fun for the community of people that spend their free time there. But still, Loveland has been consistently moving away from activities that they regard as "high risk". Recently they've gotten rid of the 3 Pin Grin, the amateur terrain park comps, and early season terrain openings. These were the kind of things that drew me and many of the crew to Loveland in the first place, and the change in policy is why so many of us have spent so much less time at Loveland in recent years. I think this is ironic given that events like the New Belgium Scavenger hunt still exists which basically promotes getting drunk and going skiing. I think that a Banked Slalom event would be great community type event that I would love to participate in - the kind of event that could play to Loveland's strength of being a fun, family oriented ski area, NOT a megaresort.

I think one of Loveland's problems is that they have half assed things in the past and then when something goes wrong they use it as an excuse for not doing events right in the first place. For example, a few years ago now, a girl was paralyzed after she overshoot a jump in the terrain park. This was basically the beginning of the end for some of the amateur events at Loveland. But, the jump was flawed. The inrun was too long, the landing was too short and it had a tree in the landing. If they had done it right in the first case the girl likely wouldn't have been paralyzed. Classic Loveland.

Even if John Sellers might not be the exceptional person that we all wish he was, given that Loveland does monitor the TGR forums, it might be worth removing the personal attacks against him. If I were him, and I read that it wouldn't make me want you help you out. Its probably also worth talking to Duncan and Dustin as they are the ones in the past who have really gotten behind some of the other fun events.

**concretejungle** · 09-04-2013, 06:17 PM

I was waiting for the annual TGR thread for entitled LL skiers. It usually takes until they don't open terrain that maggots want but hey this is a great way for everyone to bash LL while still buying passes for 4 turns to flat/traverse.

**Mike_Records** · 09-04-2013, 06:28 PM

Originally Posted by concretejungle

I was waiting for the annual TGR thread for entitled LL skiers. It usually takes until they don't open terrain that maggots want but hey this is a great way for everyone to bash LL while still buying passes for 4 turns to flat/traverse.

You can accept things about the world you live in that you don't like OR you can do something to change them. OR you can be like you and bitch about others who take the initiative to change things they don't like. As you know, entitled LL skiers have gotten what they want in the past - and others in the community have benefited because of it.

**DasBlunt** · 09-04-2013, 06:31 PM

Originally Posted by concretejungle

I was waiting for the annual TGR thread for entitled LL skiers. It usually takes until they don't open terrain that maggots want but hey this is a great way for everyone to bash LL while still buying passes for 4 turns to flat/traverse.

^^^fuck that guy^^^ Concrete is a known bitch.

I have asked a few times about a banked slalom too.

they built all those new jumps off 6 this past season, big improvements.

They have the attitude and location to have the best Banked Slalom in the world, they just need the balls.

**hatchgreenchile** · 09-04-2013, 06:32 PM

Because they're too busy choking on powder?

Who knows. Who cares. Luv's cool just the way it is.

Plus, if you want 4 seconds of turns to a flat/ traverse, head down to Wolf Creek.

**concretejungle** · 09-04-2013, 06:52 PM

Originally Posted by DasBlunt

^^^fuck that guy^^^ Concrete is a known bitch.

I have asked a few times about a banked slalom too.

they built all those new jumps off 6 this past season, big improvements.

They have the attitude and location to have the best Banked Slalom in the world, they just need the balls.

So we aren't friends? Can we be imaginary friends?

Did you ask an actual person? If so maybe you can get them fired?

They said they've looked into it. MR, you've made your thoughts about LL known even in a thread that didn't ask for them. Either give them you're money or don't or start you're own ski area. I don't give a shit. You can start a kickstarter money drive for the banked slalom or your bro core ski area. Change the world bro.

