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  1. #2001
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    Feb 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by skiballs View Post
    .
    The USGA can't fix the economy .
    QFT. I am sick of hearing the growing the game crap.

    The USGA can eat a dick on timing tournaments. Gives them something to be a referee about, fuck that. Slow play sucks and is something completely different, but creating a competitive environment based on time, when golf is not timed, is straight up bullshit.
    Terje was right.

    "We're all kooks to somebody else." -Shelby Menzel

  2. #2002
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    crown of the continent
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    13,950
    driver should be the longest club, let the rest sort itself out.
    Something about the wrinkle in your forehead tells me there's a fit about to get thrown
    And I never hear a single word you say when you tell me not to have my fun
    It's the same old shit that I ain't gonna take off anyone.
    and I never had a shortage of people tryin' to warn me about the dangers I pose to myself.

    Patterson Hood of the DBT's

  3. #2003
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
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    Jack Tone Road
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    12,778
    Quote Originally Posted by DasBlunt View Post
    I agree with him that many do not use one, you left out that part of his post.
    I agree as well, which is why I left it out. Although I see a fair number in California and Arizona.

  4. #2004
    Join Date
    May 2011
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    Sonoma & Truckee
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    11,073
    I'm also sick of the "growing the game" crap. Money is one factor obviously outside of the USGA's control, but at the end of the day it's about slow play. Period. Many studies / surveys have confirmed this. I would probably play 25 - 30% more rounds every year if you could guarantee I'd get around in 4 hours or less. When I saddle my wife with the two kids, counting driving and warm-up time, it's usually about a 5 hour outing - but when I come back after 6 or more hours she'll be like, "WTF?" And I have to agree - it's just not that fun when it takes that long. I'm sure I'm not the only one.

  5. #2005
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
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    The City/Truckee, CA
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steven S. Dallas View Post
    I agree as well, which is why I left it out. Although I see a fair number in California and Arizona.
    I never see them in CA or AZ...I have seen one on a course, ever, and that was at Martis Camp in Truckee.

    Regarding the length, "only 6 inches longer than a driver"...are there travel bags out there for long putters? Do people fly with their long putters?
    "I do look like the Arrow shirt man, I did lace up my skates professionally, and I did do a fabulous job finishing my muffin."

  6. #2006
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
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    Jack Tone Road
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    Quote Originally Posted by TahoeJ View Post
    I'm also sick of the "growing the game" crap. Money is one factor obviously outside of the USGA's control, but at the end of the day it's about slow play.
    Like I alluded to before, growing the game and enforcing faster play are kind of at odds. People who go out for the first time are going to suck and play slowly, but probably won't come back if they feel any more rushed and stressed than the novice golfer often does. Then again, the novice golfer might bail on the whole thing since it takes five hours to get around...

    Quote Originally Posted by cranked View Post
    I never see them in CA or AZ...I have seen one on a course, ever, and that was at Martis Camp in Truckee.

    Regarding the length, "only 6 inches longer than a driver"...are there travel bags out there for long putters? Do people fly with their long putters?
    Several CA residents posting in this thread use or have used them, so... It happens. Arizona seems particularly full of them, to me; lot of older guys with bad backs.

    As far as travel bags- I don't know. Seems to me that shouldn't matter, since apparently only rich folks use long putters and, in my experience, rich folks either fly charter or mail their clubs. As for me, a normal working stiff, 95% of my rounds are played within 45 minutes' drive of my home and I'm pretty sure I could fit a broomstick putter in my car.

  7. #2007
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    Feb 2010
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    Colorado
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    Quote Originally Posted by TahoeJ View Post
    I'm also sick of the "growing the game" crap. Money is one factor obviously outside of the USGA's control, but at the end of the day it's about slow play. Period. Many studies / surveys have confirmed this. I would probably play 25 - 30% more rounds every year if you could guarantee I'd get around in 4 hours or less. When I saddle my wife with the two kids, counting driving and warm-up time, it's usually about a 5 hour outing - but when I come back after 6 or more hours she'll be like, "WTF?" And I have to agree - it's just not that fun when it takes that long. I'm sure I'm not the only one.
    It is not fun in 6 hours. Coming back to California years ago, I noticed it being the slowest pace of play anywhere I have ever played, anywhere.

