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  1. #3101
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    I mounted my own fucking skis today.
    I didn't believe in reincarnation when I was your age either.

  2. #3102
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    Did some fucking ski mounting last night

    Click image for larger version. 

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  3. #3103
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    Drill press makes the whole process so much better...

  4. #3104
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    I have a question a a shop mount that I think needs to be reworked:

    Front piece of my G3 Ions is moving a bit (like .5mm) around on the ski (dps 120s pure3) and does not sit really flush with the top. The other ski is solid.

    So my first impulse was to crank down the screws but I think maybe some glue or whatever might losen while doing so... I really want to keep the position as it is already 2nd mount and the other ski is solid therefore I am asking for advice here before fucking it up.

    So what should I do? Tighten the screws or additional / different action?

  5. #3105
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeoK View Post
    I have a question a a shop mount that I think needs to be reworked:

    Front piece of my G3 Ions is moving a bit (like .5mm) around on the ski (dps 120s pure3) and does not sit really flush with the top. The other ski is solid.

    So my first impulse was to crank down the screws but I think maybe some glue or whatever might losen while doing so... I really want to keep the position as it is already 2nd mount and the other ski is solid therefore I am asking for advice here before fucking it up.

    So what should I do? Tighten the screws or additional / different action?
    FTR, binding 'glue' is actually a screw hole sealant and does not hold the screw and binding to the ski. The screw is the mechanical fastening to the ski. So cranking down will let you know if you can crank it further or you have a spinner. If a spinner, nylon inserts are one option, as are stainless steel inserts or helicoils.

    BUT! I'd consider removing the toe piece first instead of just cranking it down so I could inspect what was going on. Maybe the hole wasn't deep enough and drilling a little deeper might be needed. If true and you cranked it down, you could dimple the base.

    If the screws are epoxied (which is not typical for shop mounts AFAIK), then heating the screw with a soldering iron will soften the epoxy.
    Best regards, Terry
    (Direct Contact is best vs PMs)

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  6. #3106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boissal View Post
    Drill press makes the whole process so much better...
    And yet more complicated than it needs to be.
    "timberridge is terminally vapid" -- a fortune cookie in Yueyang

  7. #3107
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeoK View Post
    I have a question a a shop mount that I think needs to be reworked:

    Front piece of my G3 Ions is moving a bit (like .5mm) around on the ski (dps 120s pure3) and does not sit really flush with the top. The other ski is solid.

    So my first impulse was to crank down the screws but I think maybe some glue or whatever might losen while doing so... I really want to keep the position as it is already 2nd mount and the other ski is solid therefore I am asking for advice here before fucking it up.?
    Maybe the screw is just loose in which case crank it down with some 24hr epoxy

    or maybe its gona spin in which case I chop up a little fibreglass woven cloth into 1/2 inch lengths, mix well with just enough 24hr epoxy to wet out the fibres ( you want a not too resin rich mix ) cram it into the holes , run the screws all the way in or until they start to spin and let cure for a couple days after that you should be able to crank the screw down

    A few people here have used this method with sucess
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  8. #3108
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timberridge View Post
    And yet more complicated than it needs to be.
    Well, I wouldn't recommend buying a drill press specifically to mount skis but the ability to drill completely vertically and on center is nice. I don't bother with using a center punch if I have a drill press as it's easy to perfectly line up the bit with the template. Without the press I center punch using something fine and pointy but the line thickness on the template means that this "pilot" is sometimes off by a couple 10th of a milliliter. It's hard to spot visually but I drill it becomes clear that the hole is a bit shifted. It's never been an issue with any of my mounts but at times I've had to first fully tighten the 3 screws which align best then put a bit of force on the 4th one which has a bit of an off-center hole.
    The press is also faster if that matters...

  9. #3109
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boissal View Post
    Well, I wouldn't recommend buying a drill press specifically to mount skis but the ability to drill completely vertically and on center is nice. I don't bother with using a center punch if I have a drill press as it's easy to perfectly line up the bit with the template. Without the press I center punch using something fine and pointy but the line thickness on the template means that this "pilot" is sometimes off by a couple 10th of a milliliter. It's hard to spot visually but I drill it becomes clear that the hole is a bit shifted. It's never been an issue with any of my mounts but at times I've had to first fully tighten the 3 screws which align best then put a bit of force on the 4th one which has a bit of an off-center hole.
    The press is also faster if that matters...
    It's completely unnecessary for a standard non-insert binding screw if you use a real binding bit like the one that chap is using there. But if you got a press go for it. And it's not faster. But even if it was, who cares, are you doing 50 skis in a row?
    "timberridge is terminally vapid" -- a fortune cookie in Yueyang

  10. #3110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpinord View Post
    FTR, binding 'glue' is actually a screw hole sealant and does not hold the screw and binding to the ski. The screw is the mechanical fastening to the ski. So cranking down will let you know if you can crank it further or you have a spinner. If a spinner, nylon inserts are one option, as are stainless steel inserts or helicoils.