**pbourdon** · 09-04-2013, 07:40 PM

Originally Posted by Mike_Records

Loveland is a funny place: its a cool mountain, has a great local community, and is in a really convenient place to ski/ride. It also has some awesome employees like Dustin and Duncan who go out of their way to make it fun for the community of people that spend their free time there. But still, Loveland has been consistently moving away from activities that they regard as "high risk". Recently they've gotten rid of the 3 Pin Grin, the amateur terrain park comps, and early season terrain openings. These were the kind of things that drew me and many of the crew to Loveland in the first place, and the change in policy is why so many of us have spent so much less time at Loveland in recent years. I think this is ironic given that events like the New Belgium Scavenger hunt still exists which basically promotes getting drunk and going skiing. I think that a Banked Slalom event would be great community type event that I would love to participate in - the kind of event that could play to Loveland's strength of being a fun, family oriented ski area, NOT a megaresort.

I think one of Loveland's problems is that they have half assed things in the past and then when something goes wrong they use it as an excuse for not doing events right in the first place. For example, a few years ago now, a girl was paralyzed after she overshoot a jump in the terrain park. This was basically the beginning of the end for some of the amateur events at Loveland. But, the jump was flawed. The inrun was too long, the landing was too short and it had a tree in the landing. If they had done it right in the first case the girl likely wouldn't have been paralyzed. Classic Loveland.

Even if John Sellers might not be the exceptional person that we all wish he was, given that Loveland does monitor the TGR forums, it might be worth removing the personal attacks against him. If I were him, and I read that it wouldn't make me want you help you out. Its probably also worth talking to Duncan and Dustin as they are the ones in the past who have really gotten behind some of the other fun events.

I think you hit the nail on the head Mike. I've brought this idea to Dustin and Duncan and while they were all about it; they said I really have to go through John as its ultimately his decision. I don't care if he reads this thread. Maybe it'd be good for him to see people don't think he is very "fun". Maybe he won't give a shit. I dunno. Fact of the matter is, it could, as you said play well with Loveland's strengths. Add to that that in the mid 90s, Loveland was home to as strong a snowboard scene as Baker with TONS of CO pros calling that their home mountain and it'd be great to honor that heritage.

But like you said, they've been shying away from anything that might put them at risk of getting sued. But who's to blame there? Sure, you can blame them for building a half-ass park and shitty features, but I would argue that the idiots who buy tickets and then do stuff beyond their ability levels are to blame, especially considering your lift ticket says "skiing is an inherently dangerous sport....blah, blah, blah". Its a shame we honor/reward stupidity in this country through law suits. If we were in Europe, you'd have to take responsibility for your own dumb actions. What a fucking concept.

I won't get into the debate regarding terrain openings as I have my opinions regarding just how much CO dry fluff you need to ski safely; but that's a whole 'nother ball of wax.

But yeah Mike, I agree with you. They're on a pace to only have a race club left to run a mountain for if they don't start offering what the general public wants. Hope all is well in your neck of the woods man.

**concretejungle** · 09-04-2013, 08:09 PM

Originally Posted by pbourdon

But yeah Mike, I agree with you. They're on a pace to only have a race club left to run a mountain for if they don't start offering what the general public wants. Hope all is well in your neck of the woods man.

I'm sure they'll continue to do whatever the fuck they want and make money. The general public isn't clamoring for a banked slalom or anything else that the TGR brahs want. LL will continue to not open anything resembling steep terrain, patrol the internetz for stupid reasons and keep bringing in the Front Range peeps who are tired of the crowds at the other resorts.

**pbourdon** · 09-04-2013, 08:44 PM

Originally Posted by concretejungle

I'm sure they'll continue to do whatever the fuck they want and make money. The general public isn't clamoring for a banked slalom or anything else that the TGR brahs want.

