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  1. #2151
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danno View Post
    My kid's skiing has been all over the place this year. She's been really tentative racing, she does the half wedge turn on steeper terrain, it's been kind of a step back most days. Yesterday at steamboat was one of those days, until we met up with some friends and their kids, and then she decided she could rip again. Blasting through Closets with 7 kids ages 9-12 was a trip!

    If anyone has any advice as to how I can keep her skiing like that, and not the tentative half wedge skier on a slightly steep blue run, I'm all ears.
    a bit of anti-stoke, I guess, but she hasn't been improving, which is really bumming me out. She loves the program/ski racing, but doesn't seem to get that the goal is to go faster (and then she gets bummed when she finishes DFL or close to that on race day).

    It's such a hudge monetary and time commitment, and I'm really questioning whether we should do this next year. I WANT her to want it, and I don't want to be the asshole parent pushing their kid too hard. And I don't give a shit how she does in races, so long as she is trying hard and doing her best (and I tell her this often). But it doesn't feel like she's done either of those this year; she's no better of a skier than she was 3 months ago. And I see those pics of uglymoney's 9yo and it just hammers home how my kid just isn't getting it. And I don't know what to do.

    [/anti-stoke]
    "fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
    "She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin

  2. #2152
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    Well, my kid crashed out of the last race so I guess he took our advice to giv'r. He's a good skier but aside from one (and the only) GS he's near the back of the pack. He still loves it though.

    I think you're being too harsh. Kids develop at different rates so I wouldn't put too much stock in the results from this year.

    You never know, next year could be the year it clicks and she just takes off. If she's really enjoying it, and the people/friends in the program I say stick with it.

    If she's getting tired of it, it's not worth pursuing since all you'll do it make her resent the sport. I'm lucky in that my 10 year old is basically dragging me out the door every day.

    And yeah, it sure as hell isn't cheap.

  3. #2153
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danno View Post
    a bit of anti-stoke, I guess, but she hasn't been improving, which is really bumming me out. She loves the program/ski racing, but doesn't seem to get that the goal is to go faster (and then she gets bummed when she finishes DFL or close to that on race day).

    It's such a hudge monetary and time commitment, and I'm really questioning whether we should do this next year. I WANT her to want it, and I don't want to be the asshole parent pushing their kid too hard. And I don't give a shit how she does in races, so long as she is trying hard and doing her best (and I tell her this often). But it doesn't feel like she's done either of those this year; she's no better of a skier than she was 3 months ago. And I see those pics of uglymoney's 9yo and it just hammers home how my kid just isn't getting it. And I don't know what to do.

    [/anti-stoke]
    I would say if she still enjoys it let her keep at it. If it hasn't already there will come a day when she makes the connection between improving and keeping up with her friends and the effort needed to do that. My 8yo went through this with gymnastics and after 2.5 years finally decided she didn't like being the oldest girl in her class but didn't love it enough to start doing more than one practice a week so she was done with it. I always try and remind myself that I tried tons of sports and the one I was best at I didn't even start until 8th grade.

    Even here in a ski town we've taken the no pressure approach to skiing, as long as it's fun they can do it. So far haven't shown any interest in racing, which is fine with us. Unfortunately living in a ski town next to the mountain doesn't make kids alpine programs any cheaper, although AVSC is still cheaper than Vail I hear.

    Welcome to parenthood and walking the line between pushing your kids too much or not enough. Keep your head up, we're all walking the same line.
    "They don't think it be like it is, but it do."

  4. #2154
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    Well, she does love it (though I think that's largely because she loves the social aspect). And I'm not dragging her to it, she definitely wants to go (and telling her we might not next year should be a motivator for her to step it up, at least that's the hope). And I don't give a darn about her results, I really don't. She could finish DFL every race as far as I'm concerned.

    But I am concerned with the fact that her skiing seems to be regressing, if anything, not improving. She's not gotten one bit faster this year, she's as slow and tentative now as she was on her first day. And she's got 15+ days in this year. It just doesn't seem like she pushes herself at all, not in freeskiing and not in races, and that's what bothers me.
    "fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
    "She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin

  5. #2155
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joey Joe Joe Junior Shabadoo View Post
    Welcome to parenthood and walking the line between pushing your kids too much or not enough. Keep your head up, we're all walking the same line.
    Thanks. This is definitely something that I am struggling with a lot right now, it's really bumming me out. I don't want to be the asshole parent yelling at their kid to do better at some sport. But I also know that there's a lot of life lessons and satisfaction from working hard at something, and paying all this money just so she can have some social time with friends and ski a bit is a hard pill to swallow.
    "fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
    "She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin

  6. #2156
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danno View Post
    It just doesn't seem like she pushes herself at all, not in freeskiing and not in races, and that's what bothers me.
    Maybe pushing her skiing just isn't her thing. Could just be how she's wired. Not everybody has a long-term pursuit for the perfect turn. Some (like my wife, for example), like to get out for a few runs with friends and do see it as more of a social thing than anything else. Pushing for more speed in racing also carries with it more danger, thanks to the speed. That could be an element as well.

