High reliablity, High MPG car options

[teletripper]

I'm driving a subie now and it is a damn good ride in the snow, holds all my shit in the back (skis, tools, supplies for work) no place to stash the dead hookers though.

[Johnny Deep]

I love my passat tdi wagon but Wheel & ground clearance is not great on the VW's...subie's are a better value if you intend to drive on snow, gravel, washboard, etc

I drive my Passat 4Mo in lots of snow. Get decent snow tires and it digs. Faces shots have been had more than once.

[XXX-er]

diesel is mo expanesive than reg in the US ,IME whatever you would save on great milage with a TDi is eaten up by higher fuel cost ... but they are nice to drive

I am a fiord lover nowdays ,they have reliablity approaching the japaneses based car companies ,good pricing and are in good shape compared to GM & chrysler

[Meathelmet]

I'm a TDI fan, but VW and high reliability don't belong in the same sentence. They're not horrible, but definitely have lots of small but ongoing issues.

Hyundai's seem to offer a lot of bang for the buck these days, although I'm not sure about reliability.

Wtf?
In our close family we have or have had 9 VWs. Passats (3),Touran,Golf,Transporters,Skodas.
Driven totally about 2mil Ks. No bigger probs,whatsover.
TDIs eat oil a bit, balljoints in older passats were poor and the automatic trannies had some seal probs. Thats it. I dont know what shit VW ships to the states,but the general consensus here in euroland that they are as reliable as cars get. Well,except the older Toyotas were more reliable.

Hyundais and Kias? Hehhe... In some german TUV charts a bit over 35% of kias did not pass the inspection after 3 years... There is a reason why they have 7yr "warranty"...
South koreans are desperately trying to get to the western markets and the only way to achieve that is to give them a superb warranty. Wich the buyers are going to need,sadly.

[Beaver]

Prius is roomy, ugly & gets really good milage

[char]

I am seriously surprised at how many Ford recommendations there are. Is a Focus going to be a 150-200k mile car or is it going to turn into a shit box after 100k? My ranger is at 127k and still going strong, but I'm inclined to think that is the simple 4cyl engine.

I have friends who have a Prius and they haven't been impressed.

[toast2266]

Wtf?
In our close family we have or have had 9 VWs. Passats (3),Touran,Golf,Transporters,Skodas.
Driven totally about 2mil Ks. No bigger probs,whatsover.
TDIs eat oil a bit, balljoints in older passats were poor and the automatic trannies had some seal probs. Thats it. I dont know what shit VW ships to the states,but the general consensus here in euroland that they are as reliable as cars get. Well,except the older Toyotas were more reliable.

No idea if Euro VW's are different. Like others have said, the internals of the engines are fine, but everything else has problems. Here is the quick list off the top of my head of the weird problems, some fixed, some ongoing, with my wife's Jetta TDI (I didn't include other issues that I consider normal wear and tear / maintenance):
-oil pan protective cover cracked and eventually broke off
-turbo clogs frequently, requires expensive cleaning
-turbo leaks
-turbo overheats and shuts off randomly
-ft. shocks sacked out quickly, leading to it riding even lower
-headlights / tail lights burn out with ridiculous frequency
-rear hatch release jams
-doors freeze shut (not really a reliability issue, but it's annoying)
-air filter cover sucks, which can lead to filter blow by (also not really reliability)
-turn signal clicker comes on sporadically. Seems to be related to how far back/forward the drivers seat is (?). This one takes the cake for most annoying.
-ABS / brake pad sensors failed
-check engine light is on permanently
-eats glow plugs for breakfast and shits them out for dinner

I'm positive I'm forgetting a few.

Also, no questions hyundais used to suck. Some of their newer stuff seems to be worth considering, especially when you consider that a new hyundai costs roughly the same as a used TDI.

[Skistack]

The 2012 Focus is an all-new model, so reliability is unknown. Ford reliability has been improving, the company definitely has it's shit together and has some great products. That being said, if reliability and economy are priorities, get a Honda. If the Civic is too small, look at the Accord. 4 cylinder or V6 available. We have a 2007 V6 sedan, 32mpg on the highway and plenty of power.

[newschoolerz]

Scion xB. No i'm not kidding.

excellent space inside, it gets killer gas mileage, sporty feel to it and i've had no issues in the snow. Cheap too.