Agreed, but conditionally. They will continue to rely on the income generated by the race clubs who use their facilities in the early season; but they are in the process of developing cat skiing into dry gulch along with many other improvements. Hell, they expanded the Basin's cafeteria by something like 300 seats this summer. The public DOES want banked slalom events. If they didn't, they wouldn't be popping up at mountains all over the country like fuckin' herpes or some shit. And the public wants terrain parks/features to ride. If this weren't the case, Breck and Keystone are sure wasting a helluva lot of money building stuff that no one wants. You may wanna re-think your position there regarding just who the "general public" is these days. Everyone wants to be Shaun White and Tanner Hall. Only problem is, about 5% of the public has the ability to ride the kinds of features they see in the movies. Thank god for progression parks. That's another one that the Love could totally do, but won't. We should have 3 parks just like everywhere else. A small, medium, and large one so that people can progress at their own speed. Instead we have a half-assed janky mini park with no jumps, and a bunch of sketchy rails that actually are more dangerous, only because they cause more frequent minor injuries than a properly built 20ft table. Oh well. Yeah, I don't think they'll ever do a banker either; but not because its not what people want; but rather because they are a bit out of touch with what the public really wants (save for the cat skiing).

**hatchgreenchile** · 09-04-2013, 09:15 PM

Originally Posted by pbourdon

Agreed, but conditionally. They will continue to rely on the income generated by the race clubs who use their facilities in the early season; but they are in the process of developing cat skiing into dry gulch along with many other improvements. Hell, they expanded the Basin's cafeteria by something like 300 seats this summer. The public DOES want banked slalom events. If they didn't, they wouldn't be popping up at mountains all over the country like fuckin' herpes or some shit. And the public wants terrain parks/features to ride. If this weren't the case, Breck and Keystone are sure wasting a helluva lot of money building stuff that no one wants. You may wanna re-think your position there regarding just who the "general public" is these days. Everyone wants to be Shaun White and Tanner Hall. Only problem is, about 5% of the public has the ability to ride the kinds of features they see in the movies. Thank god for progression parks. That's another one that the Love could totally do, but won't. We should have 3 parks just like everywhere else. A small, medium, and large one so that people can progress at their own speed. Instead we have a half-assed janky mini park with no jumps, and a bunch of sketchy rails that actually are more dangerous, only because they cause more frequent minor injuries than a properly built 20ft table. Oh well. Yeah, I don't think they'll ever do a banker either; but not because its not what people want; but rather because they are a bit out of touch with what the public really wants (save for the cat skiing).

Making all sorts of assumptions here...

The "public" has all sorts of different wants and needs. Everyone values things differently. Sam Moneybags at Deer Valley. Tree freaks at Steamboat. Park rats for PCMR and Keystone. Deadhead telemarkers for Mad River Glen. Powderhounds for Baker and Alta. Could go on all day here...

Long ago, Luv figured out their obvious nitch. Expecting them to reinvent the wheel is a bit foolish? There's a reason there going the alpine terrain & cat ski option for expansion. They don't want to become a tall tee hangout....

Fuck, can it snow already?

**pbourdon** · 09-04-2013, 09:25 PM

Definitely true...all of it. I'm not even saying they need a good park. I don't wanna have the place crawling with park rats either; but still, they lost a lot of passholders when they made the decision to no longer build a park. The cat-skiing thing is rad for sure; but lets face it, there are only going to be so many days where the cat-skiing (and potentially lift served skiing) in dry gulch is any good any way. We're not Baker. We don't get 650"+ annually. We're lucky if we break 350".

The Banked slalom would be a one time event. It wouldn't be something they need to maintain all season like a park. It would just be a super fun event like corn harvest, or spring fling where members of the loveland community could come up and have fun in a pseudo-competitive way. Whatever, if they decide to never do one. It doesn't really matter that much to me; but I think it could be something that draws attention to the hill and becomes an event that people from all over the state/region would come to because, they're (banked races) are fucking fun as shit. If the love doesn't do one, someone else will and then they'll be kicking themselves for getting beat to the punch.

