Help, legal questions in SLC regarding leases

[Tresckow]

We're getting facked around by our apartment complex over unfair billing and we need to break our lease. We need to know if they( the complex) may have already broken our lease by charging us for clean-up fees of which we had no part in the making, and then overcharged at that rate which was orginally quoted in the lease.

It's one thing to be targeted for cig butt littering, but we dont fucking smoke!

The management is unwilling to erase the said fees, because they have employees who claim that we littered them in a common area, and they identified us as the culprits. Unfortunatly, were getting the shaft over this mistaken identity.

So can we break the lease( we have a couple months to go, do not have an outstanding balance, etc) without getting reamed later on by the complex for not finishing the lease. Will they hunt us down? Fuck with our credit?

We are currently getting a mortgage for a home, and we want to move out asap.

Any legal types that have some opinions, advice, ect? Maybe a govt agency that deals with these kind of disputes?

ps we already contemplated shooting the hostage, too messy for us.

sorry to clutter the board with nonskiing related crap, I'll erase this soon.

[irul&ublo]

Not licensed to practice in Ootah, but here's my take:

The imposition of fees, though incorrect, does not constitute a breach of the lease. The landlord is still providing you w/ those thigs you bargained for. My advice...just don't pay the charges. Tell em to fuck off and if they threaten you w/ eviction, then say fine, go ahead.

Or, if they have it in Utah...take them to small claims court (the kind where they don't allow the parties to be represented by lawyers) and ask the judge for "declaratory relief" in the form of a decision that 1. You don't owe the fees; and 2. That the LL breached the lease by charging them w/o a basis to do so. Mumble a lot about the landlord violating the "implied covenant of quiet enjoyment", by threatening you w/ the imposition of unnecessary/unwarranted fees.

[assgasorgrass]

without reading the lease, I would have to say that if you moved prior to the lease being up, you are on the hook for the two remaining months pretty much no matter what (unless the place was unlivable due to some sort of negligence on the landlord's part, broken plumbing). if you have completed the lease term and are living on a month to month basis then it would depend on the lease wording how much notice you have to give. You may be able to offset some of the rent cost with your deposit getting refunded.

[TheDingleberry]

My advice: Read your lease. If it's not in paper its not valid.

[Tresckow]

Should we break the lease, what can they do to us? It seems that renters break leases all the time without consequence, ( we have poeple moving in and out all the time around here) we're worried about getting taken to court ourselves. Is it worth their time/money to take us to court, seeing as it's going to be a lease through the end of april ( it says were liable for the unpaid months).

We've already taken steps about getting even for this, but now we just want out.

[irul&ublo]

My advice: Read your lease. If it's not in paper its not valid.

HUH????????????

If its not "in paper", how the fuck can he read it?

And BTW, oral leases of real property of less than a year duration (ie. month to month) are generally valid.

[eDub]

Tresckow-

Re-read your lease. What does it say about additional charges and fines?

You need to be careful because any bad credit reporting (legit or not) at this point could seriously affect the terms of your mortgage. It migh be cheaper to pay the fine now than (a) have a lower credit score, which would significantly raise the amount you pay in interest over the life of the mortgage; or (b) to fight to have the bad credit notiation fixed.

Put your complaint in writing and demand to know who accused you of the littering(?). Demand exact dates, times, etc. Maybe you were skiing with another maggot on that day?

If you break your lease, you could be liable for the remaining months on your lease as well as the costs of re-letting the place. Most likely you would not be liable if they moved someone else in the next day. If they have to sue you, you could be liable for their attorney's fees (if you are found to be at fault and if there is an atorneys' fees clause in the lease, which I'm certain there is.) Remember, the terms of the lease control everything, so read it carefully.

[CougarHunter]

check with your city housing authority or the housing section in your city's community development or planning department. There are both local, state, and federal laws concerning housing. The Fair Housing Act through the HUD website would be another resource.

[Tresckow]

So if we want out, should we find a way to be evicted?

We had a situation 2 months ago where these management clowns lost one of our rent checks, and then preceded to give us a 3 day pay-up or eviction notice posted to our door. WTF? If we had been out of town we could of been screwed. They claimed that we didn't include the check, even though it was clear to us they missplaced it. I even had to pay a bank fee to cancel the missing check, which the managment team wouldn't reimburse us for.

The previous eviction notice didn't state any additional fees if we moved withen their 3 day pay-up or leave letter. So I'm thinking we might need another one of those eviction letters. Or could that backfire even worse?

Maybe we could get some govt health agency guy to check out our pad and deem the air quality unfit? We have these bloody pigions that live inbetween the central air unit and the roof. We can see all sorts of pigeon crap and feathers stuck to the intake. Every time we clean the ceiling fans, there's this nasty clumpy dust crap stuck to the fan. When the management clowns came by in the fall to change our air filters, it was the nastiest shit I've seen stuck to the filter. Maybe getting the govt agencies on this would clear up opur lease real quick, or is this destined to backfire?

[UTdave]

where do you live?

