Help a DSLR noob pick a camera!

[systemoverblow'd]

I don't know much about video, but I know that one positive thing about Nikons is that you get high quality older mf lenses for hundreds of dollars, as compared to the thousands you'd spend on new high quality glass.

https://www.google.com/search?q=vide...ikon+mf+lenses

I guess you can use an adaptor to mount these lenses on Canon bodies, but that may not work so well with metering?

There are tons of video guys that buy Canons and use the old manual Nikon glass on them. It's actually a pretty big market for people that are serious about shooting video on DSLRs in a cinematography setting. I know a guy who shoots Canon that doesn't own a single Canon lens. They are all old fast Nikon primes. 100% manual.

[Tippster]

I think people are thinking about this too much (as I used to). Hell, I downgraded to a 7 year old FF camera from my 7D. No video, only 12.8 MP, crap high ISO handling, shit menus, autofocus worth a fuck and couldn't be happier. Best move I made in my photography hobby yet. I'm getting better images than I ever did from my 7D thanks to spending more money on lenses.

5D Mk1? Welcome to the fold!

There are tons of video guys that buy Canons and use the old manual Nikon glass on them. It's actually a pretty big market for people that are serious about shooting video on DSLRs in a cinematography setting. I know a guy who shoots Canon that doesn't own a single Canon lens. They are all old fast Nikon primes. 100% manual.

Which is why Canon came out with their Cine lenses. No clicks onthe aperture, nice oily drag on the focus, Focus ring doesn't keep spinning but stops at the extremes, etc. I see lotsa guys who make $$ shooting with DSLRs or Canon C300's shooting Zeiss lenses now. They're purdy.

Autofocus in video is about as useless as tits on a Nun. The only thing worse is Auto-iris.

[systemoverblow'd]

5D Mk1? Welcome to the fold!

Yuppers! Love this old hunk of shit. Best $500 I put into my pocket by dumping the 7D and going with the 5D.

Which is why Canon came out with their Cine lenses. No clicks onthe aperture, nice oily drag on the focus, Focus ring doesn't keep spinning but stops at the extremes, etc. I see lotsa guys who make $$ shooting with DSLRs or Canon C300's shooting Zeiss lenses now. They're purdy.

Autofocus in video is about as useless as tits on a Nun. The only thing worse is Auto-iris.

If I were back to shooting video on these things and was budget conscious, Rokinon has started releasing their fast prime cine lenses with built in rings for follow focus and aperture adjustments.

[RonMexico]

(Edit - what I posted earlier was a rambling mess)

I went to best buy today and checked out the T3i, T4i, and 60D. They didn't have much of a selection of Nikons.

Here's what I found:

- I like the burliness of the 60D over the other models. It just seems beefier and could better withstand some of what Mother Nature will inevitably throw at it.
- The T3i doesn't seem worth it when the T4i has a number of features that seem to make up for the $150 price difference (faster shooting, touch screen, newer processor).

While I like how the 60D feels, I wonder if it is worth the extra $200 over the price of the T4i.

Lastly, from what I can tell the Nikon D7000 is the best overall camera of the group, but is a little more pricey. It also doesn't offer any 60fps video modes. I would probably get this camera if it weren't for that issue, but at $900 for the body only, I figure I shouldn't be settling and getting a camera that doesn't have all of the features I want.

So I'm right back where I started - with no idea of what to get. Really like the D7000 and 60D, but wonder if I shouldn't just get the T4i and call it a day.

Any more thoughts would be appreciated!

[austriker]

A bit of age old new photo gear- glass over body.. That being said I havent exactly followed that as I upgraded my body 2x in the last 4 years (D40.. D300.. D700). My other tip is buy used, you can save a lot of money buying used bodies which you can invest in glass (Being an amateur Ive never bought new). As with all electronics just be careful.

Good call on going to best buy to get a feel for each body.
I dont have much insight into canon gear as Im a Nikon lifer but have great things about the D7000.

Good luck!

[uglymoney]

IMO if you are going with a Canon crop just get a used or refurbed T2i for dirt cheap and buy a nice lens or four staying heavy on EF and light on the EFS variants. I've had one for a long while starting as a newbie and moving into a seasoned jong and my next move will be into a 5d variant since they are getting deliciously cheap now. I've never read of someone with a T2i upgrading to a t4i. Save your money for lenses or the full frame.