I figured most of the skiers on here wouldn't really get it any way. Bankers are more of a knuckle-dragging thing any way. Don't worry, you're only missing something fun...you know, like you do by not snowboarding. :P

**Mike_Records** · 09-04-2013, 09:33 PM

I think you are right Paul. For Loveland to consider a banked slalom they have to believe enough people are interested in it, it has to be proven to them. People have to email, facebook, etc expressing interest. I think its an awesome idea and would love to participate, I'll definitely send them an email.

All is well here, thanks for asking. I miss Colorado's weather, won't be long before I'm back!

**Mike_Records** · 09-04-2013, 09:35 PM

On a side note, I'm interested to see how the Dry Gulch cat skiing thing works out. I've spent a lot of time back there early and late season, but I have a hard time envisioning it as a place I'd personally spend a lot of time mid-season. That being said, its certainly beautiful back there and has a very isolated feeling, I could see people getting into it.

**hatchgreenchile** · 09-04-2013, 09:41 PM

Originally Posted by pbourdon

Definitely true...all of it. I'm not even saying they need a good park. I don't wanna have the place crawling with park rats either; but still, they lost a lot of passholders when they made the decision to no longer build a park. The cat-skiing thing is rad for sure; but lets face it, there are only going to be so many days where the cat-skiing (and potentially lift served skiing) in dry gulch is any good any way. We're not Baker. We don't get 650"+ annually. We're lucky if we break 350".

The Banked slalom would be a one time event. It wouldn't be something they need to maintain all season like a park. It would just be a super fun event like corn harvest, or spring fling where members of the loveland community could come up and have fun in a pseudo-competitive way. Whatever, if they decide to never do one. It doesn't really matter that much to me; but I think it could be something that draws attention to the hill and becomes an event that people from all over the state/region would come to because, they're (banked races) are fucking fun as shit. If the love doesn't do one, someone else will and then they'll be kicking themselves for getting beat to the punch.

I figured most of the skiers on here wouldn't really get it any way. Bankers are more of a knuckle-dragging thing any way. Don't worry, you're only missing something fun...you know, like you do by not snowboarding. :P

Sticking with the assumptions huh? I do drag thy knuckles.

Don't worry. I can steez my way through 350". If you can't have a good time on 29 feet of snow, well....I'll just leave it at that. I would see Dry Gulch as a BIG time addition to the area. Combined with that new chair above 8 and you've got, arguably, some of the best high alpine terrain near I70. That will create ALOT of positive chatter for Luv.

There are always people you miss out on when you don't appeal to them. Obviously, they felt it more important to focus on keeping those runs as groomers instead of rail hits. That's their call. If dudes are upset, go to Keystone. Those PBR poundin rats ain't driving revenue for the mountain anyway.

**pbourdon** · 09-04-2013, 11:04 PM

Originally Posted by Mike_Records

On a side note, I'm interested to see how the Dry Gulch cat skiing thing works out. I've spent a lot of time back there early and late season, but I have a hard time envisioning it as a place I'd personally spend a lot of time mid-season. That being said, its certainly beautiful back there and has a very isolated feeling, I could see people getting into it.

Yeah. I think I didn't really express how I feel about the cat skiing the right way and got side-tracked by that. I think expanding into Dry Gulch will be pretty sick as long as the numbers going back in there are managed. If it gets tracked out quick and looses the isolated feeling you get back there, so what. I don't know what the long term is there; but I've heard rumors of eventually a lift going back there to aid in returning skiers to the frontside as I'm not sure how they're planning on doing a cat shuttle back in-bounds. But yeah, it could be really nice to get some lazy man quality turns back there.

