Praxis Concept Review

[toast2266]

Here's a little something I put together on the 187 Praxis Concepts (carbon) that I got earlier this year.

The quick version, if you're not into the whole linked review thing:
They're pretty much the most versatile ski I've ever been on. They make any turn shape at a wide variety of speeds, they're reasonably stable at speed while still retaining a ton a maneuverability (better in tight trees than almost any other ski I've been on), they're light enough to tour on, and they've got strippers on the top sheets. All that said, they can be a little grabby on really hardpacked snow, and I got some occasional tip dive in deeper stuff. Not massively problematic, but worth noting.

http://www.blistergearreview.com/gea...praxis-concept

[JeffreyJim]

And in case you want another review...this was my go-to ski last year and one of my touring skis this year. Still one of my favorites but in my opinion, not at ALL for everyone. If you like to pivot turns and don't care about arcing a real carve (ever) its rad. If you want to ski like a racer, you'll hate it before finishing your first run. At least that's my $0.02

As I put it in my review:

If this ski was a girl she would be the smart secretly nerdy type from a small town in, say, Northern California who does things differently, dresses edgy, is a bit quirky, seems a bit scary at first, and has a look that grows on you. After getting to know her you’d realize she’s easy to be around most of the time, likes to have fun, often makes you look better than you really are and not overly serious. The only cost is she’s a bit quirky…and she’ll freak out every now and then if you treat her like “most girls”. Demands a different type of respect and style but if you understand her, she’ll be there for the long haul. For many, this could be the one…but certainly not for everyone.

http://www.earlyups.com/featured/gea...pt-187-review/

[Practitioner]

Got the Concept recently, and I've put 6 days on it, mostly in the resort. I got it this year in order to be somewhat of a one ski quiver, and so far I'm incredibly happy with its performance in a bunch of different conditions. I would agree with most of the review, the ski sheds speed incredibly well and in trees its a blast. I'm not sure if the grabbiness I've experienced on hardpack is due to the extremely sharp Praxis edges, or the ski shape itself, but thats the only major downside I've noticed so far. It takes a bit to learn how to ski, but when you start to figure this ski out its a blast.

I can't recommend Praxis highly enough, Keith is incredibly friendly and very helpful when considering different skis.

I'll be touring on it for almost every day of the next month, and I'll update this with thoughts after that.

[mtproud]

I'm currently looking at the Concept and the MVP. I just found out that the MVP will be released in a 193cm version as well. I'm 6'2", 190lbs and wondering if the 187 will feel too short in either, or both skis? I had originally thought about going to the MVP for added versatility, but it sounds like the Concept has that pretty well covered. Do I gain anything by moving to the MVP or just drop on the powder fun scale?

[toast2266]

I'm currently looking at the Concept and the MVP. I just found out that the MVP will be released in a 193cm version as well. I'm 6'2", 190lbs and wondering if the 187 will feel too short in either, or both skis? I had originally thought about going to the MVP for added versatility, but it sounds like the Concept has that pretty well covered. Do I gain anything by moving to the MVP or just drop on the powder fun scale?

Haven't skied the MVP, but it has considerably more tip and tail rocker than the concept. The side cut length on the 187 MVP is 135, whereas its 143 on the concept. With that in mind, I would guess that the MVP's ski "shorter" than the concepts. I'm way smaller than you, but I never found the concepts to ski short - when you're pressuring the tips or when they're up on edge, they ski true to length, or maybe even a bit long. It's just that when you're centered, they'll pivot and slarve around really easily. The Concepts don't really exhibit any of the negative traits of "skiing short" (i.e. instability at speed, wheelying out of landings).

[kneedropper]

Finally have enough days on mine to comment. 187 carbons stock medium stiff. 6'1" 190. Skis are Swiss cheesed with plums and dukes.