[RonMexico]

I know used it probably the way to go, but it is really out of the question. Long story, but just take it for what it's worth.

Any insight on the merit of these cameras at their new prices/features would be great.

[D(C)]

I'm definitely a JONG compared to pretty much everyone else in this thread.

If you plan on learning to shoot photos in manual mode, you should not overlook the fact that the 60D has separate dials for shutter and aperture whereas the T2/3/4i only has one dial that toggles between functions. Having to toggle would get old fast, though this is a non-issue if you don't plan to shoot in manual.

I got a camera about a year ago and basically had no budget. I ended up going with an old 20D for dirt cheap and spent a bit of money on a decent-ish Sigma 17-70 lens. Of course, video wasn't a concern. But I have not outgrown my setup yet.

[Supermoon]

But I have not outgrown my setup yet.

This is a good point to make in general, I think. If you're relatively new to the whole thing, you will be happy with whatever you get, and your photos will get better and better just from practice, regardless of your equipment. I'm sure you could make huge strides just shooting with your phone if you wanted to.

Hell, you could make a homemade pinhole camera and do some really cool stuff with it for just a few dollars if you just wanted to start taking photos.

Anything made in the last four or five years is going to be awesome, so find a good deal and go for it!

[systemoverblow'd]

I've never read of someone with a T2i upgrading to a t4i. Save your money for lenses or the full frame.

Exactly. For me it was t2i > 7D > 5Dc. These little differences between the t2i, t3i, t4i are pretty much moot. I would say the differences between either of these and the 60D are far more drastic.

My thoughts.
Touch screen. When was the last time I wanted to put my greasy grimy fingers on a screen I was trying to get accurate fous with and see details? Ummm, never.
Weather sealing. Unless you buy expensive glass that is weather sealed (any brand) I don't care how sealed the body is. The mount is the most direct way for moisture to get into your internals and if that lens isn't sealed, well good luck. Like I stated, I have been through the gamut of consumer cameras. Shot them in the rain, the snow, everything. As long as you take care of it and don't drop it in a bucket of water you are pretty much safe as far as a little weather. Don't walk around with it in a monsoon, but ripping it out, grabbing a snap and getting it back in your pack probably isn't going to be a big deal. At least it never has been for me.

If you're putting this much thought into it you are likely to want to upgrade in a year anyway so it's not like it matters what you get. Just try to pick the correct path you want to continue with (Canon, Nikon, Sony, etc). I'll say it until I'm blue in the face, buy cheaper body and get better glass. A t2i with a good lens can produce a better image than a 7D with a kit lens. Notice I didn't say picture. Because nothing is going to make a better picture, that's all on you.

So I say stop quibbling over these specs. You being a noob won't know the difference between 3.2 and 5 fps. You won't know the difference between 1 cross-type and 9 cross-type AF points. You will be stoked for a year and be yearning for something new after that no matter what you get. If you get a t3i you'll want a 7D2. If you get a 60D you'll want a 7D2 or a 5D. And then after a few years you'll realize all this is stupid.

[RonMexico]

^^^ Fair enough.

I assume the Canon vs. Nikon debate is just like the Ford vs. Chevy argument. Everybody has their preferences and each has it's advantages over the other?

Also, is it true that the 60D is due to be replaced in the next couple of months?

[Tye 1on]

Exactly. For me it was t2i > 7D > 5Dc. These little differences between the t2i, t3i, t4i are pretty much moot. I would say the differences between either of these and the 60D are far more drastic.

My thoughts.
Touch screen. When was the last time I wanted to put my greasy grimy fingers on a screen I was trying to get accurate fous with and see details? Ummm, never.
Weather sealing. Unless you buy expensive glass that is weather sealed (any brand) I don't care how sealed the body is. The mount is the most direct way for moisture to get into your internals and if that lens isn't sealed, well good luck. Like I stated, I have been through the gamut of consumer cameras. Shot them in the rain, the snow, everything. As long as you take care of it and don't drop it in a bucket of water you are pretty much safe as far as a little weather. Don't walk around with it in a monsoon, but ripping it out, grabbing a snap and getting it back in your pack probably isn't going to be a big deal. At least it never has been for me.

