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  1. #3876
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
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    SoCal
    Posts
    5,856
    Been using G/Flex for dowels, since those are permanent.

  2. #3877
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Western MT
    Posts
    1,965
    Quote Originally Posted by 1000-oaks View Post
    Been using GG for years and have never had that happen, the expansion fills voids but it doesn't exert much pressure. About the only danger is using too much and having it flow/foam out of the hole and up into the underside of the binding, which could make it hard to remove a binding like a Marker Royal toe that needs to slide backwards to reveal the front screws. Never had this happen either, but I have had to pry the back of the toe up a bit (after removing the rear screws) to crack the seal so I could slide the toe back.

    No need to wet the hole with water, there's enough moisture in the air to cure the glue even in a dry environment like SoCal. It cures to a clear flexible yellow where it can't expand (in the threaded hole) and a tough, slightly flexible foam where it has room to expand (voids under the binding). Just a little drop inside the top edge of the hole, and a little dab on the screw threads is all it takes.

    It does take a good "crack" with the screwdriver (I use a small crescent wrench on the hex below the screwdriver handle for added torque) to break the GG seal when removing screws, but they come out perfectly clean and rust-free.

    On a metal ski with tapped threads, I treat GG'd holes as if they're inserts and am comfortable remounting a binding unlimited times. Just make sure the screws you use later aren't longer than the ones you used for the first mount.
    I've seen a thread regarding bases being bumped out when someone used GG but can't recall if it was TGR, maybe Earnyourturns.....

    But maybe it was because screw length was too long, too much glue to escape when driving screw, or something else and they chalked it up to the GG. The stuff does expand like crazy when I've used it for home projects, but that was where it emerged around the screw head.

    I dampen the hole/screw as per GG instructions when I need it to set as strong as possible (eg. anchoring concrete screws), but have done it without water too for other uses that I wasn't as concerned about.

  3. #3878
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    5,856
    GG and epoxy have a pretty high viscosity, so if you add it to the hole and then drive in the screws with a power driver, you could easily force air or gel into the ski somewhere you don't want it. Use a screwdriver by hand and tighten each screw until you feel some pneumatic/hydraulic resistance, and then go to the next screw. When you come back to each screw that was resisting, the pressure will have relieved past the threads and you can tighten it some more. It can take several laps around the pattern to fully tighten the screws, but this avoids high-pressure injection of glue or trapped air.
    Last edited by 1000-oaks; 10-24-2020 at 10:15 AM.

  4. #3879
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    northern BC
    Posts
    21,682
    any liquid doesn't compress so you could probably do something like that with wood glue or chicken soup
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  5. #3880
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Western MT
    Posts
    1,965
    Quote Originally Posted by XXX-er View Post
    any liquid doesn't compress so you could probably do something like that with wood glue or chicken soup
    Chicken soup for the win, fuck epoxy!

    Quote Originally Posted by 1000-oaks View Post
    GG and epoxy have a pretty high viscosity, so if you add it to the hole and then drive in the screws with a power driver, you could easily force the gel into the ski somewhere you don't want it. Use a screwdriver by hand and tighten each screw until you feel some hydraulic resistance, and then go to the next screw. When you come back to each screw that was resisting, the pressure will have relieved past the threads and you can tighten it some more. It can take several laps around the pattern to fully tighten the screws, but this avoids hydraulic injection of glue or trapped air.
    This is the approach I take as well.

  6. #3881
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Sikskiyou's
    Posts
    1,411
    I'm looking to mount some Tyrolia Attack 13 DEMO bindings.

    Missing a few screws and can't find a tech doc online that shows the specs for the screws, other than the full screw pack from Tyrolia.

    So I'm trying to determine the correct screw size for the forward mounting holes in the heel piece for 8mm of insertion depth. I measured and my estimate is a 15mm length screw, but am curious if anyone knows for certain? If I install 15mm screws and they should have been 16mm, will my skis explode?
    fun hater.

  7. #3882
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    274
    Quote Originally Posted by donetlynx View Post
    I'm looking to mount some Tyrolia Attack 13 DEMO bindings.

    Missing a few screws and can't find a tech doc online that shows the specs for the screws, other than the full screw pack from Tyrolia.

    So I'm trying to determine the correct screw size for the forward mounting holes in the heel piece for 8mm of insertion depth. I measured and my estimate is a 15mm length screw, but am curious if anyone knows for certain? If I install 15mm screws and they should have been 16mm, will my skis explode?

    Couple pair just sold in GS, maybe check with those buyers and have them measure before they mount. But they will not explode.

    My centerline tip is using a clear protractor like these, the transparency helps me figure out where the edge is and not measure off the sidewall or topsheet and the protractor part helps me keep the ruler perpendicular to the ski. Either match the overhang on either side and mark the 3" point or start from the 0 and practice your fractions.