Love them. Most fun I've had on mixed wind refrozen plus some groomers that I've had in a while. They required a few runs to become aquatinted. By the end of the day I was able to lay trenches that looked like a snowboarder with hard boots was raining groomers. I'll mostly agree with Jim's review with the exception of the racer feel. I found once you fully commit and really put them up on edge they lock into a turn and pull some g's. If you don't put them up on edge they're loose and you can drift turns.

I did find one area where I still don't have them figured out. At low speeds, picture next to lift lines they would catch me off guard and grab an edge. If you're not careful your running in mom and the kids in line. I didn't detune, so maybe that would keep them more neutral.

Also, on strange semibreakable backcountry wind buff with flat light (Mammoth Crest this past weekend above treeline)I felt like I was too far forward. I'm sure any ski would be tough but as I skinned out I couldn't help but think what they'd be like with the reverse bump and mount moved back 4cm. For reference I typically prefer a traditional mount. I'm old.

In the variable soft they were loose and super easy to ski. No full on pow yet but that's what the Protests are for.

One other thought, the sensation of edge power right at the arch is something I've never experienced. I felt like I was literally controlling the turns with the footbed arch. Nice ability to finesse the ski with very little input.

If I get wind of the skis are being discontinued I'd be tempted to buy backups.

[mtproud]

Haven't skied the MVP, but it has considerably more tip and tail rocker than the concept. The side cut length on the 187 MVP is 135, whereas its 143 on the concept. With that in mind, I would guess that the MVP's ski "shorter" than the concepts. I'm way smaller than you, but I never found the concepts to ski short - when you're pressuring the tips or when they're up on edge, they ski true to length, or maybe even a bit long. It's just that when you're centered, they'll pivot and slarve around really easily. The Concepts don't really exhibit any of the negative traits of "skiing short" (i.e. instability at speed, wheelying out of landings).

Toast2266
Thanks for the input...has me leaning towards the Concepts again. I had read your nice review on Blister Gear(cool to see a review coming out of NW Montana), had me pretty excited about this ski to begin with. I'm in Missoula and lack of time and money means I stay at the Bowl for the most part. It sounds like these skis should be able to handle tight trees and choppy, bumpy run outs.

[ExoticSkis]

Review of last year's Concepts: My go-to ski for any kind of wacked-out snow conditions, or playing in tight trees...great at mashing brush at speed...

[Shu Shu]

Review of last year's Concepts: My go-to ski for any kind of wacked-out snow conditions, or playing in tight trees...great at mashing brush at speed...

Trigger=pulled in the Overstock sale. Concepts heading my way. You and Keith had some great feedback on EC sizing, looking forward to getting on these guys for some good old fashioned east coast bushwacking. Thanks again

[toast2266]

Toast2266
Thanks for the input...has me leaning towards the Concepts again. I had read your nice review on Blister Gear(cool to see a review coming out of NW Montana), had me pretty excited about this ski to begin with. I'm in Missoula and lack of time and money means I stay at the Bowl for the most part. It sounds like these skis should be able to handle tight trees and choppy, bumpy run outs.

If you happen to be in the Whitefish area, you're more than welcome to take some laps on my concepts - they're mounted for a 310 bsl.

[mtproud]

Toast 2266, I appreciate the offer but unfortunately won't be able to head North, for anything other than work, for a while...and I'm gonna pull the trigger on skis in the next few days. Really torn between the 187 Concepts and 193 MVP...don't think I'll be disappointed either way.

[racesla]

Toast2266
Thanks for the input...has me leaning towards the Concepts again. I had read your nice review on Blister Gear(cool to see a review coming out of NW Montana), had me pretty excited about this ski to begin with. I'm in Missoula and lack of time and money means I stay at the Bowl for the most part. It sounds like these skis should be able to handle tight trees and choppy, bumpy run outs.

The Concepts would be a great ski for Snow Bowl. I ski mine everywhere at Disco.