[MarcusBrody]

It was pretty much the same when I got mine. That's actually how I ended up with the "Sport" model with the paddle shifters rather than a regular stick. It was the only one in town.

[Jax]

...snow tires...

Previously I ran Hakka 3's, no studs. Freaking awesome in the snow up to about 5" of slush or untracked before I felt I needed 4wd or more clearance. You just have to go real slow in slush as the car is so light (even with full load of dog, camps/ski stuff weighting the back).

I'm running Yokohama Ice Guards this year, also studless. They are a little more quiet, but they tend to make the car migrate a bit on dry roads. But I've had these tires before on a diff car so I knew what to expect, they certainly were easier to find than the Hakkas when the time came to purchase.

[Jax]

It was pretty much the same when I got mine. That's actually how I ended up with the "Sport" model with the paddle shifters rather than a regular stick. It was the only one in town.

Took me about a week after a test drive to find a stick, wanted silver but settled on the red. Bought it an hour after getting the call as others were in line to get it if I didn't pay up.

[karpiel]

I am seriously surprised at how many Ford recommendations there are. Is a Focus going to be a 150-200k mile car or is it going to turn into a shit box after 100k? My ranger is at 127k and still going strong, but I'm inclined to think that is the simple 4cyl engine.

I have friends who have a Prius and they haven't been impressed.

Ford's cars are pretty bomber. Not as good fit and finish or material quality, but well made.

They are usually 200k + cars.

[::: :::]

damn, toast that does suck!
i've had a jetta tdi wagon 02 with no issues and we now have an 04 passat tdi wagon with none of that. great car other than clearance for me.

[Sphinx]

Most reliable cars I've ever known were mid-ninties civics, accords, and integras.

I had a 99 subaru, from 99k to 140k. I did all the maintenance religiously. The head gaskets leaked slightly until I added Subaru's stopleak. The wheel bearings went bad, so I had em fixed.

Two weeks ago the transmission got stuck in first. I towed it to my mechanic, who was puzzled. He accidentally popped it out of first. Drove great after that.

I sold it a week later. Now I have a 98 civic in my driveway. I'm in no hurry to own another Subaru. YMMV.

[toast2266]

damn, toast that does suck!
i've had a jetta tdi wagon 02 with no issues and we now have an 04 passat tdi wagon with none of that. great car other than clearance for me.

I make it sound a bit worse than it actually is - like I said earlier, I'm still a TDI fan because it does lots of things really well. But I've checked on most of the issues we're having, and the majority of them are well known glitches with VW's. Like I said before - great cars, but not high reliability.

[AdironRider]

Shit, for 15k Id buy another Ranger. This time 4x4 with a cap.

You're already getting 27 with one, thats pretty damn good real world mixed driving. You can do so much more with the truck than a Jetta TDI wagon, other than winning a smug contest.

Id personally have a really reliable vehicle than one that breaks down more often but gets higher gas milage. One repair wipes out like a 1/2 year of gas savings right quick.

You can pick up next to new Rangers for 15k all day long, and I live in truck country. They might not be the sweetest rigs in all the land, but every single one seems to go forever and costs little to maintain.

German cars, I dont care how reliable, kill your wallet on parts, and mechanics kill you on labor and blame ze germans. Trust me, Ive been there. They will be tougher to work on if thats your thing, and parts are still expensive.

Plus you can sleep in the back in more comfort than anything else other than a bigger truck. Get a flip pac and thank me later.

[uglymoney]

I am seriously surprised at how many Ford recommendations there are. Is a Focus going to be a 150-200k mile car or is it going to turn into a shit box after 100k? My ranger is at 127k and still going strong, but I'm inclined to think that is the simple 4cyl engine.

I have friends who have a Prius and they haven't been impressed.

The drivetrains of small Fords have been long lived since before Ford figured out how to bolt the cars together properly. The last two Ford Escorts my mom had went 300k and 235k and neither burn any oil (the 93 is still going but is now my parents beater replaced by a newer Corolla with the five speed). The new CU ratings for Ford in general look very promising. My wife's parents have a Focus Hybrid and it is super slick, smooth, and trouble free. I have an Outback and a 4-Runner and after a bad experience with Ford in the nineties swore I'd never buy one again but things change.

