Nursing connections in the mountain west?

[Whiteroom_Guardian]

Salida?


Definitely looking into more of the warmer/lower elevation towns.


I assume year round work for a grunt like me could be pretty tough though. Work at monarch in the winter and build stuff in the summer?

[Jethro]

My wife went back to school in her mid 30's, and the Aspen Valley Medical foundation paid almost all her schooling costs. After getting her RN license, the same hospital (Aspen) would not hire her as a new nurse. She has worked the last few years as an ER nurse at Valley View (Glenwood) to get some experience under her belt. In time she will hopefully get into the Aspen hospital, as we live in Aspen.

The Valley View hospital is awesome. I am having rotator cuff surgery there tomorrow.

WG, I work as an electrician. The economy is turning around, but it is still pretty competitive here with cheaper work traveling a long way to get work.

[crashidy]

Interesting to hear the American perspective on this. I am in Alberta, Canada. I live in the Rockies close to skiing and drive 50 minutes each way to work.Working as a nurse in the city(childrens hospital: ER, PICU and critical care transport RN) and skiing/biking on days off with out having to venture far from home. The general theme seems to be similar. Many jobs, then no jobs however the common ground is that if you have somewhere you can get experience stay there for a year or two then start looking elsewhere. Use your connections to develop your skills as there is a huge difference between a new grad and one with several years experience. Also GPA doesn't mean shit if you don't present/interview well. We are going through some interesting times up here with government cutbacks/ health care reorganization etc. One thing sort of going for us is that we are unionized so that helps to an extent.
I know several nurses who have worked south of the border as well as several American nurses who have worked up here. Completely different systems with different perks i guess. One thing they all say is that Nursing is cyclical. Be persistent and keep your eyes open and eventually something will work out.
I too am hoping to travel south sometime in the future to work in SLC or Denver Children ED if the opportunity should arise. Never hurts to experience more skiing !!
If anyone has any questions about the Canadian system or coming north let me know!

[summit]

SLC is reputedly one of the lowest pay areas for RNs near skiing, along with MT in general. I hear they are starting new grads at $18/hr.

Of course the biggest Denver hospital system is starting starting new grads at $20.50/hr.

Phishy...

Have her look into Valley View in Glenwood Springs, and Aspen Valley Hospital in Aspen. A lot of very cool nurses at both hospitals.

Is VV still making new grads sign a 3 year contract?

Phish: I assume she is in a BSN program from what you said? If not her fight is all the harder.

It is a hard market for new grads. Bottom line: don't move without a job, and if she gets that ICU job have her work it until she gets another job. Moving with no job is shooting craps... too easily yields desperation that turns into choices between night shift med/surg and day shift at a nursing home after 12 months of fruitless searching, a shitty place for someone with their heart set on critical care.

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[Jethro]

Is VV still making new grads sign a 3 year contract?

I am not sure what the current policy is.. In 09 my wife did that. That is only for a new hire out of school. The hospital invests in a lot of training of new graduates

[summit]

Signing on for three years or even two as a n00b just seems like a bit too long of a recipe for "permission to fuck my schedule and minimize raises." I hear CO HCA new grad programs are two year contracts. Where you start can make a huge difference in pay... in CO new grads can make anywhere from $20.50 to $28.50 base pay and benefits vary wildly from 2 weeks PTO + crappy health insurance to 5 weeks vacation + 3 weeks sick time with great health plans. Some places have no vacation at all because low-census call-offs burn up all your PTO in order to keep your benefits.

[Whiteroom_Guardian]

Summit, she is in a 2-year program at a teaching hospital. She figured it would be best to learn by actually being at a hospital everyday instead of going to a BSN program at the local university. Why is BSN so much better? Students in her school have more one on one with patients than students at any other program in the state.

[grskier]

Not sure what valley view is doing with contracts and new grads.

[summit]

Summit, she is in a 2-year program at a teaching hospital. She figured it would be best to learn by actually being at a hospital everyday instead of going to a BSN program at the local university. Why is BSN so much better? Students in her school have more one on one with patients than students at any other program in the state.

As I understand you, she is in a hospital diploma program and won't have a degree in nursing. I am glad we are clear on this point. Why/what/when/where of the diploma vs degree doesn't enter into the practical answer to your original question. That doesn't make her incapable, incompetent, or anything, but it is a huge factor in your question. I want to be clear I am not judging anyone's competence whether they are diploma ADN or BSN. I am however talking market reality.

