Backcountry only skiing = lost ski skills. How to fix?

**coreshot-tourettes** · 01-04-2012, 07:41 AM

So the simple fact of BC skiing is that you don't get as many runs in as at a resort. Couple this with the fact that most BC-only skiers I've seen have terrible downhill technique and form, I worry that I might head that same direction if I stick with the backcountry, even if I ski more days per year.

What are some tips for maintaining downhill ski skills for a BC-only skier?

**skifishbum** · 01-04-2012, 07:54 AM

I find myself really trying to concentrate on the things that the straightline camp coaches pointed out about my style
so taking a camp or riding some lifts now and then really helps,
but those bc only think their straightchutin holier than thou peeps will look down upon you.
but like you said the hippity hoppity god awful style they ski with is quite laughable.
I can't get my wife to ride inbounds anymore which she really needs to do.
it amazes me the # of human handgernades that pummel their way down suspect slopes learning to tele or link turns

**buttahflake** · 01-04-2012, 08:14 AM

join the local 'beer league'. it's amazing how much this will sharpen your skillz. having to turn where they tell you is way more difficult than it sounds. it will make you commit to the downhill ski, like nothing else. don't be surprised when middle age soccer moms take you to school on the local race hill. woot!

**skifishbum** · 01-04-2012, 08:50 AM

amen I'll never forget old bushwhacky in pa spoutin his mouth off then gettin aged

inspector gadget to get his psia ass handed to him on the nastar course
classic

**gpcharles** · 01-04-2012, 09:23 AM

kinda funny you should mention this. i was noticing the same thing myself last year... not sure if you stick to touring only there's much you CAN do... i do have a pass though, and my resolution was to simply bang out more early season piste skiing than usual when the snow sucked off-piste, and focus on technique... then once i earn pow turns i'm dialed.

it's tough though if you don't have a pass (and not having a pass is kinda the point if you're doing a season of earning)... maybe find a spot where you can do car laps with a friend (e.g. berthoud or loveland) and just get in as many as possible till youre out of gas. even if the snow sucks you'll get a lot of skiing in...

edit: just read buttah's idea about joining a beer league. that's a good idea! tickets tend to be dirt cheap for those too... I know a few friends of mine do one at the local bump outside Burlington VT and i think it's like 10$ to ski for the night (under the assumption you buy a lot of beer after the race)

other option would be to find some miserable little bump with dirt cheap passes, and get one of those just for a place to keep your skiing sharp.

**moose pit** · 01-04-2012, 09:29 AM

stop meadow skippin' and step it up a notch.

**buttahflake** · 01-04-2012, 09:55 AM

Originally Posted by gpetrics

kinda funny you should mention this. i was noticing the same thing myself last year... not sure if you stick to touring only there's much you CAN do... i do have a pass though, and my resolution was to simply bang out more early season piste skiing than usual when the snow sucked off-piste, and focus on technique... then once i earn pow turns i'm dialed.

it's tough though if you don't have a pass (and not having a pass is kinda the point if you're doing a season of earning)... maybe find a spot where you can do car laps with a friend (e.g. berthoud or loveland) and just get in as many as possible till youre out of gas. even if the snow sucks you'll get a lot of skiing in...

edit: just read buttah's idea about joining a beer league. that's a good idea! tickets tend to be dirt cheap for those too... I know a few friends of mine do one at the local bump outside Burlington VT and i think it's like 10$ to ski for the night (under the assumption you buy a lot of beer after the race)

other option would be to find some miserable little bump with dirt cheap passes, and get one of those just for a place to keep your skiing sharp.

word. at my local hill it's free to get on the hill for 'beer league' they let you up, with a time stamped pass for an hour or so. plus, it's actually a fun way to get to know the true local's. the apres party is always lively! good excuse to get loose on a Tuesday night.

**icelanticskier** · 01-04-2012, 10:25 AM

folks often wonder why i've always spent so much time at the loons/sunday rivahs of the world early season. simply to get the turns/technique going in the early season without all of the distractions of pow and fun terrain. plenty of time for foofy snow sliding. my
1st order of bidness is cranking turn after turn while thinking about every single one of em. forced turns are paramount. gates, bumps, trees, especially when firm, fast and shitty. good snow is fun, but hardy makes you a better sharper skier. a lot of the skiing i do on high george in winter would hardly be considered safe hero skiing. steep and bulletproof some days and it's so nice to feel confident laying an arc into that shit. i thank EC groomer repetition for that.

good points above

rog

**mr walker** · 01-04-2012, 10:47 AM

Originally Posted by skifishbum

it amazes me the # of human handgernades that pummel their way down suspect slopes learning to tele or link turns

QFT. I'll never forget watching this family a couple of seasons ago. Mom, Dad and teenage son. It was a different kind of suspect slope...in bounds, groomers, at Breckenridge, during a really busy week. Equally scary.

They get off the lift and they're all on well used 3pin setups. I really thought something cool was about to go down. But then I realized they were your average telemark skiers (i.e. they sucked). Except they sucked even more than normal...way more. I mean BAAAD. It was terrifying to watch them "ski" amongst 20,000 other folks. All I could think of while observing that shit-train was 1. something along the lines of this thread's title and 2. there's about to be a fatality.

I'm not sure I contributed to this thread but whatever.

**Dromond** · 01-04-2012, 11:07 AM

Go to the ski area and ski as many runs as you can. Particularly, go when conditions are not ideal and there are no lift lines.

**Teh Poacher** · 01-04-2012, 11:11 AM

Good balance=Good form

Best way to work on balance is on a pair of SHORT, sub<80 waist turny, turny, carve, carve skis on blue/black groomers. You can't cheat, if you are out of balance you will get schooled. Anything you learn about yourself under these conditions will translate to better 'form' in the BC.

edit: Oh, and stay off center-mount skis unless your goal is to be a better tail-gunner.