    My mindset is to encourage my kids to connect skiing with fun. But they have a lot of say in how the things are connected.

  7. #2157
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danno View Post
    Well, she does love it (though I think that's largely because she loves the social aspect). And I'm not dragging her to it, she definitely wants to go (and telling her we might not next year should be a motivator for her to step it up, at least that's the hope). And I don't give a darn about her results, I really don't. She could finish DFL every race as far as I'm concerned.

    But I am concerned with the fact that her skiing seems to be regressing, if anything, not improving. She's not gotten one bit faster this year, she's as slow and tentative now as she was on her first day. And she's got 15+ days in this year. It just doesn't seem like she pushes herself at all, not in freeskiing and not in races, and that's what bothers me.

    Did you ask her coaches what they think? Everyone has their speed limit when it comes to skiing. My 6yo daughter tells me "turning is boring" and so far has the chops to back it. Her 8yo sister with two extra years of practice sounds more like your daughter, loves skiing but even following friends doesn't really try and "push it" to keep up and is just more hesitant some times, same with my wife who can ski anything around here, just at her own pace. Just because your daughter hasn't discovered the joy of going mach looney down an icy groomer yet doesn't mean it won't come, and it doesn't have to come from a race program either if she gets tired of it.
    "They don't think it be like it is, but it do."

  8. #2158
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cravenmorhead View Post
    Maybe pushing her skiing just isn't her thing. Could just be how she's wired. Not everybody has a long-term pursuit for the perfect turn. Some (like my wife, for example), like to get out for a few runs with friends and do see it as more of a social thing than anything else. Pushing for more speed in racing also carries with it more danger, thanks to the speed. That could be an element as well.

    My mindset is to encourage my kids to connect skiing with fun. But they have a lot of say in how the things are connected.
    Totally get that, and we have always worked at connecting skiing with fun (and still do). And she chose ski racing, she asked to do it, we didn't push her into it. And she chose it because she liked chasing gates, she liked racing, she liked going fast and competing. Maybe she doesn't now, don't really know (wish I did).

    And if she just wants to approach skiing as a fun activity with friends, I'm cool with that. But I also don't want or need to spend 2 grand just so she can do that.
    "fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
    "She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin

  9. #2159
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joey Joe Joe Junior Shabadoo View Post
    Did you ask her coaches what they think? Everyone has their speed limit when it comes to skiing. My 6yo daughter tells me "turning is boring" and so far has the chops to back it. Her 8yo sister with two extra years of practice sounds more like your daughter, loves skiing but even following friends doesn't really try and "push it" to keep up and is just more hesitant some times, same with my wife who can ski anything around here, just at her own pace. Just because your daughter hasn't discovered the joy of going mach looney down an icy groomer yet doesn't mean it won't come, and it doesn't have to come from a race program either if she gets tired of it.
    I have asked her coaches, haven't really gotten much help (her main coach and I talk about it regularly but she doesn't know the answer). And she used to be faster, that's what is so frustrating! And I really don't care if she's a ski racer or not (I wasn't, I became a skier as an adult). I just want her to love skiing and get joy out of it. But I also want there to be some point to having her in a ski racing program; right now it feels like I pay a shitton so that she can ski with a bunch of kids every Sunday.
    "fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
    "She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin

  10. #2160
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    Thanks all for the input.
    "fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
    "She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin

  11. #2161
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    My kid raced for a few years and really didn't like it. He loved skiing with me.

    Racing is a good background and makes great skiers, but its not the end all be all. There are other paths to becoming a great skier.

    Try an all-mountain/freeride program next year if racing isn't her thing. I coach the junior all mountain team at Loveland on saturdays. My kid is on the regular all mountain team and is now having the time of his life. He is making friends that are destined to become life-long friends. Several of the other dads (and one mom) and I have taken them on hut trips, ski trips to other ski areas and backcountry ski trips outside of the team.

    The all mountain programs get lots of kids that are burned out on/don't like racing these programs often rekindle their love of the sport.

  12. #2162
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    Thing is, she isn't burned out, and she really likes the program, and gets really bummed when she doesn't do well in races.