Again, I digress. I think what I dig about the bankers is that its accessible to anyone. You can have kids who are 7-8 and just getting into skiing and riding competing and having as much fun as old farts like me and bendtheski who aren't about to send 40ft tables anymore but are still down to slash a turn or two. I think the fact that a banked event reminds us all to just have fun on the mountain is reason enough the love should have one. I've been all over this state in the past 3 years and there are only a handful of resorts that really have the "soul" (what ever that means) to host a banked slalom and not hype the shit out of it and turn it into a circus and the love is one of them. That's ultimately why I'm so puzzled as to John's reluctance to consider hosting such an event when people like NeverSummer, Satellite boardshop, Unity Snowoards, etc. all think its an awesome idea and would be happy to sponsor it.

I would love to see this event come to fruition in one way or another. If the love won't host it, so it goes. I'd be willing to bet someone else will though.

**DasBlunt** · 09-05-2013, 12:26 AM

Banked Slalom is not for park rats. Some of the most dedicated hardbooters are at Loveland. And throw in prize money and sponsors.......

At Loveland, we could have one of the best, if not the best.

Spectator access would be all time, BBQ, sunny days, bands...it would be amazing... maybe even just because of the location of the spot.

Jackson and Travis Rice tried to have a yearly event (something.... ditch...can't remember the name), but they moved it to Baldface, I have no idea if for resort reasons or slapback from some existing douchebag element?

Most skiers are cool, but TGR for sure packs in the douchbags.

**AdironRider** · 09-05-2013, 09:39 AM

You seem to be confusing the Dicks Ditch banked slalom and the Natural Selection one off event back in 07.

Dicks lives on. Natural Selection moved allegedly for better filming angles or some bullshit.

**DasBlunt** · 09-05-2013, 09:41 AM

Originally Posted by AdironRider

You seem to be confusing the Dicks Ditch banked slalom and the Natural Selection one off event back in 07.

Dicks lives on. Natural Selection moved allegedly for better filming angles or some bullshit.

oh cool, dicks ditch is still happening!? That is a rad course...have you ridden it?

**pbourdon** · 09-05-2013, 10:49 AM

Originally Posted by DasBlunt

Banked Slalom is not for park rats. Some of the most dedicated hardbooters are at Loveland. And throw in prize money and sponsors.......

At Loveland, we could have one of the best, if not the best.

Banked slaloms are for everyone! Look at the Rat Race vidya. Those dudes are all dedicated urban riders, with a couple of freeride destroyers thrown in for good measure. Like I said before, the raddest part about doing a banked event is that just about anyone can do it, as long as you can turn. While I do agree that we have an awesome location for an event, I don't think it would ever be the "best in the world". That honor my friend, rests squarely with the Baker Banked event which has been going on since like 82 or something retarded.

Originally Posted by AdironRider

You seem to be confusing the Dicks Ditch banked slalom and the Natural Selection one off event back in 07.

Dicks lives on. Natural Selection moved allegedly for better filming angles or some bullshit.

Didn't know Dicks was still rocking. That's cool. That course looked tighter and steeper than Bakers gully. As I understood it, JHMR didn't like having to close Cody Bowl for several weeks to let it fill in without tracks for the comp. I'm sure the filming thing played a factor as well. I mean, if red bull can't get a good shot of their logo, how else are we supposed to know this event is "cool".

**This End Up** · 09-06-2013, 11:30 AM

Let Loveland be Loveland, a low key local ski hill. Leave the hoopla for the Destination Resorts on the other side of the divide. There is nothing worse than just wanting to go skiing, pulling into your resort of choice, and seeing a banner saying; “Today we are proud to host the Red Bull exXxtreme……..whatever”. It means parking and lift lines are fuct.

However the late terrain opening at the Luv needs to change.

**Hacksaw** · 09-06-2013, 12:20 PM

Exactly, where at LL do you guys want this thing?

**smitchell333** · 09-06-2013, 02:30 PM

If it means so much to you, why don't you organize the thing? Go talk to your industry friends about sponsorship, figure out and document the beneficial economics, and present a business plan for it to Loveland.

Otherwise to Loveland you probably seem like you're just a another handful of weirdos asking for some event that they scratch their head for 5 minutes about the value of and then forget about.