"NO, but we can order that for you"

[schuss]

imho you have to take into account that there are customers who already know what they want and thus won't pay for your traditional "added value" of information/expertise etc. These guys already have it, they just want/need product at the best price and best timing.

I believe these are the guys who would respond to the "kiosk/showroom shop" model the best. I am in the market for new ski boots, I know what I like and from my time spent here at TGR, I know what is available. I sure as shit am not going to spend full retail at a local shop, but wouldn't mind paying a bit over "rock bottom internet" to get to try them on in a cool shop then complete my own order online from a terminal by the window. I like the idea of delivery to the shop so you have to come back in too - then you might sell me some gloves or wax or a tune etc...

I love this idea, but I really don't think it would be effective for the bread and butter of the ski shops of today, which I assume is still the family/uninformed consumer/one trip a year skier needing a whole new setup for xmas week?!?

Note that this model isn't good for the "near the resort" ski shop, but rather a more city type one. I think you could find traction in being the source for outdoors stuff in a city area, as I have yet to be impressed by any outdoors type shop in an urban setting (excluding Seattle. Screw you guys for having so many good options).
This wouldn't replace local shops in their entirety, just provide an alternative that blends everything that's available these days.

[Hugh Conway]

Note that this model isn't good for the "near the resort" ski shop, but rather a more city type one. I think you could find traction in being the source for outdoors stuff in a city area, as I have yet to be impressed by any outdoors type shop in an urban setting (excluding Seattle. Screw you guys for having so many good options).
This wouldn't replace local shops in their entirety, just provide an alternative that blends everything that's available these days.

eh, I think it could be useful for the "near the resort" ski shop as well. I've tried on boots in Mammoth because there are effectively no ski shops in southern california (bit like there aren't many in the Bay Area now); I would have bought the boots even, but they didn't have them in stock. So I ordered them from Telemark_pyrenees and they were at my home before the next weekend. A decent priced North American partner who'd have shipped it when I ordered it in the shop probably would have gotten the sale.

[JayPowHound]

I've worked in ski shops, the two biggest in the area.... for things like skis I want to hand fuck the shit out of it before I buy it, and talk to people who have used it. That is where local shops come in, and I am willing to go with something else if they have a decent reason for not carrying it. Often, the sales folk don't always agree with the online reviews, and the face to face will give you a much better idea of what products is like on slope.

This is where I lose you.. I trust dozens of people reviewing skis online way more than one or two dudes in a shop who are trying to move product. I feel like online reviews typically don't have any ulterior motives and I can often (in the case of tgr) know how / where they ski...

I feel like with a random shop rat I never know if they are just pushing Salomon because they have too much in stock or because they really like the ski. Honestly i tend to question if they can really ski at all, let alone ski the kind of terrain I enjoy...

[Hugh Conway]

I feel like online reviews typically don't have any ulterior motives

teeeeheee

[Brianskis]

This is where I lose you.. I trust dozens of people reviewing skis online way more than one or two dudes in a shop who are trying to move product. I feel like online reviews typically don't have any ulterior motives and I can often (in the case of tgr) know how / where they ski...

I feel like with a random shop rat I never know if they are just pushing Salomon because they have too much in stock or because they really like the ski. Honestly i tend to question if they can really ski at all, let alone ski the kind of terrain I enjoy...

While I may be somewhat biased I will totally disagree with you...

While every review, whether in-person, on-line, or in a magazine should be subject to a fair amount of skepticism, to say that any on-line/magazine (pretty much the same in my mind) review is more trustworthy than one given in-person at a shop is laughable.

[jfost]

While I may be somewhat biased I will totally disagree with you...

While every review, whether in-person, on-line, or in a magazine should be subject to a fair amount of skepticism, to say that any on-line/magazine (pretty much the same in my mind) review is more trustworthy than one given in-person at a shop is laughable.

but we (TGR types) look at stuff like wildsnow, blister, and the braintrust around here... those IMHO hold more weight than a guy at a local shop who is getting SPIFF's on last years' overstock. I think I agree on that point already made by jph above.

[Alpinord]

this has turned into a very productive thread and worth reading.

I own a shop and run two websites (backcountryacks.com and backcountryfreeskier.com).

we only have the floor space and cash to stock the best/most popular items from our vendors. we do order products from time to time but we never charge for shipping or tax and we always provide assembly and/or installation.

99% of sales have some discount. the internet has guaranteed that customers won't pay MSRP for anything.

I have been mulling over the "showroom with service" idea for years now but haven't done anything about it. the shop would consist of a few displays and demos with interactive kiosks for customers to shop on. all products would have 360 views, videos, and reviews. orders would have to ship to the shop and we would provide some kind of service, and knowledge to complete the sale.

do you guys really think something like this would actually work? if you walked into a shop that had nothing for you to take home that day, why not just buy online? seems like the "shop" would have to be in a small space with high traffic, like a mall, which would suck.

if any mags are ever in Missoula, stop in the shop for a beer. There are no bro-brahs working here.

This discussion and the Tire Rack comment, reminded me of Shopatron where (IIRC) a B&M store stocks and ships/delivers online ordered items based on location. This could provide extra incentive to carry a little more inventory for walk-ins (and online sales) and showcase your services. A local computer shop owner lamented years ago that their margins were terrible and inventory costs huge and started focusing more on service and repairs for their main cash flow. A couple local bike shop seems to lean more heavily on services and carry limited inventory. Like all things, there are too many flavors, variables and sizes of each type item within even one line than a small entity can have sitting around, much less afford the storage space.

FTR, online entities also have similar issues regarding what to stock or not as well as what monies and time to spend on providing online resources (ie, tutorials, how-tos, FAQs, etc), marketing and email/phone assistance only to see clear statistics that the information and your time/experience is mined and orders not placed. Then there's Amazon, bc.com and the like to compete with......

Bottom line, people are fickle and are like herding cats or predicting the weather. Fads come and go. Things are and always will be in flux creating continual challenges for seasonal ordering/stocking and how best to be ready for what the customer demands at any particular moment.

[old goat]

This discussion and the Tire Rack comment, reminded me of Shopatron where (IIRC) a B&M store stocks and ships/delivers online ordered items based on location. This could provide extra incentive to carry a little more inventory for walk-ins (and online sales) and showcase your services. A local computer shop owner lamented years ago that their margins were terrible and inventory costs huge and started focusing more on service and repairs for their main cash flow. A couple local bike shop seems to lean more heavily on services and carry limited inventory. Like all things, there are too many flavors, variables and sizes of each type item within even one line than a small entity can have sitting around, much less afford the storage space.

FTR, online entities also have similar issues regarding what to stock or not as well as what monies and time to spend on providing online resources (ie, tutorials, how-tos, FAQs, etc), marketing and email/phone assistance only to see clear statistics that the information and your time/experience is mined and orders not placed. Then there's Amazon, bc.com and the like to compete with......

Bottom line, people are fickle and are like herding cats or predicting the weather. Fads come and go. Things are and always will be in flux creating continual challenges for seasonal ordering/stocking and how best to be ready for what the customer demands at any particular moment.

Some on line retailers--general consumer goods;I doubt this applies to stuff like skis and bikes--don't have inventory at all. The inventory for multiple retailers is stored in FedEx warehouses. When an order comes in FedEx puts it in a box with the right logo and ships it. If an electronic item needs repair, the customer might be told to ship it FedEx who repairs it in the FedEx facility. The retailer is just a web site.