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  1. #1026
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Wasatch
    Posts
    7,239
    Quote Originally Posted by Huskydoc View Post
    In what way? My 187 holds a place of honor in my quiver, but I wonder 'what if' re 192's
    Today was 15-20”. But 192 is just for really big days. I think 192 would have been even better today. But it’s just really cause I am a ski collector


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
    I need to go to Utah.
    Utah?
    Yeah, Utah. It's wedged in between Wyoming and Nevada. You've seen pictures of it, right?

    So after 15 years we finally made it to Utah.....


    Thanks BCSAR and POWMOW Ski Patrol for rescues

    8, 17, 13, 18, 16, 18, 20, 19, 16, 24, 32, 35

    2021/2022 (13/15)

  2. #1027
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    865
    Interested in those 187 protests on gearswap... but worried about length. Im 6'1" 185 and generally like skis around 190. I am not opposed to shorter wider skis but will i feel like im falling over the tips? whats the general length consensus for the ski?
    Last edited by Westcoaster; 01-02-2022 at 06:33 PM.

  3. #1028
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Imaginationland
    Posts
    4,785
    Quote Originally Posted by Westcoaster View Post
    Interested in those 187 protests on gearswap... but worried about length. Im 6'1" 185 and generally like skis around 190. I am not unopposed to shorter wider skis but will i feel like im falling over the tips? whats the general length consensus for the ski?
    You would probably be better off on the 192

  4. #1029
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Wasatch
    Posts
    7,239
    Quote Originally Posted by Westcoaster View Post
    Interested in those 187 protests on gearswap... but worried about length. Im 6'1" 185 and generally like skis around 190. I am not unopposed to shorter wider skis but will i feel like im falling over the tips? whats the general length consensus for the ski?
    I am similar weight and height and have both 187 and 192. 187 is fine and does not sink. If it’s really deep like 2-3 feet or more out comes the 192. But 187 is one of the most capable sub 190 skis I have. I like them at -1.5. But they are a true 187 and don’t have a speed limit. But 192 is easy and fun as well


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
    I need to go to Utah.
    Utah?
    Yeah, Utah. It's wedged in between Wyoming and Nevada. You've seen pictures of it, right?

    So after 15 years we finally made it to Utah.....


    Thanks BCSAR and POWMOW Ski Patrol for rescues

    8, 17, 13, 18, 16, 18, 20, 19, 16, 24, 32, 35

    2021/2022 (13/15)

  5. #1030
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    idaho panhandle!
    Posts
    9,949
    Quote Originally Posted by Westcoaster View Post
    Interested in those 187 protests on gearswap... but worried about length. Im 6'1" 185 and generally like skis around 190. I am not opposed to shorter wider skis but will i feel like im falling over the tips? whats the general length consensus for the ski?
    Food for thought.
    I’m 5’10”, 195lbs twisted steel and sex appeal.
    Own OG 188 stock flex and custom 192 4 flex. I have skied the 187 4 flex.
    You have a little more height on me, I have more mass. The stock 188 is awesome in fresh and can haul ass. The 192 4flex flat kills it in fresh as well as chop thanks to the stiffer flex, same with the 187. The 187 may be a touch more nimble but the 192 is crazy nimble as well so probably pretty similar. Both haul the mail in open spaces. The 192 is a touch more stable, maybe it’s also in my head. Bottom line is they both fucking rule.
    Float, the 187 and 192 float pretty similar. 192 seemed to get on plane a touch quicker and a little easier on lower angle not requiring such a neutral stance there.
    Bottom line is if you fucking charge and/or ski a mountain that is more open with drops and such, go 192, if a more techy mountain a guy could be happy on the 187.
    Bottom line, if 4 flex they both rule pow and soft chop.
    Mount both back -1.5cm. I’m -1.75 on my 192’s and fucking love that location.

  6. #1031
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Posts
    1,037
    Skied a pair of 187s a few years back, mounted at -1 or -1,5. I'm 190/83kg, and ski with a forward stance, but absolutely not a racer. For me they didn't float very well, felt way to short, they were surprisingly good in shallow chop though.

    I'd wait for one of Keiths sales and buy a pair of 192s in whatever flex you feel suits you. Probably 3+ or 4.

  7. #1032
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Location
    Mid-tomahawk
    Posts
    1,712
    Quote Originally Posted by HAB View Post
    Couple other thoughts:

    I also think the UL build flexes a tiny bit softer and rounder than my older MAP (essentially the predecessor to the Enduro core) — both veneer Flex 3s. For a ski that I'm not skiing resort chop on, and at my weight, I think that's probably a good thing — if anything, it makes them even easier in tight spots, and probably helps a little with float — but if I was significantly heavier I bet I'd want to go to a Flex 4.