    Private clubs further east of California are seriously ruthless nazis about slow play. I can play a busy saturday at most of the private tracks I have had access to in about 4 hours, week days 3.5 walking (4 some). You can lose membership for being a slow fuck.

    5 hour rounds are unacceptable.
    Last edited by DasBlunt; 11-30-2012 at 07:32 PM.
    Terje was right.

    "We're all kooks to somebody else." -Shelby Menzel

  8. #2008
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Too Far South
    Posts
    5,272
    I'm going to speak from personal experience here, I actually OWN a golf course. When the USGA gets on its Golf 2.0 kick and starts talking about Growing the Game and Slow Play and all the rest of the crap the blue blazers talk about at focus groups I just shake my head.

    As the owner of a 9 hole Executive Course I've got the following to say to the USGA Blue Bloods

    The #1 predictor of rounds from my experience is WEATHER! The economy can be up/down/sideways and if its 45* and pouring rain you aren't going to do much business. Consequently if its 85* and sunny with low humidity(and a weekend) I can pretty much expect the cash register to ring all day long.

    Pace of play is a function of COURSE DESIGN and very little else.

    When you build a course that's 7000 yards long with forced carry on every hole and greens that are designed like fortresses its not surprising that your average golfer is going to struggle mightily. Take your average 15 handicap golfer:

    He thinks he hits the ball 280 and actually hits it 180-220 so if you put him on a 380+ yard par 4 he realistically isn't going to have a chance at reaching the green in regulation. Couple that with the fact that most 15 handicaps have an absolutely ATROCIOUS short game and an absolutely TERRIBLE sense of course management i.e. how many times have you seen guys pull 3 wood off the deck from 230+ yards on a par 5 and smash one OB/Rinse it/Top it 50 yards when they'd be better off pulling 5 iron and laying up to 9 iron range and two putting. This is the #1 reason that rounds take 5 hours plus, IT'S THE DESIGN STUPID. If we built more courses that were < 6000 yards you would get people through the course faster its a simple factor of giving golfers MANAGEABLE shots.

    This is why I'm so adamant that the ball needs to be rolled back for the pros, the average players handicap hasn't dropped, the average players drive hasn't increased but the course he's playing on has had to grow to allow the game to challenge the elite <1% of golfers who have handicaps under 6. STOP IT!!

    Growing the Game and broadening golfs appeal is about putting golfers on a course that allows them to enjoy the game. My course caters to women, seniors, and novice golfers; they're at MY course because they CAN'T play a full regulation size course but they love to play. I'm VERY pleased to see that part of the USGA's goals for Golf 2.0 is to get 18+ hole courses that have underutilized 9 hole layouts to convert them into short courses. THIS IS HOW YOU GROW THE GAME!!! Getting a dad out with his kid, getting a husband and wife or a group of women out there playing.

    I harp on this EVERYDAY from my Pro Shop staff to my Grounds Crew, we want to do everything in our power to make the game as enjoyable as possible for everyone. If you're a novice or bad golfer you're going to love playing our course because its not going to severely punish your bad shots. If you're a low single digit like myself, while the course will never be Pebble Beach, its going to be a great 90 minute workout for your scoring game 150 yards and in(which we all know is the MOST important part to posting a good number) The industry needs more 1500-2500 yard nine hole layouts to feed the bigger courses.

    To put it in skiing parlance where would the big expensive hills like Jackson, Squaw, Stowe, Vail be without those small little 500' bumps that introduce skiing to people?
    For sure, you have to be lost to find a place that can't be found, elseways everyone would know where it was

  9. #2009
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
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    14,829
    Quote Originally Posted by laseranimal View Post
    I'm going to speak from personal experience here, I actually OWN a golf course.

    Thanks for the insite. I grew up playing a nice par three and a 5200 yd. 18 hole course. If I remember 9 hole rounds on the full course took 90-105 minutes.

  10. #2010
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    May 2011
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    Sonoma & Truckee
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    Course design is a huge factor, but so is tee time frequency. 7-8 minutes apart between groups vs. 10 makes a huge difference in the stack up.

    Also, the concept of ready golf is just lost on too many golfers. That shit drives me crazy.

  11. #2011
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    Mar 2006
    Posts
    14,829
    Bradley and Simpson tied for first inthe PGA World Challenge. Damn cheaters.