    BUT! I'd consider removing the toe piece first instead of just cranking it down so I could inspect what was going on. Maybe the hole wasn't deep enough and drilling a little deeper might be needed. If true and you cranked it down, you could dimple the base.

    If the screws are epoxied (which is not typical for shop mounts AFAIK), then heating the screw with a soldering iron will soften the epoxy.

    Ok this makes sense. Will proceed with care and remove first. I think once the mount was good so the hole should be deep enough. No epoxy in there - but at hand if needed for the repair.
    Thanks!

  11. #3111
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    I assume a drill press would be really nice for doing inserts where you really want that hole to be perpendicK you lar to the ski, but I don't have a drill press, i never do inserts and I likely never will

    IME from using a drill press yars ( in HS ) ago a skinny bit will still walk the surface if you don't center punch ... the bit deflects a little
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  12. #3112
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timberridge View Post
    It's completely unnecessary for a standard non-insert binding screw if you use a real binding bit like the one that chap is using there. But if you got a press go for it. And it's not faster. But even if it was, who cares, are you doing 50 skis in a row?
    I guess, Smoke 'em if you've got 'em.....but I'd argue, that for me, hand drilling is plenty adequate, far easier, more convenient than setting up a drill press for alpine screw mounts. Same for inserts and a hand drill guide....or not.

    If you are not confident hand drilling, you can easily practice on scrap wood or skis. You aren't building pianos and the margin of error is not only fairly forgiving, but 'tweakable'. The cores have movement and are 'mashable'.

    FTR, If you are thinking that a drill press is absolutely perpendicular to the top sheet in all directions, it technically isn't if there is a change in thickness/curve in the top of the ski.

    The variability in your boots, snow surfaces and skis is far more than fractions of mm's or a few degrees from vertical. Don't sweat the small stuff and trust your natural ability to adapt to those inconsequential variables.....unless you just can't stand it.

    EDIT: Along with a drill press, I have a CNC and CAD software with all the templates. At some point I'll definitely drill a pair of skis purely to try it out as an exercise, not because I think I need that kind of accuracy to drill skis.
    Best regards, Terry
    (Direct Contact is best vs PMs)

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  13. #3113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timberridge View Post
    It's completely unnecessary for a standard non-insert binding screw if you use a real binding bit like the one that chap is using there. But if you got a press go for it. And it's not faster. But even if it was, who cares, are you doing 50 skis in a row?
    So dogmatic... Is there room for personal preference here or is everyone not doing it your way just doing it wrong?

    Unnecessary, yes. Useless, hell no. Faster, yes, in my experience, mostly because I skip the centerpunching step with the press.
    Does speed matter? Nope, as you pointed out I'm not cranking out 50 mounts in a day. But if I can save myself a step I could potentially make a mistake on, I'll take it.
    Does the added accuracy of the press matter? Probably not, as Alpinord pointed out below there are many other variables that affect a mount and getting perfectly centered and vertical holes isn't critical.
    But do I feel better when everything lines up perfectly when I'm mounting non adjustable tech bindings on brand new skis? Yep, and that makes the press worth it when I have access to it.

    Incidentally I've mounted several sets of inserts without a drill press and it's never been an issue, I just had to be super careful. The only time I've really needed the press was to widen an existing screw hole off-center, meaning instead of using the existing hole as a pilot and widening by the same amount in all directions I needed the outer edge of the new hole to line up with that of the old hole. That required a carbide end mill and I'd have hated to deal with that without the press.

  14. #3114
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boissal View Post
    So dogmatic...
    Quote Originally Posted by Boissal View Post
    Drill press makes the whole process so much better...
    hmmmmm

  15. #3115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boissal View Post
    So dogmatic... Is there room for personal preference here or is everyone not doing it your way just doing it wrong?
    I'm just preparing you for when the laser and CNC boys show up here and give you drill press fanboys a real shakedown.
    "timberridge is terminally vapid" -- a fortune cookie in Yueyang

  16. #3116
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boissal View Post
    So dogmatic... Is there room for personal preference here or is everyone not doing it your way just doing it wrong?
    FWIW, we were just using it to use it. Have done plenty of skis by hand and it's much quicker that way, but this was just to say we did it. Time handicap at the expense of incrementally more "perfect" holes, which ultimately doesn't matter as others have stated.

    Now, with inserts I always use the press, because I've had bad experiences with a wonky drill/tap which made it impossible to get a screw in the insert.

  17. #3117
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timberridge View Post
    I'm just preparing you for when the laser and CNC boys show up here and give you drill press fanboys a real shakedown.
    Unlikely that I'll ever bother, but the super duper overkill mounting jig that I'm making right now because I'm injured and can't ski quite yet is set up to be easily mounted in the vice on a manual mill, with the idea that I could theoretically use that for a hole pattern that I don't bother making mounting plates for.