The new Focus is a new car with unknown reliability and expensive because it is an upmarket small car so it is a bit of a risk for sure. Regardless I'm excited by the direct injected technology in the engine, the HP, the excellent fuel economy, the chassis, the tranny. 160 hp and 38 epa highway kicks ass. 40 epa highway with the sedan and sfe option. If this doesn't make you sit up and take notice then look at the other options. http://blog.caranddriver.com/2012-fo...t-sfe-package/ Chances are good that in the real world on the highway the Focus will be capable of kicking the shit out of 40 mpg. My experience with direct injection on two stroke outboards is that it saves gas and the engines run smoother and stronger than traditionally injected engines, period.

VW TDI's I worry about reliability, cost of parts, frequent timing belt interval (60k I think?), difficult to wrench on? All info I've gathered from the interweb having never owned a VW. I still want one though. The Jetta is more practical but I salivate over the Golf.

Civic I worry about nothing and love the fact that it is a drivers car with a super slick gearbox. I dislike sedans though and 140 hp with an epa of 36 is a step down from the Focus but they are such smart little cars.

The Corolla drives like a grandma car. Super boring, clunky gearbox. Good fuel economy though (35 epa with 132 hp) and reliable as all hell, very easy to work on. My parents get 40 + doing 80 mph in their Corolla as long as they aren't pushing a headwind. Also the 1.8 has a timing chain. You could potentially buy this car and just change tires, oils, and pads for years and years. Corolla wagon (Matrix) gets 31 auto 32 with the stick.

The Hyundai Elantra is probably a good option as well with 40 epa but I have yet to come around to them for some reason. I'd like to drive one.

My two cents.

[hemas]

The Jetta is more practical but I salivate over the Golf chassis.

Jetta and Golf share the chassis...

After all, in practical sense Jetta is just a sedan Golf. Heck, Golf Variant (stationwagon) was even sold as a Jetta in the US.

[Meathelmet]

Like I said before - great cars, but mine have not been the most reliable.

Corrected it for you toast.

[dumpy]

The Matrix only comes with the 2.4 liter 158 hp in an auto and it gets a crappy 29 mpg. My parents get 40 + doing 80 mph in their Corolla as long as they aren't pushing a headwind. Also the 1.8 has a timing chain. You could potentially buy this car and just change tires, oils, and pads for years and years.

Incorrect, you can still get an auto 1.8 Matrix.
I own one actually, boring as fuck to drive, but man can it hold a lot of gear for a car that I average 35mpg (non winter) in. The fun in that car is not in the drive, but rather in the cargo.

[uglymoney]

Jetta and Golf share the chassis...

After all, in practical sense Jetta is just a sedan Golf. Heck, Golf Variant (stationwagon) was even sold as a Jetta in the US.

Okay. I'm not a VW head so I pulled that out of my ass from somewhere. To correct myself (hopefully): the US Jetta gets a shitty torsion beam rear suspension instead of the fancy multilink rear suspension on the US Golf. In Yurp both models get the fancy rear suspension.

Despite replacing the older car’s multilink rear suspension with a cheaper torsion-beam axle and the electric power steering with a hydraulic system, the new Jetta is still pleasing to drive, although we can’t help thinking that we’d prefer to be behind the wheel of a Mazda 3 or VW’s own Golf.

Incorrect, you can still get an auto 1.8 Matrix.
I own one actually, boring as fuck to drive, but man can it hold a lot of gear for a car that I average 35mpg (non winter) in. The fun in that car is not in the drive, but rather in the cargo.

Ooops, thanks for the correction! I was on the Yota page and missed the base Matrix section. With the 1.8 liter the auto is epa rated at 31 highway and the stick at 32. I know real world they do better.

[jeffmoore]

you might also consider just where your money is going to end up in all this...
mechanics are (usually) family owned and the people actually live, and raise their family, in your community. oil companies could give a fuck about you or your community. this choice, while hard to put a $ sign on, has real value.

[goldenshowers]

Have to chime in on my TDI Golf's. Both mine are 2003's, one has 415 000km and the other 115 000km. THe high mileage one gets 60 mpg on the highway. The low mileage one isn't quite that good, but as with all TDI's they get better with age.

[uglymoney]

Edmunds has a nice comparo of the 12 Focus vs the Chevy Cruze. I'm looking forward to test driving the Focus. The wife and I will be in the market for one of the cars mentioned in this thread in a short while.

http://www.insideline.com/ford/focus...-titanium.html

Also this is a good article on Ford's new direct injected two liter. Timing chain!

http://blogs.edmunds.com/strategies/...orsepower.html