    I'm also really happy with the slightly narrower waist for a touring ski that does see some weird firm, off-camber skin tracks from time time time. I've had a couple major lower body orthopedic injuries that aren't always super thrilled with the extra torque. But I also have full size Protests, Renegades, and Lotus 138s in the quiver too, so right tool for the job and all that.
    I've got a few more days on them now, and I'm only getting more psyched about these. They're predictably awesome in pow, but hit a patch of sun crust the other day and basically only noticed because I started hearing crunchy noises. My partner was on a much narrower, more traditionally shaped ski and was struggling pretty badly on that little face. And then skied some weird scraped off bullshit through a bunch of alder on the exit and they felt surprisingly fine doing hop turns on firm snow. Not their forte, obviously, but way more manageable than expected.

    I do need to figure something better out for the skin tail clip. The standard Pomoca one kind of sucks anyway, and really doesn't like the very rounded tail on these. I grabbed a pair of the twin tip connectors to try, but they're not a great fit either. Mostly because they shorten the amount of tail I have between the end of the skin and the clip to almost zero, so there's not enough length to get any good stretch out of it. If they didn't have a full wrap edge I'd be tempted to put a little notch in the tail, but cutting the skins a little shorter and putting a different tail strap might be the move.

  8. #1033
    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Location
    ahead
    Posts
    153
    I've got some Alpinist+ Glides that might do the trick

  9. #1034
    Join Date
    Apr 2020
    Posts
    114
    Need advice. Just picked up a barely used pair of 187s. Enduro core with carbon, veneer top sheet, standard flex. Camber / rocker profile looks way off from spec and seen in images. About 7.5mm camber (15mm total between skis) and only 120mm tip splay when decambered. Is this normal or do I have a pair with a custom profile?

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  10. #1035
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    livin the dream
    Posts
    5,761
    Looks custom


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    Best Skier on the Mountain
    Self-Certified
    1992 - 2012
    Squaw Valley, USA

  11. #1036
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    PNW
    Posts
    1,633
    tail rocker looks off too. post a straight on shot, maybe not protests?

  12. #1037
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    621
    Yep, no way Protests have that much camber

  13. #1038
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    3,326
    My protests did


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  14. #1039
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    2,902
    Quote Originally Posted by KM14 View Post
    Need advice. Just picked up a barely used pair of 187s. Enduro core with carbon, veneer top sheet, standard flex. Camber / rocker profile looks way off from spec and seen in images. About 7.5mm camber (15mm total between skis) and only 120mm tip splay when decambered. Is this normal or do I have a pair with a custom profile?
    Camber height is supposed to be 3mm stock - https://www.praxisskis.com/skis/protest/

    Sounds like you and skibrd got either custom jobs or somebody f'd up. Skibrd, didn't you not really like your protests? That might be why!
    sproing!

  15. #1040
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    621
    Well yours must be screwed up then too. Both my pairs have barely any camber and on the Praxis site they're listed at 3mm so

  16. #1041
    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Location
    ahead
    Posts
    153
    My brand new pair of 192's have almost no camber

  17. #1042
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Bellevue
    Posts
    7,431
    Those look like Freerides, not protests.

  18. #1043
    Join Date
    Apr 2020
    Posts
    114
    Spoke with Keith. They are protests. Not sure what's up with them.

  19. #1044
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    3,326

    Praxis Protest..just how cool is it?

    I sold all my Protests because of things like that. One day I loved them, others I hated them. I started to see over time the camber profiles were drastically different day to day. I skied my Protests every day in Japan for 2 weeks, they started out with 1cm of camber (base to base) and after the trip they were full reverse. I went from these are alright to these are amazing. Got home and they never felt good again. Same with the Quixotes, took them to Steamboat for a trip, skied pow for 5 days straight, they were full reverse after the trip. Took them back to Jackson, didn’t ski them for a few days and they sucked, camber was back.

    Keith does really cool skis, but for me it’s not worth it any more to not know what I was getting on every day. I brought this up to him, he said it was use/improper storage/abuse, and I dropped it. Clearly he didn’t want to have the discussion and whatever. Some people love his stuff, some don’t. I switched to big ski manufacturers and am fairly happy. Yeah the same thing happens over time to my Blizzards/Kaestle/K2s, but not as drastically.

    Skis do die, I get about 80-100 days out of a pair of Blizzards. Kastle MX98s I get 300. They do change. But the QA wasn’t there for me so I moved on. If you are nervous about that from Protests, get Pon2oons or ski something narrower. Yeah Uber fats are fun, but you really don’t need them 99.999% of the time. I only grab the Pon2oons if it’s >18in of upside down pow. Other then that it’s something ~115mm wide.