If you're putting this much thought into it you are likely to want to upgrade in a year anyway so it's not like it matters what you get. Just try to pick the correct path you want to continue with (Canon, Nikon, Sony, etc). I'll say it until I'm blue in the face, buy cheaper body and get better glass. A t2i with a good lens can produce a better image than a 7D with a kit lens. Notice I didn't say picture. Because nothing is going to make a better picture, that's all on you.

So I say stop quibbling over these specs. You being a noob won't know the difference between 3.2 and 5 fps. You won't know the difference between 1 cross-type and 9 cross-type AF points. You will be stoked for a year and be yearning for something new after that no matter what you get. If you get a t3i you'll want a 7D2. If you get a 60D you'll want a 7D2 or a 5D. And then after a few years you'll realize all this is stupid.

that's really helpful. I was buying into all those little differences in the t3i, but now will be strongly considering refurb t2i and saving funds toward good glass.

[smmokan]

You realize that a refurbished T3i and 18-55mm lens, using the Canon Loyalty Program, is only $450? You're not going to get a better deal than that.

I'd personally sell the 18-55mm lens for $75, and use the $500 you have left over (assuming a $900 budget) to buy one or two nicer lenses.

[RonMexico]

Here are my two options on the kit lens (this is all I'm going to have in the near term until I save up and figure out what else I really need for my applications):

EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS II Lens

Or

EF-S 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS Lens

I know these probably aren't the best lenses, but if I'm going to just have one for right now should I go with the 18-135mm since it would be more versatile?

[Supermoon]

^Yes.

Then buy one of the 50mm f1.8 lenses for under $100 as soon as you can.

[outabounds]

^^^ Fair enough.

I assume the Canon vs. Nikon debate is just like the Ford vs. Chevy argument. Everybody has their preferences and each has it's advantages over the other?

Also, is it true that the 60D is due to be replaced in the next couple of months?

One significant difference between Canon and Nikon is that Canon people are constantly selling their shit on here. You probably stand a far better chance to score a bro deal if you go that way.

[austriker]

^^^ Fair enough.

I assume the Canon vs. Nikon debate is just like the Ford vs. Chevy argument. Everybody has their preferences and each has it's advantages over the other?

Also, is it true that the 60D is due to be replaced in the next couple of months?

Canon v Nikon. Nikon is best! Just kidding, I will advocate Nikon for life (as Im sure canon shooters would do likewise) but I will admit its basically user preference and each party can state why their brand is better.

[uglymoney]

One significant difference between Canon and Nikon is that Canon people are constantly selling their shit on here. You probably stand a far better chance to score a bro deal if you go that way.

Yeah. Really the only reason I went with Canon was that I was super familiar with the different Canon lens and camera offerings from reading TGR.

[ak_powder_monkey]

continuous AF on a dslr is a joke.

I disagree, when I don't have continuous AF on while shooting sports my keeper rate goes from about 10% to 1%

[systemoverblow'd]

He meant for video I believe.

[Tye 1on]

that's really helpful. I was buying into all those little differences in the t3i, but now will be strongly considering refurb t2i and saving funds toward good glass.

Refurb sale didn't have the t2i, just the t3 and t3i.

You realize that a refurbished T3i and 18-55mm lens, using the Canon Loyalty Program, is only $450? You're not going to get a better deal than that.

I'd personally sell the 18-55mm lens for $75, and use the $500 you have left over (assuming a $900 budget) to buy one or two nicer lenses.

Just picked up that camera for $460 shipped/taxed in the refurb sale. Stoked is an understatement.

Thanks y'all, especially system, for good practical advice. First 'new' camera for me, going from a 5MP p/s, it's going to be quite a learning curve, but am really stoked to jump into it.

[Supermoon]

Congrats dude! I'd spend the first little while playing with focus, exposure, etc. And RTFM

[austriker]

nice work, congrats! now remember practice, practice, practice

[RonMexico]

Ended up with the 60D. Working my way through the manual before I dive into all the features.

Hopefully I'll have some stuff for you guys to tear apart soon.

Thanks for the help.