  12. #2012
    spook Guest
    crabby old men are so cute.

  13. #2013
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    May 2011
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    Sonoma & Truckee
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    ^^ Not sure who you're referring to, Spook.

  14. #2014
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    The best neighborhood in hades
    Posts
    4,574
    Seriously. We all thought you liked young boys.
    "One season per year, the gods open the skies, and releases a white, fluffy, pillow on top of the most forbidding mountain landscapes, allowing people to travel over them with ease and relative abandonment of concern for safety. It's incredible."

  15. #2015
    spook Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by TahoeJ View Post
    ^^ Not sure who you're referring to, Spook.
    are you crabby? i didn't think so.

  16. #2016
    spook Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by guroo270 View Post
    Seriously. We all thought you liked young boys.

    no, you all like thinking about me with young boys.

  17. #2017
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    da eskalaterz
    Posts
    1,187
    Quote Originally Posted by laseranimal View Post
    This is why I'm so adamant that the ball needs to be rolled back for the pros, the average players handicap hasn't dropped, the average players drive hasn't increased but the course he's playing on has had to grow to allow the game to challenge the elite <1% of golfers who have handicaps under 6. STOP IT!!
    Great post. Where's your course?

    I think the least fun things about golf are:

    1) Looking for balls
    2) Looking for balls
    3) Waiting on every shot

    If you solve 1 and 2 then you'll be well on your way to solving 3. I also think carts are a huge cause of slow play. How many times have you seen a group of 4, where one of the guys from cart A slices one off the world, then his partner pull hooks one into the next county, and then the cart B guys do the same thing. Then you see carts criscrossing the fairway before they arrive at the green 15 minutes later. It's difficult to play "ready" golf if your cart partner is 100 yards away from you laterally.

  18. #2018
    spook Guest
    i actually enjoy looking for my ball if i'm alone with nobody behind me.

  19. #2019
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    On Vacation for the Duration
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    11,245
    We often play with what we call "The Tiger Rule". If you can't locate a ball that is in bounds and you have a pretty good idea of where it "should" be you are allowed a free drop. No penalty. We call it the Tiger rule because if T. Woods had hit the shot there would be at least 10 spectators and two marshals pointing to the ball when he got there.
    A few people feel the rain. Most people just get wet.

  20. #2020
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    The City/Truckee, CA
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    PSA:
    http://www.divot.com/

    85% shit...15% sick deals. Best daily deal I have found for golf...anyone got any others?
    "I do look like the Arrow shirt man, I did lace up my skates professionally, and I did do a fabulous job finishing my muffin."

  21. #2021
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Jack Tone Road
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    12,778
    Quote Originally Posted by cranked View Post
    Best daily deal I have found for golf...anyone got any others?
    kingdom59.com
    dealadaygolf.com
    caddiesbag.com
    dealtrackergolf.com (this is an aggregator with Divot, Golfsmith, TGW, and a bunch of other sites... one-stop shopping)

    Shit, I need to start practicing or I'm going to embarrass myself pretty bad over the holidays.

  22. #2022
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    da eskalaterz
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    1,187
    83 at CommonGround from the tips today. Not bad for not playing for a month. Weather was phenomenal. Dollar for dollar it might be the best course in the country.

  23. #2023
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Sonoma & Truckee
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    11,073
    Quote Originally Posted by wooley12 View Post
    We often play with what we call "The Tiger Rule". If you can't locate a ball that is in bounds and you have a pretty good idea of where it "should" be you are allowed a free drop. No penalty. We call it the Tiger rule because if T. Woods had hit the shot there would be at least 10 spectators and two marshals pointing to the ball when he got there.
    I do this too. Speeds up the game and it's fair by my estimation. Won't call it for myself of course but I will for my friends.

  24. #2024
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
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    The City/Truckee, CA
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    Breaking my cherry at Pebble on 12/29...high noon tee time. TR to follow...
    "I do look like the Arrow shirt man, I did lace up my skates professionally, and I did do a fabulous job finishing my muffin."

  25. #2025
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
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    On Vacation for the Duration
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    11,245
    Nice!! Be sure to alert all your friends at work so they can get some screen caps of yoy teeing off on the 1st tee webcam.
    A few people feel the rain. Most people just get wet.

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