[stuckathuntermtn]

Interesting.
So some say it lays trenches, some say it doesn't.
What kind of stance, boots, person size must make some kind of difference. Anyone care to elaborate?

[mtproud]

The Concepts would be a great ski for Snow Bowl. I ski mine everywhere at Disco.

racesla --- Are you skiing the new design(with the rocker underfoot), or the older design? I'm not positive pretty sure these used to be made with more of a mustache rocker profile similar to the Bibby Pro? Has anyone skied both designs and care to compare/contrast?

[carlh]

How are these tele, would the funky sidecut loose its benefits? I am looking for a new 70/30 BC/Inbounds tele setup and really like the looks of these in carbon.

[racesla]

Mine are the new design. (2012) It takes a couple day's to fully get use to the 3 point sidecut but once you do there great. Most versatile ski I've ever been on. Are there better skis for ice, boiler plate, bullet proof snow, sure. But these ski most conditions very well. I can ski stuff on these that would deflect my JJs all to hell. But at the same time you don't lose any of the fun factor of a ski like the JJs.

[racesla]

Interesting.
So some say it lays trenches, some say it doesn't.
What kind of stance, boots, person size must make some kind of difference. Anyone care to elaborate?

Krypton Pros. Mostly forward stance. But sometime I ski them in a more centered stance and slave them around. Yes you can lay trenches once you get your head around the sidecut. Power the front of the ski. Punch into a turn as if you were on a slalom ski. Some say you can't just roll into a turn on these. I found after a couple days I could with no problem for just cruising around. You can also have full confidence in the tails. If you screw up and find yourself in the backseat. Just put them on edge, apply some power, ride the tails and go.The tails won't fold up on you, or shoot you up out of control. I never feel like I'm trying to force a fat waisted (117) ski up on edge like I have with some other skis.

[jds125]

Lots of good info and descriptions here so I won't get all technical but... I've been using last years 187's on everything from 24" to packed windblown ice and have found theses skis to be phenomenal for most anything. One thing I really like about these skis is that I feel like they skis much narrower (feels very close to my PB&Js) which makes groomer performance and following my 7 year old daughter less of a chore than it should be. If I had any complaints, it would be that these skis constantly convince me to push harder than I should and I've looked equal parts hero and zero for my efforts.

[stuckathuntermtn]

Great info here. Does anyone know the width of the wastes(sp?) In the front and back?

Sent from my DROID2

[toast2266]

Great info here. Does anyone know the width of the wastes(sp?) In the front and back?

Sent from my DROID2

The two "narrow" spots that are just in front of and behind the binding are only slightly narrower than the area underfoot. Maybe 1-2mm narrower; it's barely perceptible when looking at it.

[mtproud]

Anyone care to share an opinion on which design is an all-around better design with regards to the Concept? Keith is now making these with the compound camber, but sounds like he will still make it with the traditional camber as well...

Anyone skied both?

[spindrift]

Based on experience - IMO compound FTW...

When Keith makes something "standard" on a ski a couple seasons in, there is usually a reason.

[mtproud]

Mine are the new design. (2012) It takes a couple day's to fully get use to the 3 point sidecut but once you do there great. Most versatile ski I've ever been on. Are there better skis for ice, boiler plate, bullet proof snow, sure. But these ski most conditions very well. I can ski stuff on these that would deflect my JJs all to hell. But at the same time you don't lose any of the fun factor of a ski like the JJs.

I've skied the 185 JJ and it really felt short. From your experience, although they are only 2cm longer, do the 187 Concepts feel/ski noticeably longer?

[sandflea]

I've had both... JJ's were too short for me, I'm 6'1" 175 and I have two pairs of Concepts if that tells you anything.

I've skied the 185 JJ and it really felt short. From your experience, although they are only 2cm longer, do the 187 Concepts feel/ski noticeably longer?

[SupreChicken]

Both are versatile. I think the compound takes a little more time to get used to. I prefer my moustache version. But I don't own the compound version.