[Tresckow]

Sante Fe Apartments off Fort Union, I wouldn't refer anyone to this place now. We basically rented it because we could walk outside our door and hop on the ski buses. We have delt with and put up with many annoyances, but it wasn't until they made it personal did we want to move. They are treating us (their customers) with such low regard that I do not want to give them another penny.

Side note:

We have began getting even for this stuff though. A couple days ago when this became a impossible situation, I made sure to step in all that freash dog shit that some inconsiderate pet owner leaves near our walk way. I mean there's piles of this everywhere. Now figuring these ass clowns we not going to budge, I stomped in this shit on my way to deal with the clean up fees.

I went to the management offices, and pleaded my case. As I expected, I was told in so many words to fuck off, so I left lots of dog shit all over their floors. I even heard the two employees, who had been called in as witnesses to our transgressions of littering, whispering amongst themselves that someone must of walked dog shit into the offices.

The saga continues...

[irul&ublo]

Seriously...the best thing to do is not break the lease or get evicted, that will get you on the local realtors/lessors shit list. Just don't pay the charges and keep paying you rent on time. Send them a letter, copied to the owner of the property, not just the mgmt., that you are not responsible for the ciggy butts and will not pay the charges, but you will continue to pay rent and otherwise comply with all conditions of the lease and that you expect them to do likewise.

I do like the dogshit thing, though.

[Tresckow]

Thanks for the advice. This shit list you speak of; what if we get our mortgage approved, find our dream home, and close on it. Do we say the hell with being on a shit list because we would have already closed on our house? Can it hurt us in the long term and in what regard?

[irul&ublo]

Well...never good to have a record of either an eviction or lawsuit on the lease on your record....could end up on a credit report. But once you get your house, you don't have to worry about lessors not wanting to rent to you.

[Viva]

irul's advice is the best. Do not pay any of their fines and then write your own notice to quit when the time comes to move. Is this complex at capacity? i.e., are there unrented units? If so, they're not going to try and drive renters out.

Whether or not the management decided to fuck with you depends on the amount of money that they could collect. It costs money for them to take you to court or mess with your credit. If you're talking about $500 or so, don't sweat it, it's not worth it to them. They would be losing money.

You'll have to do the math to determine what works out best for you just as the apt. management will.

Pay rent on time, give notice to quit (DO NOT USE THEIR FORMS!!!), get the fuk out of Dodge when the time comes, and don't expect to get anty security back.

[Tresckow]

Thanks guys. Btw, we didn't put down a security deposit so I guess we wouldn't be leaving money with them. I'm kinda afraid they will get us for nit-picky moveout/cleaning fees even if we complete the lease or not. I don't trust those clowns.

[iceman]

Never trust clowns.

[Viva]

I'm kinda afraid they will get us for nit-picky moveout/cleaning fees even if we complete the lease or not. I don't trust those clowns.

Wouldn't surprise me if they did. If you've been there a year or more, there's expected to be normal "wear & tear" and the renter isn't responsible. Unless you're damaged fixtures or walls or something, don't pay any cleaning fees. They would need a court order to collect.

[shamrockpow]

Can you say Maggot Flop House?

PM sent

[dropinskiout]

I'm kinda afraid they will get us for nit-picky moveout/cleaning fees even if we complete the lease or not. I don't trust those clowns.

Take pictures of the place after you have moved your stuff out so you can prove the condition you left it in.

[Tresckow]

The 'wear and tear" clause is after a year of rent, which we wouldn't reach until mid march. Problem is the carpet wasn't in great shape before, and while we haven't abused the place, there are only so many places to walk around in here. They would def get us for replacing the carpet if we left earlier than that.

Of course that would allow me more time to walk around their offices

[Woodsy]

Side note:

We have began getting even for this stuff though. A couple days ago when this became a impossible situation, I made sure to step in all that freash dog shit that some inconsiderate pet owner leaves near our walk way. I mean there's piles of this everywhere. Now figuring these ass clowns we not going to budge, I stomped in this shit on my way to deal with the clean up fees.

I went to the management offices, and pleaded my case. As I expected, I was told in so many words to fuck off, so I left lots of dog shit all over their floors. I even heard the two employees, who had been called in as witnesses to our transgressions of littering, whispering amongst themselves that someone must of walked dog shit into the offices.

The saga continues...

Note to self, if forced to fire Treskow, do it off the resorts property & buy a new car.......

[TheDingleberry]

HUH????????????

If its not "in paper", how the fuck can he read it?

And BTW, oral leases of real property of less than a year duration (ie. month to month) are generally valid.

Umm...yeah but he has a lease. All changes must be amended.

[yentna]

http://www.utcourts.gov/howto/landlord/

[FollowMe]

Ned...what up brutha! say hi to Kristen for me. Do you have a security deposit posted? I'd imagine if you break the lease, that'll be at risk. Otherwise, I can't imagine they'll try to take action against you in court, but who knows? If it's only a couple of months, maybe you should just stay the course, ride it out and then bail. C yah when the snow falls .