**StraightChuter** · 01-04-2012, 11:13 AM

I don't see it so much as losing alpine skills but more gaining mountain skills. With backcountry skiing, technical turning ability is just one part of the bigger picture of finding good snow, route finding, avalanche safety, pacing, endurance, etc.. Whether the trade off is worth it or not depends on what experience you are looking for. Refusing to let go of the alpine mindset is one of the biggest hindrances to really getting into the backcountry as they are very similar, but also very different activities.

Couple this with the fact that most BC-only skiers I've seen have terrible downhill technique and form

Form follows function. I find my technical skiing skills go way up when I'm using heavy metal alpine gear, riding high speed quads and cranking groomers.

**Dug** · 01-04-2012, 11:20 AM

Originally Posted by Teh Poacher

Good balance=Good form

Best way to work on balance is on a pair of SHORT, sub<80 waist turny, turny, carve, carve skis on blue/black groomers. You can't cheat, if you are out of balance you will get schooled. Anything you learn about yourself under these conditions will translate to better 'form' in the BC.

This. A couple days skiing all conditions (from pow to mank to crud to ice) on skis like that makes jumping onto fatter skis that much better.

**Buster Highmen** · 01-04-2012, 11:22 AM

You're doing it all wrong if you're worried about your skiing technique.

Take a tip from the Mountaineers or Mazamas and forget about that demonic downhill demon and focus instead on being really anal about your gaiters, roping up on 20 degree snowfields (especially if alone) and spending evenings sharpening your crampons while posting snidely derrogatory remarks about lift skiers on TurnsAllYear.

Think of all the fun you'll have coordinating your forest green or worn red gaiters with a vast array of stylish knickers and carefully and artfully waxing the earflaps on your Jones cap. The thrill of online comparisons of 60-40 cloth with egyptian cotton awaits while sneering down on goretex and other jonny-come-lately fashion blips.

So it's really all about commitment and thinking about slicing your ski experience in a different, superior way that enables one to glare down upon the trendmongering hoards at the inbounds lifts upon which you depend (because the road would never be plowed). Let them dance in wild abandon to a pile of cheap transistor radios, each tuned to a different station while they rip one another off for small personal items while you and your buddies supremely glide far above their sinful and errant ways.

You need to focus on getting the flimsiest telemark setup possible, stopping shaving and politically correctly crashing your way down the nearest bc access. Surely you'll score the telebetty of your dreams.

**skifishbum** · 01-04-2012, 11:26 AM

got him pegged

**bornincolorado** · 01-04-2012, 11:30 AM

i think that about sums it up

**hev** · 01-04-2012, 11:33 AM

If you are a deadicated BC skier, you will certainly encounter lots of snow conditions that are challenging and will push your technique. I challenge myself to ski things the way I want first try, and never fall in the BC.

The camp is also a big plus and stays with you for a long time.

**JoeStrummer** · 01-04-2012, 11:34 AM

To me, it's two entirely differerent forms of training. . .

**ill-advised strategy** · 01-04-2012, 11:55 AM

Originally Posted by Dromond

Go to the ski area and ski as many runs as you can. Particularly, go when conditions are not ideal and there are no lift lines.

+ Ski moguls.

Moguls: nature's ski coach.

**skifishbum** · 01-04-2012, 12:01 PM

shut your fuckin zipperline mouth
cause the truth hurts
still waitin for the save the wastach/sillyfork ski off

**JoeStrummer** · 01-04-2012, 12:06 PM

Originally Posted by YetiMan

+ Ski moguls.

Moguls: nature's ski coach.

Moguls are made by nature?

**skifishbum** · 01-04-2012, 12:17 PM

nope
magnets
hudge snow shaping magnets

**charles martel** · 01-04-2012, 12:20 PM

The "ski in all conditions advice" is really best. A lot of in bounds resort hills are really skied up into varied by afternoon on the weekdays, which is when they seem to be least crowded. It's a great time to make yourself go through everything from ice, to crud, to bumps, to combos of all three on your way to the bottom.

**wcf3** · 01-04-2012, 12:32 PM

Kind of interesting skiing at Silverton where you often end up in a group with both good resort skiers and dedicated BC skiers. The resort skiers often get nuked by the hikes, while the BC guys get trashed doing the downhill laps.

As others have pointed out, for downhill technique and conditioning, there is really no substitute for doing laps, which means either give up your day job or spending some time on lifts. To look at the bright side, some of the best practice for getting downhill technique into shape is when the resort skiing is bad, so you don't have to wait in lift lines. Few things will kick your shoulders followin' the tips, backseat skiin' ass like doing some non-stops on icy bump runs. It will also show you that all that conditioning you thought you had from going up the hill doesn't directly translate into conditioning for going down the hill.

Apart from lift served skiing there are a couple of things I find help some (not that much, but some): Try to ski your backcountry runs down non-stop. Your more likely to find a rythm and as you get tired will be forced to ski more economically (which typically enforces using better technique). It can also be helpful to do some 'downhill skiing' specific conditioning and excercises (core strength, anaerobic endurance, etc.). This at least puts you into position to ski downhill properly when you get to it.

**coreshot-tourettes** · 01-04-2012, 01:33 PM

Originally Posted by ncognico

Personally don't think anybody that isn't an advanced skier should be in avy terrain. Skiing's not that hard. learn to do it well before you head out off-piste. But oh well people can do what they want.

That's my feeling as well. 95% of people I see in the BC are terrible skiers - stemming the hell out of their turns, flailing upper body, way in the backseat, weight over inside ski, etc. It's possible that they were terrible skiers before they got into the BC and they're still terrible now. I just don't want to ever look like them.