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  1. #2026
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    ^^^i agree on the technology aspect for the distances these days - seems like they could of been more proactive on setting limitations years ago. size and COR effect in drivers, somehow put a limit on the ball also.

  2. #2027
    spook Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by 4matic View Post
    And all the majors won with square grooves? Dumb..

    it's a joke, dude. how many have been won with belly putters? 2?

  3. #2028
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    Yeah, the belly putter thing is classic misdirection. The governing bodies can act like tough guys over anchoring so the uneducated can believe they are "protecting the game" somehow. Meanwhile, a 5'9" Irishman is hitting 320 yard 3 woods.

  4. #2029
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    Quote Originally Posted by Like a Boss View Post
    Yeah, the belly putter thing is classic misdirection.
    Kinda. After all, the equipment has always been improving- it's kind of odd, to me, to say there can't be more innovation in a certain area. But the belly putter isn't really "innovative," and having three points of contact with the body arguably changes the essential action of the sport (the swing itself) more than a 460cc driver does.

  5. #2030
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steven S. Dallas View Post
    Kinda. After all, the equipment has always been improving- it's kind of odd, to me, to say there can't be more innovation in a certain area. But the belly putter isn't really "innovative," and having three points of contact with the body arguably changes the essential action of the sport (the swing itself) more than a 460cc driver does.
    So why have a rule on maximum length driver?

  6. #2031
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4matic View Post
    So why have a rule on maximum length driver?
    Are you asking me as a promoter of that rule or as a member of the rules committee of one of golf's governing bodies?

  7. #2032
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steven S. Dallas View Post
    Are you asking me as a promoter of that rule or as a member of the rules committee of one of golf's governing bodies?
    Just being rhetorical. I want to know how the rule determines anchored, If the shaft only touches my hand and my hand is anchored is it legal? My hand is anchored to my arm.

  8. #2033
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4matic View Post
    I want to know how the rule determines anchored, If the shaft only touches my hand and my hand is anchored is it legal? My hand is anchored to my arm.
    I'm having trouble envisioning what you mean by "anchored to my arm." "Anchored" pretty obviously means "fixed," as per the USGA's guidance. You may place the club shaft against your forearm, but you can't then lean your forearm against your side or any other body part to keep the forearm stationary.


    http://espn.go.com/pdf/2012/1128/pga_puttrule.pdf

    As for the long driver- I think there are a few factors that play into that rule, with constituencies for each. Golf course operators don't want their courses being rendered obsolete and golf fans (and TV producers) don't want tournaments turned into long drive competitions, which are boring. Those concerns are alongside the whole purity of the game bullshit.
    Last edited by Steven S. Dallas; 11-28-2012 at 01:22 PM.

  9. #2034
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steven S. Dallas View Post
    I'm having trouble envisioning what you mean by "anchored to my arm." "Anchored" pretty obviously means "fixed," as per the USGA's guidance. You may place the club shaft against your forearm, but you can't then lean your forearm against your side or any other body part to keep the forearm stationary.


    http://espn.go.com/pdf/2012/1128/pga_puttrule.pdf

    As for the long driver- I think there are a few factors that play into that rule, with constituencies for each. Golf course operators don't want their courses being rendered obsolete and golf fans (and TV producers) don't want tournaments turned into long drive competitions, which are boring. Those concerns are alongside the whole purity of the game bullshit.
    That chart clarified the rules and I simply think this decision is a misplaced attempt to improve the game.

  10. #2035
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    I'm happy for the ban and whole heartedly agree with tiger. Every club needs to be swung.

    Another problem I have with the belly putter is when I see these folks hit one in the hazard then use their belly putters to get an extra two feet of relief. I just wish it was more immediate.
    "One season per year, the gods open the skies, and releases a white, fluffy, pillow on top of the most forbidding mountain landscapes, allowing people to travel over them with ease and relative abandonment of concern for safety. It's incredible."

  11. #2036
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    Quote Originally Posted by guroo270 View Post
    an extra two feet of relief.
    How do you get two extra feet from a belly putter when the average driver is 44.5 inches?

  12. #2037
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    It was a guess not an exact measurement, but, an extra footish x 2 clubs of relief? I'm thinking Carl Peterson more than Matt kuchar
    "One season per year, the gods open the skies, and releases a white, fluffy, pillow on top of the most forbidding mountain landscapes, allowing people to travel over them with ease and relative abandonment of concern for safety. It's incredible."

  13. #2038
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    Quote Originally Posted by guroo270 View Post
    It was a guess not an exact measurement, but, an extra footish x 2 clubs of relief? I'm thinking Carl Peterson more than Matt kuchar
    Pettersson uses a 47 inch driver and broomstick putters are 50 inches and below. Even at 45 inches it's less than a foot. big deal..

  14. #2039
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    jeez 4matic, are you a belly putterer or something?

    I agree on the ball/driver thing - I'm only very slightly better than a bogey golfer and I can hit it 300yds with the driver.
    ... jfost is really ignorant, he often just needs simple facts laid out for him...

  15. #2040
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    Quote Originally Posted by jfost View Post
    jeez 4matic, are you a belly putterer or something?

    I agree on the ball/driver thing - I'm only very slightly better than a bogey golfer and I can hit it 300yds with the driver.
    I do but I still suck at putting and is not why I think this is a misguided ruling. They've allowed it too long to make it a rule. How about that 14 y/o chinese kid that qualified for the Masters? It's all he's ever played with.

    I'm using belly to hopefully improve my putting. Going back to conventional won't affect my game.

    I like Collins take:

    http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=8682231
    Last edited by 4matic; 11-28-2012 at 05:20 PM.