    I also don’t (and never will) care enough to document how a ski changes over time to show someone like Keith how their ski changes. He makes beautiful skis and probably 75% of the skis made won’t be skied has hard as I pushed mine. I’m a large person, and I skied a lot the past 7 years.


    I’m also in a grumpy mood today, so take that into account.


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  20. #1045
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    in the trench
    Posts
    15,690
    Thats strange . My og gpo's have a few hindred days on them and camber is still dead on stock. My praxis w the most days. My protests were 3mm measured

    Sent from my SM-G950W using TGR Forums mobile app

  21. #1046
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Bellevue
    Posts
    7,431
    Quote Originally Posted by grinch View Post
    Thats strange . My og gpo's have a few hindred days on them and camber is still dead on stock. My praxis w the most days. My protests were 3mm measured

    Sent from my SM-G950W using TGR Forums mobile app
    Similar boat here, I've got 4.5 or 5 flex GPOs that I haven't noticed any changes to. I got those in October 2013 and have hundreds of days on them.
    Quote Originally Posted by skibrd View Post
    I sold all my Protests because of things like that. One day I loved them, others I hated them. I started to see over time the camber profiles were drastically different day to day. I skied my Protests every day in Japan for 2 weeks, they started out with 1cm of camber (base to base) and after the trip they were full reverse. I went from these are alright to these are amazing. Got home and they never felt good again. Same with the Quixotes, took them to Steamboat for a trip, skied pow for 5 days straight, they were full reverse after the trip. Took them back to Jackson, didn’t ski them for a few days and they sucked, camber was back.

    Keith does really cool skis, but for me it’s not worth it any more to not know what I was getting on every day. I brought this up to him, he said it was use/improper storage/abuse, and I dropped it. Clearly he didn’t want to have the discussion and whatever. Some people love his stuff, some don’t. I switched to big ski manufacturers and am fairly happy. Yeah the same thing happens over time to my Blizzards/Kaestle/K2s, but not as drastically.

    Skis do die, I get about 80-100 days out of a pair of Blizzards. Kastle MX98s I get 300. They do change. But the QA wasn’t there for me so I moved on. If you are nervous about that from Protests, get Pon2oons or ski something narrower. Yeah Uber fats are fun, but you really don’t need them 99.999% of the time. I only grab the Pon2oons if it’s >18in of upside down pow. Other then that it’s something ~115mm wide.

    I also don’t (and never will) care enough to document how a ski changes over time to show someone like Keith how their ski changes. He makes beautiful skis and probably 75% of the skis made won’t be skied has hard as I pushed mine. I’m a large person, and I skied a lot the past 7 years.


    I’m also in a grumpy mood today, so take that into account.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
    Interesting. I'm curious if the layup has something to do with this? Maybe unbalanced on the top and bottom? What were yours?

  22. #1047
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Cascades
    Posts
    666
    Skied my protests last 2 days in a row.
    These skis still rule.
    You will still have to pry them from my cold dead hands.
    That is all

  23. #1048
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    3,326
    Quote Originally Posted by abraham View Post
    Similar boat here, I've got 4.5 or 5 flex GPOs that I haven't noticed any changes to. I got those in October 2013 and have hundreds of days on them. Interesting. I'm curious if the layup has something to do with this? Maybe unbalanced on the top and bottom? What were yours?
    Everything was enduro w/ carbon 4 flex. The Super Freerides and Protests were veneer top sheets. The Quixotes were the stock top sheet.

    I didn’t notice as much of a change in how they skied with the Super Freerides day to day. More of my issues with them was tune and mounting point.

    The Quixotes and Protests just changed so much. They were Dr Jekle and Mr Hyde skis. I sort of said the same thing in the old Quixote thread. 90% if they time they were amazing, 10% of the time WTF. Sort of how Tabke can sometimes crush everyone on the tour, it’s not even close, then he takes a weird ass fall and everyone is like wtf.


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  24. #1049
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    whitefish
    Posts
    1,232
    Anyone find the touring equivalent of the protest? Similar shape, a little less weight, etc I always enjoy ski touring on mine but it’s hands down my heaviest set up. Just curious to hear people’s experience with similar style ski. I ski my wife’s BMT122 and gives me a similar feel

  25. #1050
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Cascades
    Posts
    666

    Praxis Protest..just how cool is it?

    ^Uuuhh yeah, the wootest was made for exactly that. Check praxis website and extensive threads on it here

    FWIW I have a pair and while they are similar, they don’t ski quite the same
    Last edited by TripleT; 01-08-2022 at 06:59 PM.

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