  8. #3883
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    The Fish
    Posts
    3,466
    Yeah i dont get the people saying dont use GG. DPS even says to use epoxy or polyurethane glue on their mounting instructions, which is what GG is. I mean if it was gonna ruin a ski a tour 1 DPS would be high on that list.
    a positive attitude will not solve all of your problems, but it may annoy enough people to make it worth the effort

    Formerly Rludes025

  9. #3884
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Western MT
    Posts
    1,965
    Quote Originally Posted by Eluder View Post
    Yeah i dont get the people saying dont use GG. DPS even says to use epoxy or polyurethane glue on their mounting instructions, which is what GG is. I mean if it was gonna ruin a ski a tour 1 DPS would be high on that list.
    I just said use it sparingly. I know there's a thread where someone claimed it caused bumps on the ski bases upon expansion. Whether that was the real cause, I don't know. But sounds like they may have attributed to the wrong thing. I will try to find it later. My current adhesive of choice for binding screws is GG construction adhesive. Simple to use, stays flexible, easy to remove screws. No long term tests yet, but short term it looks good based on bindings I have removed.

    Right now I have to go shovel the foot of snow that fell overnight with more piling up.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

    Correction, 16" and piling up.

    I found one thread, but pretty sure there were pics in the one I was thinking about. OP says the bumps weren't there until the gg cured, but maybe just didn't notice them before or whatever.

    https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...ounting-issues
    Last edited by 3PinGrin; 10-24-2020 at 10:01 AM.

  10. #3885
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    5,856
    ^ I'd wager he used way too much glue and cranked in the screws too fast, and it had nowhere to go. The first (and hopefully only) time you do that, you can actually hear the fiberglass layers starting to crack apart, or perhaps the ptex being separated from the glass (if the screw holes reach the base). The angle of the (lubricated) screw threads X screwdriver torque = seriously high fluid pressure.

    This is even a bigger deal when installing inserts, because there's more air trapped under them.

  11. #3886
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    monument
    Posts
    5,723
    Quote Originally Posted by 3PinGrin View Post
    I just said use it sparingly. I know there's a thread where someone claimed it caused bumps on the ski bases upon expansion. Whether that was the real cause, I don't know. But sounds like they may have attributed to the wrong thing. I will try to find it later. My current adhesive of choice for binding screws is GG construction adhesive. Simple to use, stays flexible, easy to remove screws. No long term tests yet, but short term it looks good based on bindings I have removed.

    Right now I have to go shovel the foot of snow that fell overnight with more piling up.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

    Correction, 16" and piling up.

    I found one thread, but pretty sure there were pics in the one I was thinking about. OP says the bumps weren't there until the gg cured, but maybe just didn't notice them before or whatever.

    https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...ounting-issues
    16"!?!
    Yes!
    Where?

  12. #3887
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Western MT
    Posts
    1,965
    Quote Originally Posted by pfluffenmeister View Post
    16"!?!
    Yes!
    Where?
    Closer to 19" now, Helena. Below zero tonight and a high of 50 Friday, going to get messy....

    Quote Originally Posted by 1000-oaks View Post
    ^ I'd wager he used way too much glue and cranked in the screws too fast, and it had nowhere to go. The first (and hopefully only) time you do that, you can actually hear the fiberglass layers starting to crack apart, or perhaps the ptex being separated from the glass (if the screw holes reach the base). The angle of the (lubricated) screw threads X screwdriver torque = seriously high fluid pressure.

    This is even a bigger deal when installing inserts, because there's more air trapped under them.
    Yowsers. Probably right, I still don't think you would need much GG glue given expansion though. But I'm sticking with GG construction adhesive for now.

  13. #3888
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    5,856
    Quote Originally Posted by 3PinGrin View Post
    Closer to 19" now, Helena. Below zero tonight and a high of 50 Friday, going to get messy....



    Yowsers. Probably right, I still don't think you would need much GG glue given expansion though. But I'm sticking with GG construction adhesive for now.
    Nope, imagine how little empty space there is in the hole after the screw is inserted. You just need a film between the threads.

    Cores in soft touring skis can be really porous and soak up a surprising amount of glue or epoxy (which strengthens the wood), so you can swab the hole threads (I use use a tiny flat blade watch screwdriver) with glue and wait a few minutes, and then re-swab with glue from the puddle at the bottom (if there is any) before putting a dab on the screw threads and installing the screws.

  14. #3889
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Puget Oceania
    Posts
    570
    Newest addition:
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    Chronic Complainer Experiencing Ikon Cognitive Dissonance Since 2018
    Ow! My Balls!

  15. #3890
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Sikskiyou's
    Posts
    1,411
    Quote Originally Posted by caulfield View Post
    Couple pair just sold in GS, maybe check with those buyers and have them measure before they mount. But they will not explode.

    My centerline tip is using a clear protractor like these, the transparency helps me figure out where the edge is and not measure off the sidewall or topsheet and the protractor part helps me keep the ruler perpendicular to the ski. Either match the overhang on either side and mark the 3" point or start from the 0 and practice your fractions.
    Thanks - much appreciated.
    fun hater.

  16. #3891
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    437
    Quote Originally Posted by Ow_My_Balls View Post
    Newest addition:
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    Yeah!