  16. #2041
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    You are right. It should never have been allowed.
    "One season per year, the gods open the skies, and releases a white, fluffy, pillow on top of the most forbidding mountain landscapes, allowing people to travel over them with ease and relative abandonment of concern for safety. It's incredible."

  17. #2042
    spook Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by 4matic View Post
    I do but I still suck at putting and is not why I think this is a misguided ruling. They've allowed it too long to make it a rule. How about that 14 y/o chinese kid that qualified for the Masters? It's all he's ever played with.

    I'm using belly to hopefully improve my putting. Going back to conventional won't affect my game.

    I like Collins take:

    http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=8682231

    BELLY PUTTERER!!!!

    Click image for larger version. 

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  18. #2043
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steven S. Dallas View Post

    As for the long driver- I think there are a few factors that play into that rule, with constituencies for each. Golf course operators don't want their courses being rendered obsolete and golf fans (and TV producers) don't want tournaments turned into long drive competitions, which are boring. Those concerns are alongside the whole purity of the game bullshit.

    The length of the driver isn't really an issue as the average tour player's driver is 44.5" My guess is there aren't that many guys playing long drivers because at 115mph swing speed you're going to get a bigger gains from by optimizing ball speed, launch angle and spin rate then simply picking up another 2-5 mph of clubhead speed by adding 2-3" on your driver. The LPGA tour players interestingly enough play MUCH longer drivers then the men because at their launch and spin rates they gain more yardage by increasing clubhead speed.
    For sure, you have to be lost to find a place that can't be found, elseways everyone would know where it was

  19. #2044
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4matic View Post
    I do but I still suck at putting and is not why I think this is a misguided ruling. They've allowed it too long to make it a rule. How about that 14 y/o chinese kid that qualified for the Masters? It's all he's ever played with.
    I'm using belly to hopefully improve my putting. Going back to conventional won't affect my game.
    I like Collins take:
    http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=8682231
    Chinese kid can use the belly putter at the next three masters if he wants .
    If he can't figure out how to play by the rules in three years , tough luck .
    The Collins guy needs to shut the fuck up , what a tool .
    I'm sure fools like Collins would be all for a 1' diameter cup , no bunkers and no ob .
    Then every hack could shoot 65 and the game would grow by leaps and bounds .
    It's a game and the guy that shoots the best score by whatever rules are in place at the time wins , end of story .

  20. #2045
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    Quote Originally Posted by skiballs View Post
    Chinese kid can use the belly putter at the next three masters if he wants .
    If he can't figure out how to play by the rules in three years , tough luck .
    The Collins guy needs to shut the fuck up , what a tool .
    I'm sure fools like Collins would be all for a 1' diameter cup , no bunkers and no ob .
    Then every hack could shoot 65 and the game would grow by leaps and bounds .
    It's a game and the guy that shoots the best score by whatever rules are in place at the time wins , end of story .
    I don't disagree. But how does banning the long putter "protect and grow the game?" Serious question. Why aren't they addressing slow play and ways to get rounds per year increasing instead of decreasing?

  21. #2046
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4matic View Post
    I don't disagree. But how does banning the long putter "protect and grow the game?" Serious question. Why aren't they addressing slow play and ways to get rounds per year increasing instead of decreasing?
    I play a couple USGA events every year .
    Pace of play has become the #1 priority , the officials are up everyone's ass .
    The USGA can't fix the economy .

  22. #2047
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    Quote Originally Posted by skiballs View Post
    ...The USGA can't fix the economy .
    this is true, along w/ pace the crippling cost of course maintenance is killing golf. When even a short 9 costs $14-$20 and takes 2 hours to play, that's trouble. Along those lines, I love playing 9 holes on the big course - I feel like it is a perfect amount of golf for me and doesn't take all day. Wish that was more the standard and 18 reserved for tourny's only.

    I wonder if we'll see real grass on the greens only in our lifetimes, if you only had to water/maintain 18 greens and had artificial fairways and tee boxes (might have to go real tees on par 3's) that would save thousands upon thousands per year. Will it happen???
    ... jfost is really ignorant, he often just needs simple facts laid out for him...

  23. #2048
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    Quote Originally Posted by skiballs View Post
    The USGA can't fix the economy .
    I think this ties into the pace of play issue- marshals aren't willing to put players on the clock because they don't want to lose clientele. The experience for frequent players at a course (who probably either know how to get a deal and are paying less, or are local and captive) is less important to management than that of the people paying full freight.

  24. #2049
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    Quote Originally Posted by skiballs View Post
    Chinese kid can use the belly putter at the next three masters if he wants .
    If he can't figure out how to play by the rules in three years , tough luck .
    The Collins guy needs to shut the fuck up , what a tool .
    I'm sure fools like Collins would be all for a 1' diameter cup , no bunkers and no ob .
    Then every hack could shoot 65 and the game would grow by leaps and bounds .
    It's a game and the guy that shoots the best score by whatever rules are in place at the time wins , end of story .
    Well said...the long putter is a rich man's tool and completely impractical to cart around for an everyday or traveling golfer - it isn't a tool for the masses or to "grow the game".

    How many bogey golfers use a belly putter? how many people at a muni do you see with a fucking belly putter?
    "I do look like the Arrow shirt man, I did lace up my skates professionally, and I did do a fabulous job finishing my muffin."

  25. #2050
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    Quote Originally Posted by cranked View Post
    Well said...the long putter is a rich man's tool and completely impractical to cart around for an everyday or traveling golfer - it isn't a tool for the masses or to "grow the game".
    What on earth are you talking about? They're like six inches longer than a driver and cost maybe $20-30 more.

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