Bottom line, she is going to have an EXTREMELY hard time getting a job in a western hospital with no degree, no experience, and no connections. Odds aren't as bad as Powerball, but they aren't much better. That is what the job market is. The market wants new grads to have BSNs to work in hospitals, (4 year degrees in other fields not considered as substitutes), particularly new grad programs. Not even having an associates in nursing is a problem in the West. Diploma programs have their merits, but they are almost completely extinct because the market wants degreed nurses. BSN nurses will be the majority of new grads within the next year or two. Annually, only 4% percent of new nurses in the US come from hospital diploma programs, and almost all of those are in the North East. If her goal is to work in an ICU in the mountainous west, he would be a fool to do anything but get in where she has connections out there (where a diploma might be respected by the hiring manager) and while she earns her 1-2 years of ICU experience she should earn her RN-BSN whether she pays or her employer pays. With her previous degrees she could do it in one year and mostly online. She would be very wise to choose a CCNE or ACEN (NLNAC) accredited RN-BSN program. Not doing so will permanently be a limitation on her employability.

Feel free to browse the ads out in the mountainous west. You are going to see 90% of the hospital jobs reading:
"Active RN license, 1 years experience required, 2 years preferred, ADN required, BSN preferred"
"Active RN license, 1 year experience preferred, BSN required."
"New graduate program, BSN required"

[beaterdit]

Yeah anything less than a BSN anymore and you're gonna be working in the nursing home. If she can get an ICU job back there out of her current program it would be wise to take that. I kind of assumed she was getting a BSN as that seems to be where everything is going now.

With two years of ICU experience she should be able to find a job in almost any market though. If she can further her education economically in the meantime that's a good option. Is this a certificate program? I don't really understand what it is. I only have a ASN myself but when I entered the field it was a different animal. It's much more competitive now. If she has to sign a two year contract to get some good experience, it's worth it IMO. Getting screwed on your schedule in a good hospital job is better than sitting pretty in the nursing home, and two years goes by pretty quick.

Oh yeah, the pay in the Salt Lake Valley is pretty bad but it's not much lower than Denver, like Summit said, a couple bucks. Living is a bit cheaper here too, as is real estate.

[BS720]

^^Back in the day (and even still today, rarely), people would put together a program in a hospital without a university attached to it. They couldn't grant an ADN, so they got diplomas. Still usually takes 2 years, but they cut some of the classroom crap that it takes to get an ADN(sociology, etc).

Summit, I should probably point out a loophole for you to look at, when she has her two years of experience. She can get into travel nursing. The pay sucks, but it gets your foot in the door. You just make sure you don't sign a contract stating you won't work for the hospital for 12 months after you complete the travel assignment. Close to the end of the contract, you can inquire about staying per diem. This has lead to 3 full time offers for me. If she does strong work on her contract, they will want to keep her around. If she can function in the unit, they won't give a shit about her degree.

[beaterdit]

Huh, didn't know such a thing existed. Still seems like regardless of your degree, if you have solid experience you're gonna be OK.

Just asked a new grad on my unit what she makes and it's $22/hr with an ADN. As a rule, we don't take new grads, especially ADNs, unless they were nursing student interns with one of our cohorts or critical care interns but she was an HCA (CNA) in good standing on our unit for a few years.

[Whiteroom_Guardian]

Yes, she will graduate in June with a diploma not a BSN. Her reasoning is that BSN = more research experience and less clinical time actually working with patients.

She has done alot of research during the summer interning for a family friend/MD at Bronx Hospital while she was getting her BS in Biology. Yes, I am sure it is harder for her to get a job without a BSN, but she isn't just some girl straight out of HS. Her undergrad Biology degree from a top school, perfect 4.0, class president, holding 2 positions on the state board, already having interned in the ICU, research experience at a major city hospital, as well as being fluent in multiple languages, etc will have to count for something.

I am just selfishly hoping we can gtfo of NJ sooner rather than later. This place is killing me.

[cmcrawfo]

Truly a BSN (or BScN) is more valuable than a diploma. that being said, its worth varies in different locations and settings. To be truly mobile and to take advantage of the multiple career opportunities a BSN is the ticket. Some states / provinces will not recognize a diploma program as entry into practice, some health care facilitates prefer it when hiring new grads.... will her other degrees add value, yes. but to a regulatory body, no.

My advise, get licensed in the state/province you were educated in first (rather than trying to originally register in a state/province that you were not educated in). Then, begin the licensing process for the state/province you want to work in. This can take several months.

If there is an area or facility you really want to work in, take a casual job first (unless there is something better available). If you want something more permanent, then you can usually apply internally to the positions later.

Nursing can be old school, almost militant. Many hiring managers trained back in the day of uniforms, staff dorms, and saluting doctors. work experience and time in go further than actual credentials.