    As near as I can tell, she WANTS to be a ski racer (if she didn't, I wouldn't be posting this here).
    "fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
    "She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin

  13. #2163
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    Ski racing is certainly not for everyone - some kids hate the repetition and the discipline and will choose to gravitate elsewhere, and some kids love it but suck at it.
    My girls are a bit older (11 & 13) but they both just love ski racing and are really dedicated. I think its taught them both a lot about other life skills - responsibility, preparation, taking care of your gear etc. They are both working really hard this year and results are coming - the 11 yr old has won damn near everything shes entered this year and the 13 yr old just qualified for Rocky Central champs. I keep telling them the results donít matter, what matters is them having fun and putting in the effort. Every year we talk about the time and commitment and whether they want to keep going - so far the universal answer is yes.
    The part that bums me out though is not getting to freeski with them as much as Iíd like but when i do Iím blown away - they rip!

  14. #2164
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danno View Post
    a bit of anti-stoke, I guess, but she hasn't been improving, which is really bumming me out. She loves the program/ski racing, but doesn't seem to get that the goal is to go faster (and then she gets bummed when she finishes DFL or close to that on race day).

    It's such a hudge monetary and time commitment, and I'm really questioning whether we should do this next year. I WANT her to want it, and I don't want to be the asshole parent pushing their kid too hard. And I don't give a shit how she does in races, so long as she is trying hard and doing her best (and I tell her this often). But it doesn't feel like she's done either of those this year; she's no better of a skier than she was 3 months ago. And I see those pics of uglymoney's 9yo and it just hammers home how my kid just isn't getting it. And I don't know what to do.

    [/anti-stoke]
    Sometimes I find the unrelenting positivity of my fellow parents oppressive. For example, it's okay to admit that your kids' 4th grade class music recital was abjectly terrible, and not even in a cute, amusing way.

    I've now got my second kid in a race program. The first kid did it for four years, from 7 to 11. She was good and podiumed sometimes but not a ton. She mostly liked it but wasn't crazy about all the 7 a.m. practices. As for me, I started off pretty fired up about it. I spent money on decent (albeit used) gear, invested in good race tunes, and attended races with enthusiasm. But, after a while, I lost that enthusiasm. Race days, I realized, suck. YMMV, but in Tahoe, they involved (a) getting to the resort by 8 a.m., (b) waiting, (c) watching 30 seconds of your child skiing, (d) checking the internet often to see how your child did, (e) more waiting, (f) still more waiting, (g) repeat for the second run, and (h) wait for the medal ceremony. All in all, they tend to be all day affairs that involve little skiing. Add to that the time and money involved, and I began losing enthusiasm during her third season. By the end of the fourth season, I didn't encourage her to race the next season but didn't actively dissuade her either. It was her choice, and when she chose not to race, I was a little relieved.

    With that said, I am blown away with how good a skier she is. She has a superb foundation and was a better skier at 11 than I was at 20. I give all credit to her experience in the race program. We've been backcountry skiing together for the last year and, as a parent, that has been far more rewarding than ski racing ever was.

    The second kid is now 10 and in his second year of racing. He usually finishes in the top quarter but hasn't podiumed yet. His technique is also much rougher than my daughter's was at the same age. Whenever I see him skiing with the rest of the team, he's the kid that's trying to hit every stupid, unsafe jump he can find. He kind of likes race team but I get the sense that he doesn't care that much about the races themselves. I'd kind of like to keep him in the race program for another year so that his technique improves but I'm also interested in moving him to a freeride team so that he can both stay motivated and still get organized instruction. If he suddenly develops a great enthusiasm for racing that stretches into his teens, I'll continue to support him (but I'll be secretly bummed about the cost and time-suck involved).

    Anyhow, I'm not really giving advice, just relaying my own perspective and experience. Good luck, Danno!

  15. #2165
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    As a corollary to the blah blah, here are some photos from the last year of my now 12-13 year old in the bc (Shasta, Tahoe, and the Eastern Sierra). I love getting out with her.

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  16. #2166
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    . . . and the aforementioned 10-year old. I follow the time-honored tradition of giving the second-born child the short end of the stick attention/photo-wise.

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  17. #2167
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    Forgive me Danno but how old?

    I have no answer either but if she is loving it you are ahead of the game. DFL isn't what bothers you it is the lack of improvement. Somewhere there is a feedback loop when a kids makes a sweet turn and it gives them a reward and they go back for more...raceteam or no. My daughter always had that. Stepson not so much and he can take skiing or leave it. You can tell when they ski.