  17. #3892
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Posts
    156
    Had a total failure tonight trying to drill new skis for inserts. I used the BF drill guide block, which i had used last season to successfully install inserts into 2 pairs of skis. I think the metal in that guide block is too soft; it ended up getting slightly reamed out wider with each use. So all my holes came out misaligned tonight. Bleh, what a fiasco. Feel really stupid now.

    Been reading previous posts in this thread about repairs with epoxy and wood dowels. Anybody ever try filling in holes with dowels and epoxy and then redrilling and mounting in basically the same locations? (+/- 1 to 2 mm)

    Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

  18. #3893
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Western MT
    Posts
    1,965
    Quote Originally Posted by sierra_cement View Post
    Had a total failure tonight trying to drill new skis for inserts. I used the BF drill guide block, which i had used last season to successfully install inserts into 2 pairs of skis. I think the metal in that guide block is too soft; it ended up getting slightly reamed out wider with each use. So all my holes came out misaligned tonight. Bleh, what a fiasco. Feel really stupid now.

    Been reading previous posts in this thread about repairs with epoxy and wood dowels. Anybody ever try filling in holes with dowels and epoxy and then redrilling and mounting in basically the same locations? (+/- 1 to 2 mm)

    Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk
    I use an inexpensive Craftsman drill guide, but haven't ever used it for inserts. Well worth the $30ish I paid several years ago.

    Search for Margotron's dowel fix, solid enough to redrill.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

  19. #3894
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
    Posts
    286
    Quote Originally Posted by sierra_cement View Post
    Had a total failure tonight trying to drill new skis for inserts. I used the BF drill guide block, which i had used last season to successfully install inserts into 2 pairs of skis. I think the metal in that guide block is too soft; it ended up getting slightly reamed out wider with each use. So all my holes came out misaligned tonight. Bleh, what a fiasco. Feel really stupid now.

    Been reading previous posts in this thread about repairs with epoxy and wood dowels. Anybody ever try filling in holes with dowels and epoxy and then redrilling and mounting in basically the same locations? (+/- 1 to 2 mm)

    Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk
    Iíd be inclined to go a cm forward or back if you can.

    Defer to others on redrilling filled holes slightly off from the original. Probably helps that youíre using inserts.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  20. #3895
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Stumptown
    Posts
    6,275
    Can you find inserts that are just a bit bigger on the OD to cover the existing holes? I feel like Iíve heard of these, it maybe I am miss-remembering

  21. #3896
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    166
    Quote Originally Posted by sierra_cement View Post
    Had a total failure tonight trying to drill new skis for inserts. I used the BF drill guide block, which i had used last season to successfully install inserts into 2 pairs of skis. I think the metal in that guide block is too soft; it ended up getting slightly reamed out wider with each use. So all my holes came out misaligned tonight. Bleh, what a fiasco. Feel really stupid now.

    Been reading previous posts in this thread about repairs with epoxy and wood dowels. Anybody ever try filling in holes with dowels and epoxy and then redrilling and mounting in basically the same locations? (+/- 1 to 2 mm)

    Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk
    Lou had a post back in 2006 about this: https://www.wildsnow.com/398/how-man...rill-in-a-ski/

    He prefers a mix of epoxy and steel wool to fill. Clean the top sheet smooth after it cures. Then start with a small pilot hole that is straight and correctly located and gradually step up drill sizes.

  22. #3897
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    166
    Next question.

    I might have eff'ed up in thinking I could re-use holes. Tell me what you think...

    Old bindings =marker squire. Rectangular hole pattern with holes spaced 32mm apart x irrelevant distancing.

    New bindings : marker tours. Rectangular hole pattern with holes 36 mm apart x irrelevant...

    So each hole is 1mm off of the existing hole. Is that out of tolerance? Ski cores are fiberglass +metal sandwich.
    Last edited by Jimi_Lee; 10-26-2020 at 11:04 AM. Reason: corrected Marker squire hole spacing

  23. #3898
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    northern BC
    Posts
    21,682
    Quote Originally Posted by waxloaf View Post
    I’d be inclined to go a cm forward or back if you can.

    Defer to others on redrilling filled holes slightly off from the original. Probably helps that you’re using inserts.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    this^^
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  24. #3899
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    the Low Sierra
    Posts
    13,630
    Hardman machinable epoxy
    I didn't believe in reincarnation when I was your age either.

  25. #3900
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    437
    Quote Originally Posted by sierra_cement View Post
    Had a total failure tonight trying to drill new skis for inserts. I used the BF drill guide block, which i had used last season to successfully install inserts into 2 pairs of skis. I think the metal in that guide block is too soft; it ended up getting slightly reamed out wider with each use. So all my holes came out misaligned tonight. Bleh, what a fiasco. Feel really stupid now.

    Been reading previous posts in this thread about repairs with epoxy and wood dowels. Anybody ever try filling in holes with dowels and epoxy and then redrilling and mounting in basically the same locations? (+/- 1 to 2 mm)

    Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk
    Just for clarification. Did you drill directly with the insert drill bit size or are the faulty holes 3.6/4.1 mm dia?

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