Review: Binding Freedom Inserts - The Swiss Cheese Experiment

**GoldenBC** · 02-01-2023, 04:31 PM

Would you? I would.

Hojis with Mtn bindings. Holes plugged with hardwood dowels that were roughed up for better bondage. Glued in with two part epoxy. The new mount is where the X’s are. So all four toe piece holes are interesting.

Would you use heli coils or tap a 3.6 hole and retain material by using just the screw? Or would you burn them and never ski again.

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**bodywhomper** · 02-01-2023, 06:19 PM

Originally Posted by galibier_numero_un

People use various solvents. I steal my wife's ultrasonic jewelry cleaner, add a touch of Simple Green to the hot tap water and voila!

... Thom

So the citrus-based degreaser that I have is good enough?

**Dan816** · 02-01-2023, 07:43 PM

Why not drop heli coils or inserts into the existing empty holes? Is moving the binding 4mm ish that important?

**GoldenBC** · 02-01-2023, 08:07 PM

8mm. First mount was a Dynafit at 5mm back (as per Hoji method). Binding turned out to be broken, second mount is the MTN at 8mm back. The proposed mount is on the line (8mm forward from current mount) which seems to make a big difference on Hojis.

But the question isn’t about where to mount, it’s if you think the proposed method will fly.

**Dan816** · 02-01-2023, 08:41 PM

Originally Posted by GoldenBC

8mm. First mount was a Dynafit at 5mm back (as per Hoji method). Binding turned out to be broken, second mount is the MTN at 8mm back. The proposed mount is on the line (8mm forward from current mount) which seems to make a big difference on Hojis.

But the question isn’t about where to mount, it’s if you think the proposed method will fly.

Man, running all four toe screws in compromised locations would worry me regardless, but I think I like the idea of a heli coil overlapping more into the hardwood plug. Looks like a 3.6 hole would be kissing the old mtn holes which I don't like.

**galibier_numero_un** · 02-02-2023, 07:45 PM

Originally Posted by bodywhomper

So the citrus-based degreaser that I have is good enough?

I'd say so just rinse several times.

... Thom

**Westcoaster** · 02-02-2023, 11:50 PM

Originally Posted by bodywhomper

Working now to carve out time to insertification. Favorite solution for cleaning new BF’s inserts?

paint thinner. Heat em up to kick all the solvent off, a blow dryer works well.

**bodywhomper** · 02-04-2023, 04:29 PM

Thanks all. Using simple green cuz it is easier for me at the moment. Will use heat if I need.

**galibier_numero_un** · 02-05-2023, 11:24 AM

Originally Posted by bodywhomper

Thanks all. Using simple green cuz it is easier for me at the moment. Will use heat if I need.

For any of the recommended solvents, I'll use a small plastic jar, soak, agitate etc. Several refills with hot water to remove any schmutz, and done!

... Thom

**bodywhomper** · 02-11-2023, 08:12 PM

How deep do you all drilling and tapping? 9mm, 10mm?

**SoVT Joey** · 02-12-2023, 02:20 AM

Originally Posted by bodywhomper

How deep do you all drilling and tapping? 9mm, 10mm?

balls deep. Normally I stop before I see base material. Quit being cheap and go buy the right step bit from binding freedom or QK. Same goes with the helicoil guy above.

The depth is deeper then a 9mm depth of regular bits, you normally will drill all of the core down to the base material layer essentially.

**Alpinord** · 02-12-2023, 08:02 AM

Originally Posted by SoVT Joey

balls deep. Normally I stop before I see base material. Quit being cheap and go buy the right step bit from binding freedom or QK. Same goes with the helicoil guy above.

The depth is deeper then a 9mm depth of regular bits, you normally will drill all of the core down to the base material layer essentially.

This deep:

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“Both Quiver Killer and Binding Freedom inserts are nominally 9mm length x 8mm (5/16″) diameter. The actual diameters for both average 7.85 mm. The lengths QK inserts average 8.55 mm & the BF inserts average 9.15. This is a minor 0.6 mm average difference which may be important for some but inconsequential for most. A little deeper hole will fill with epoxy to nullify any voids.”

I’d argue against relying on the stepped 1/4” insert and heli-coil bits to stop. With a 5/16” shaft and 1/4” tip, you only net 1/32” of shoulder. So if you use the stepped bits, still use a stop for extra insurance.

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**Dan816** · 02-12-2023, 04:11 PM

Originally Posted by Alpinord

With a 5/16” shaft and 1/4” tip, you only net 1/32” of shoulder.

Exactly. It's not about being cheap, the stepped bits from qk/bf are inviting trouble. The shoulder of the bit is so insignificant that you definitely want a stop collar as well. At least that was my experience with the specialty bit for the stainless inserts so when it comes to the heli coils, I plan on just using my own bits+stop collar.

**Dan816** · 02-12-2023, 04:17 PM

Originally Posted by Alpinord

FTR, BF=SVST. Sourcing heli-coils and their tools gets spendy complicated vs simply using Binding Freedom/stainless steel inserts, IMO. YMMV.

Though I have a good memory, but it's short, IIRC, the heli-coils use a 1/4" drill bit. Not shown below, tap-ins use 5/16"/8mm drill bits:

Thanks for the heli-coil info. I do like the ss inserts a lot, but I figured if the hole size and thread pitch happened to match the bits and taps that I've got, it could be worth it.