Low end smith goggles.

[BiggC]

I'm looking for a pair of low-light goggles, and from what I understand Smith's "Sensor Mirror" lens is the one to get.

I'm trying to figure out which model frame to get. Apart from fit preference, would there be much performance (i.e fog) difference between say the more expensive Phenoms, and the cheaper Scopes or Transits?

[nickwm21]

If you wear a helmet... I would go to a shop and see which pair plays the nicest with your lid.

I dont think differences in fogging would be that big...

[Duker]

The big performance difference is that the lens in the high end stuff is spherical, or contoured like your eye ball. The scope is still a great goggle as far as its ability to vent and stay fog free. Its not a bad option of a light specific pair of goggles that you wont be using every day.

[gregL]

Sensor mirror?

All the world cup guys use clear - check the videos from the Munich parallel slalom. Get whatever cheap goggles you can find on SAC or DOG and clear lenses for them. Ability to resist fogging doesn't diminish in the cheap Smiths IME as long as you get double lenses and use an anti-fog cloth from time to time.

[Caucasian Asian]

I find that the Ignitor Mirror is better in low light than the Sensor Mirror

[Skidog]

im pretty happy with sensor mirror in all but the flattest light. I got the fuse cheap off SAC recently...keep an eye out on SAC and TRAM...Fuse isnt spherical but still good with fog/etc...

[jaobrien6]

I find that the Ignitor Mirror is better in low light than the Sensor Mirror

Interesting, I haven't ever used the ignitor mirror, but I'm surprised to hear you say that. Smith states that the ignitor is 35% light transmission vs 70% for the sensor mirror. Even if there's something about the ignitor that does better with contrast enhancement, that's a lot of additional light that the lens is blocking out.

[counterfeitfake]

Interesting, I haven't ever used the ignitor mirror, but I'm surprised to hear you say that. Smith states that the ignitor is 35% light transmission vs 70% for the sensor mirror. Even if there's something about the ignitor that does better with contrast enhancement, that's a lot of additional light that the lens is blocking out.

Yeah, I have both and I'm pretty sure I prefer the Sensor over the Ignitor in low/flat light. The Ignitor is rose and the Sensor is kind of yellow.

[teleposeur]

I had to ski in shitty rose lenses for a season, and they were almost better, or at least a good change from yellow/lowlight lenses, sometimes all that light can be a little blinding in flat conditions

[Steven S. Dallas]

High, overcast sky and you can't see shit because of glare/lack of contrast = flat light. Lack of sunlight because the sun's low in the sky or it's snowing or whatever = low light.

I like the Platinum lens for situation 1, Sensor for situation 2, and hope to use the Red Mirror lens as much as possible.

[AweShuksan]

High, overcast sky and you can't see shit because of glare/lack of contrast = flat light. Lack of sunlight because the sun's low in the sky or it's snowing or whatever = low light.

Sorry, but that's a poor definition of flat light and low light.

Low light refers to the brightness of the light (before the sun has risen or through thick snowfall and/or heavy overcast).

Flat light refers to low definition of three dimensional features due to the light being non-directional (such as during heavy snowfall with heavy overcast or during thick fog conditions where the fog layer has a lot of depth).

For many types of flat light conditions a colored goggle will not improve your depth perception much if at all. In most low light conditions combined with flat light a clear goggle is the best you're gonna get.

In bright flat light conditions caused by fog or falling snow a yellow or green goggle often works best for me. In falling snow or fog with medium bright light a light green or light yellow or even light pink can improve depth perception sometimes. I do not like the pink color much, it seems to make my legs feel less powerful.

In all cases one does not want the goggle to be darker than necessary to avoid eyestrain. The eye performs best when the pupil can be somewhat constricted (but not completely).

[Steven S. Dallas]

Low light refers to the brightness of the light (before the sun has risen or through thick snowfall and/or heavy overcast).

Flat light refers to low definition of three dimensional features due to the light being non-directional (such as during heavy snowfall with heavy overcast or during thick fog conditions where the fog layer has a lot of depth).

These descriptions vary wildly from the conditions that would be encountered in examples I gave. Wildly.

But whatever.

[adrenalated]

The big performance difference is that the lens in the high end stuff is spherical, or contoured like your eye ball. The scope is still a great goggle as far as its ability to vent and stay fog free. Its not a bad option of a light specific pair of goggles that you wont be using every day.

This. I'll add that the reason having a spherical lens is good is that your depth perception is better and a spherical lens does not distort your vision as much as a simple cylindrical lens does.

[The Reverend Floater]

I find that the Ignitor Mirror is better in low light than the Sensor Mirror

As empirically wrong as you are, you are definitely not alone. I have buddies who choose Ignitor over Sensor on storm days, for sure. As we all know, everybody's eyes are literally different and thus, not everything works for everyone. That said, the Sensor is hands-down the best storm day lens made today.

Steven--surprised that the Plat works for you on flat light. It's pretty dark--I prefer Ignitor to Platinum on all but the most bluebird, spring days.

Finally--then I'll pipe down--if you ski/snowboard or especially mountain bike in constantly changing light, i.e. DH'ing on a bike in and out of woods, give that Ignitor lens a try in your goggles or sunglasses. It's mind blowing how well it performs suddenly going from sunlight to shade, etc. I probably get more "wows" from that experience than anything else.

[Caucasian Asian]

Finally--then I'll pipe down--if you ski/snowboard or especially mountain bike in constantly changing light, i.e. DH'ing on a bike in and out of woods, give that Ignitor lens a try in your goggles or sunglasses. It's mind blowing how well it performs suddenly going from sunlight to shade, etc. I probably get more "wows" from that experience than anything else.

Maybe this is why I like it the best.

[Steven S. Dallas]

Steven--surprised that the Plat works for you on flat light.

Meant to say Ignitor.

[IslandSnow]

So, if you could only keep one lens between the Ignitor Mirror and the Sensor Mirror which one would you choose and why?
Also, lets say this would be your only lens other than a cheapo clear lens.

[jimmy page]

I have both the Ignitor and the Sensor. If I think that it will be cloudy or snowing all day then I go with the Sensor, but if it is sunny, I think that it might turn sunny later in the day, or I am just not sure what it is going to do weather wise then I go with the Ignitor.

If I had to pick just one I would go with the Ignitor. The reason being that it works pretty well in flat light and it also works well when it is sunny. The Sensor works well in flat light, but in my opinion allows to much light in when it is sunny, causing me to have to squint or shield my eyes as I am riding the chair or skiing.

Both of these lenses are in Phenoms and I think it is a great goggle, but if you are looking for a less expensive goggle then I would check out the Scope or for a little bit more the Stance, you can get both of them with the Ignitor or the Sensor lens.

[IslandSnow]

Thanks Jimmy, the Phenoms are the goggles I've decided on, now I just need to decide which lens to go with.
So it sounds like the Ignitor is pretty good at everything while the Sensor is very good at everything except is not adequate in bright sun.
Is the Ignitor noticeably better than the standard RC36 lens?
The majority of my days on the snow are in WA and the majority of those days are at Alpental/Snoqualmie, so I don't get a lot of bright sunny days.

[iggyskier]

I have I/Os now so can easily swap between the ignitor and sensor mirror, but I can say that living in the NW I am in the sensor probably 90+% of the time (not counting skiing in the spring when the platinum got brought out). My ignitor lenses don't get very much use up here...

[jimmy page]

Sorry, I should have mentioned that I am in Sun Valley. The sensor might be a better choice for NW skiing. Another thing to look into is one goggle, perhaps with the sensor, and an extra lens for when it is a sunny spring day.