    Normally I'll just use plates and a hand drill, like a jigarex. The whole enterprise is mostly unnecessary and overkill, but I'm bored.

  18. #3118
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    Quote Originally Posted by HAB View Post
    Unlikely that I'll ever bother, but the super duper overkill mounting jig that I'm making right now because I'm injured and can't ski quite yet is set up to be easily mounted in the vice on a manual mill, with the idea that I could theoretically use that for a hole pattern that I don't bother making mounting plates for.


    Normally I'll just use plates and a hand drill, like a jigarex. The whole enterprise is mostly unnecessary and overkill, but I'm bored.
    That's fine. We all love gadgets and if your thing or somebody else's thing gives someone more confidence to do something themselves, all the better. I have a burnishing tool with a walnut handle that I bought once because it looked cool. A screwdriver shaft works just fine, but I like using my walnut handled burnishing tool...until someone comes out with a new laser guided one.
    "timberridge is terminally vapid" -- a fortune cookie in Yueyang

  19. #3119
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeezerSteve View Post
    hmmmmm
    Should have added IMO I guess. Which is all any of us are entitled to in the end...

    Quote Originally Posted by Timberridge View Post
    I'm just preparing you for when the laser and CNC boys show up here and give you drill press fanboys a real shakedown.
    Now we're talking. When I was in grad school I used to spend time in a machine shop where they built ultra-high precision instruments for physical chemistry experiments. They guys there would have stabbed me in the eye if I had mentioned hand drilling anything...

    Quote Originally Posted by cstefanic View Post
    Now, with inserts I always use the press, because I've had bad experiences with a wonky drill/tap which made it impossible to get a screw in the insert.
    I may or may not have enlarged one hole in a dynafit toe piece to deal with an insert that was a bit off to the side. The head of the machine screw never sat flush with the toepiece since the insert also went in crooked. Liberal used of blue loctite has prevented issues so far.

  20. #3120
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timberridge View Post
    That's fine. We all love gadgets and if your thing or somebody else's thing gives someone more confidence to do something themselves, all the better. I have a burnishing tool with a walnut handle that I bought once because it looked cool. A screwdriver shaft works just fine, but I like using my walnut handled burnishing tool...until someone comes out with a new laser guided one.
    Yeah that's really what I meant. I've mounted a lot of skis with paper templates and haven't died yet. But toys are fun and I'm going stir crazy.

  21. #3121
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timberridge View Post
    And yet more complicated than it needs to be.
    Agreed.

    Sent from my SM-A505W using Tapatalk
    Goal: ski in the 2018/19 season

  22. #3122
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boissal View Post
    Well, I wouldn't recommend buying a drill press specifically to mount skis but the ability to drill completely vertically and on center is nice. I don't bother with using a center punch if I have a drill press as it's easy to perfectly line up the bit with the template. Without the press I center punch using something fine and pointy but the line thickness on the template means that this "pilot" is sometimes off by a couple 10th of a milliliter. It's hard to spot visually but I drill it becomes clear that the hole is a bit shifted. It's never been an issue with any of my mounts but at times I've had to first fully tighten the 3 screws which align best then put a bit of force on the 4th one which has a bit of an off-center hole.
    The press is also faster if that matters...
    I can't imagine a couple of tenths of a mm would do anything to a binding mount .

    Sent from my SM-A505W using Tapatalk
    Goal: ski in the 2018/19 season

  23. #3123
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    PSA: Mount your own fucking skis.

    Drilled by hand. Zip zip zip zip zip zip zip zip zip zip zip zip. Typically just 8 toe zips for you alpine freaks. I whack the drill point with a thick long wood screw that dimples the top sheet at the measured entry point. Double check measurements. Rewhack if adjustment necessary. The drill bit tip sits nicely in your final divet point. Greatly minimizes slippage risk. Explains the hammer in this photo. Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by Doremite; 12-10-2019 at 07:42 AM.
    Uno mas

  24. #3124
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shorty_J View Post
    I can't imagine a couple of tenths of a mm would do anything to a binding mount .
    On a tech toe, getting the front holes 1/10mm to the right and the rear holes 1/10mm to the left would put the heal about 2 mm off the center line, about the max tolerance for a tech mount. double that and you wouldn't be able to click the heal in. This is clearly a worst case, as your errors would more likely be random and cancel each other out. But tech binding tolerances are pretty tight.

  25. #3125
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    Quote Originally Posted by nick_B10 View Post
    On a tech toe, getting the front holes 1/10mm to the right and the rear holes 1/10mm to the left would put the heal about 2 mm off the center line, about the max tolerance for a tech mount. double that and you wouldn't be able to click the heal in. This is clearly a worst case, as your errors would more likely be random and cancel each other out. But tech binding tolerances are pretty tight.
    Which could easily be remedied by not screwing the toe tight until the boot is in the binding to tweak & align the toe with the heel. The boot can also be used as a lateral lever if needed.
    Best regards, Terry
    (Direct Contact is best vs PMs)

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