I would avoid signing commitment contracts, unless they offer transferable credentials.. IE a fully funded critical care course may be worth a 2 year commitment (but that's a cost benefit equation you need to do your self).

[cmcrawfo]

If she had a year of critical care experience and valid ACLS, I could promise her a job in British Columbia's Interior.

[Z]

If she had a year of critical care experience and valid ACLS, I could promise her a job in British Columbia's Interior.

So. My girl is going up to vancouver to take the SEC assesment to get her nursing license for BC Dec 3rd. Has all the above.

Where specifically are you?

[nest]

So. My girl is going up to vancouver to take the SEC assesment to get her nursing license for BC Dec 3rd. Has all the above.

Where specifically are you?

Thought you were moving to Bozeman?

[Whiteroom_Guardian]

Doood. Sick.

FYI Seb is guiding at Mike Wiegele's now. Lucky bastard is living it.

[cmcrawfo]

So. My girl is going up to vancouver to take the SEC assesment to get her nursing license for BC Dec 3rd. Has all the above.

Where specifically are you?

I am in Vernon, but the entire health authority is screaming for nurses. http://careers.roomtogrowbc.com/ Kelowna and Kamloops always have positions open. But the health authority covers a massive area, so plenty of options.

Just a note, on the website positions listed as "A+" are not actual positions, but open place holders for applicants. They often reflect casual positions. Its a unionized work environment, so many more postings are internally posted, and can be applied for once you are hired on as a casual. If you want contact info for a recruiter or beta on an area, PM me.

[Z]

Cmcraw - Thanks for the tips. The lady is psyched, hopefully she will pass the assessment, these areas eager to hire a gringo? Will hit you up after the new year for sure!

Thought you were moving to Bozeman?

I am here. Dig it so far. But in love with Interior BC. Want to make some turns?

phish - Sebastian? Awesome. Did he have a canadian girlfriend or something? Very cool.

[Dr. Crank]

My advise, get licensed in the state/province you were educated in first (rather than trying to originally register in a state/province that you were not educated in). Then, begin the licensing process for the state/province you want to work in. This can take several months.

Why do you say that? I didnt get registered in the province I was educated in, but don't remember any big issues when getting in with CRNBC. Managed to write the NCLEX too. Hopefully the registration thing doesn't come back to bite me.

Saluting the docs sounds hilarious and absurd. Glad I didn't have to live through that shit.

[cmcrawfo]

If you dont register in the province you write your exam in, it delays the initial licensing process by a few weeks , but the bigger issue is if you decide to licence in another province or the province your were initially educated in ...why ? I dont really know. It was explained to me that it had do do with verifying your credentials and that they only keep your exams for so many years unless you register... it made little sense to me, but turns out they were right.

I completed my education in Ontario, licensed first in BC. 6 years later, applied for a licence in Ontario ... had to go through a very drawn out process (about a month longer than my wife, who was educated and licensed only in BC previously) .... really, I think its only a big deal if you ever plan on working in another region ..... I never thought I was going to be in Ontario again, turned out it was a lesson learned..... thankfully its all behind me, and I am back in BC .... dealing with the nightmare that is having CRNBC recognize my Nurse Practitioner Credential (thankfully that's less important to me than slaying POW).

....Funnier than saluting Dr's ( Truly it was more of a stand up, give them your chair and be quiet until they leave ) nurses didn't even take blood pressures!!! ... and yes, there are still nursing managers alive today that lived and breathed that shit.

[ill-advised strategy]

....Funnier than saluting Dr's ( Truly it was more of a stand up, give them your chair and be quiet until they leave ) nurses didn't even take blood pressures!!! ... and yes, there are still nursing managers alive today that lived and breathed that shit.

When my GF was in the ICU at Royal Jubilee in Victoria, there was an older woman working in the old school uniform. White skirt, white leggings, the weird tiara thing. In 2010, surrounded by docs, nurses, RTs, everyone else in scrubs. Seemed like she was the mgr, or at least a go-to resource for the other nurses on duty. It was surreal.

[cmcrawfo]

It would be awesome to be able to rep an old school uniform ... cross dressing aside.

[Dr. Crank]

Some people like the old uniforms, nurses are easily identifiable and all that...but no easy solution for the non cross-dressing guys!

My mom tells me how the very sick patients used to be expected to sit up straight when the docs came in the room. There is still a bit of that old school deference going on. After starting my work career outside of health care, I'm still surprised at how reluctant people seem to call docs by their first names.

Too bad CRNBC doesn't want to recognise your NP designation? I've wondered about doing the NP thing at some point myself, but I'm also just stoked to ski powder and don't want to step away from that for too long...Besides the job is good here. Actually just a short drive north of you. Best part is the easy access to the Monashees.