    On the other hand we asked my stepsons soccer coaches when he was young if we should bother re enrolling he was so bad. We did. Now he is the star of his club team and likely playing college soccer.

    Friend of mine on the race team this year has twins and one of them hasn't really developed any friendships so he just skis non stop by himself. Dad not a good teacher so poor fundamentals that have been carried into raceteam. One day this year things just fucking clicked for him and now he is close to the top ten nearly every race and he looks good and is super stoked railing turns hard. His twin sister looks worse now than at the end of last year to my eyes.

    My daughter seems to either give it or just play it safe depending on which side of the bed she gets up on. It is frustrating because I want her to point em and run the direct line every single race, I encourage her to DNF a time or two, but no. Also she has a friend who is a pain in my ass, wants to go inside, asks my daughter to throw races so she can win, skis laps that are super slow because she fucks around so much and makes my daughter wait 20 minutes while she thinks about hitting a jump all while I invest so much time and capital getting my girl to the hill and polishing her edges. The nerve of that girl. But godamn if this PIA hasn't provided us with talking points and teachable moments. We aren't developing a Mikaela but we do want a well rounded girl who can deal with difficult people.

    My wife has an X boyfriend who is a coach on another team in our league and they have only made one race this year. Similar issue as you except she seems not even to want to race. Coach dad doesn't get it, mom is fine with it, almost encouraging her disinterest.

    So the struggle is real for all of us...lol. It isn't just about the skiing. No magic bullets. I think Danno being Danno you are on the right track. If she wants to do it again you should. Things definitely might just click at some point.
    Last edited by uglymoney; 02-25-2020 at 05:41 PM.

  18. #2168
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    She's 9, first year U10.

    Thanks for the anecdotes, they're helpful.
    "fuck off you asshat gaper shit for brains fucktard wanker." - Jesus Christ
    "She was tossing her bean salad with the vigor of a Drunken Pop princess so I walked out of the corner and said.... "need a hand?"" - Odin

  19. #2169
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danno View Post
    She's 9, first year U10.

    Thanks for the anecdotes, they're helpful.
    The boy who is a twin who suddenly clicked and went boom this year is 10 skiing U12.

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

  20. #2170
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    Iíve got a 9 year old first year U10. Sheís crazy fast but loves skiing with all the kids so itís not about the competition. My first year U12 is more cautious but a great free skier. Both like it, the U12 just had it click and is getting faster finally. Click image for larger version. 

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  21. #2171
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    My 8 year old loves skiing but so far has zero desire to race. Kind of surprising because heís super competitive in everything else he does. Works for me though because Iíd rather spend the day skiing with him instead of watching him race.

    A little bit of kid stoke:












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  22. #2172
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    Wow. Great discussions above. And timely too since our 7 yo minimagette had her first race today. She ran U8 slalom and podiumed with 3rd. Of course there were only like 5 in her age bracket. She was the top one not in the fancy all race program that ran the race (TAS) as she's in a half freeride half race program across the valley at Aply (ARC). We weren't sure how'd she like racing but she was definitely into it and was grinning ear to ear when she got the trophy.
    It's strange because she has a pretty low key personality and isn't really competitive but has also always been super precise and determined about things. Having never had experience with ski racing not sure how this will pan out. If she decides to continue we'll be supportive but if she just wants to rip around with mom and dad next season that will be fine with us. The only thing really disturbing is she has asked us to try snowboarding a couple of times.

  23. #2173
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    racing and baseball are things I throw subtle hints to deter. Not interested in that scene, but racing can no doubt help teach junior to bend the ski. I raced on the local high school team starting sophomore year after my dad paid me and essentially got me to switch from snowboarding to skiing. Smart move pops.

    high school leagues were not as competitive as the dedicated mountain race teams, but some of their best competed in the high school league anyway in those days. the bus rides to Wednesday night practices and solid control of the music system, and heavy consumption of chronic on the hill made me a fan. Like night skiing on a spaceship.

    the 9 y.o. getting some pow.

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  24. #2174
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danno View Post
    Thanks all for the input.
    ok so fuck what the coaches are doing and saying

    what are YOU doing? are you skiing with your kid or taking her to ski training?

  25. #2175
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    If Iíve posted this here before ignore it.

    The only down side (besides money) to my kids ski racing is not getting to ski with them as much as Iíd like. So, Anytime they free ski I ask the coaches if I can tag along. Pass our snacks on the lift, get to rip w a bunch of really good 9-10 year olds. Really good. So far coaches have been totally cool.

    We skin behind the house as well.

    I think itís important to keep skiing with the kids...and have a touch on the interpersonal dynamics.

    My .02


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