Glenn Beck Says: No Proof of Evolution

[hutash]

Wait a minute. This is what you said in the thread i started addressing roughly the same thing. I even used this Beck example. I assume your statement was directed at me.

"I don't mind people with other values, as long as they are the same as mine."

Then you come start this thread which is bagging on Beck and others for having beliefs different from yours (and mine). How is this any different than what I ranted about?

HeHeHe...see post 54 on your thread

[XXX-er]

I am sure Canadians have their own clowns too. What I am trying to say, is I like it up there better, the people don't appear to be as fucking stupid as I am aware of in the US

I just want to poiny out that we are as fucking stupid as americans and y'all should just stay home cuz its crowded enough up here already eh?

[QuikR12]

I just want to poiny out that we are as fucking stupid as americans and y'all should just stay home cuz its crowded enough up here already eh?

Though you are a bit more insulated from political punditry, and bullshit than the average american.

Where in BC are ya? I once lived in Prince George when I was a wee little tyke.

[Dickeymotto]

Sorry Leroy, and I mean this in the kindest way, but you are fucking ignorant about evolution, and apparently physics as well.

There are buckets full of proof about evolution historically, observationally, and experimentally. There are books and books full of proofs if you bother to read them. I have. I can give specific examples if you need them, and write pages about it here, but I won't bore people with the details because it has been hashed out time and again.

Or go to the Geology/Zoology departments at almost any university and see the fossils for yourself (or the nearest museum of natural history). At the small university I attend, we have literally thousands, if not tens of thousands of specimens, which does not even represent a fraction of a percent of the total amount of accumulated evidence found. Hell, you can even go find them yourself. Find yourself a shale outcrop, start splitting slabs or sort through the already broken pieces. Some formations are not fossiliferous, but most of the time you'll find something within an hour.

[Jag]

Evolution is a fact.

Really?

Is the "Big Bang" also Fact ?

Considering the Big Bang theory defies all scientific logic, for every action there is a reaction. How could the Big Bang be the creation if nothing existed prior, what caused it?

If there is proof Humans killed off the last of the Neanderthal as scientists claim, then how could Humans be the ancestors of Neanderthal if they coexisted?

Apples & Oranges are fact, the rest is just theory.

[Dickeymotto]

If there is proof Humans killed off the last of the Neanderthal as scientists claim, then how could Humans be the ancestors of Neanderthal if they coexisted?

Obviously you don't know jack shit about the subject. Quit watching the discovery channel and go read a book.

[bennymac]

" You cannot reason people out of positions they didn't reason themselves into" - Bad Science by Ben Goldacre

[doughboyshredder]

Really?

Is the "Big Bang" also Fact ?

Considering the Big Bang theory defies all scientific logic, for every action there is a reaction. How could the Big Bang be the creation if nothing existed prior, what caused it?

If there is proof Humans killed off the last of the Neanderthal as scientists claim, then how could Humans be the ancestors of Neanderthal if they coexisted?

Apples & Oranges are fact, the rest is just theory.

simply amazing

[Triage]

When it comes to relativity and all sorts of other physical phenomena that defy direct observation, if you don't trust scientists, then how about the free market?

Since the theory of evolution forms the basis of the biological sciences, then the same can be said about modern medicine, especially when it comes to microbiology and genetics etc.

[XXX-er]

Though you are a bit more insulated from political punditry, and bullshit than the average american.

Where in BC are ya? I once lived in Prince George when I was a wee little tyke.

I got sat. TV just like the rest of the world so no problem tuning in Glen Beck ,I'm in Smithers now but I spent 10 yrs in PeeG but in any case y'all should stay down south ...its too crowded already up here

[powdork]

he also doesn't believe the first amendment spells out the separation of church and state.

[f2f]

JESUS WaS AN EXTRATERRESTRIAL!

[hutash]

^^^Actually that is exactly what the gnostic Christian believed.

[f2f]

sure they did. after all it's just a theory.

[grrrr]

Really?

Is the "Big Bang" also Fact ?

Considering the Big Bang theory defies all scientific logic, for every action there is a reaction. How could the Big Bang be the creation if nothing existed prior, what caused it?

If there is proof Humans killed off the last of the Neanderthal as scientists claim, then how could Humans be the ancestors of Neanderthal if they coexisted?

Apples & Oranges are fact, the rest is just theory.

You, sir, are not well informed or well read; nor do you have a solid grasp of what science is.

[hutash]

They problem of course is that is there is a failure to teach proper science in this country, part of which is due to idiotic school boards run by religious nutters, and if the like of Christine O'Donnell get elected, they will have even more power to teach rubbish.

I am appalled at the understanding of basic science in this country. This thread is a perfect example. Where as the intelligence level at TGR is generally quite high, the ignorance level in this thread is surprising. And we have not even heard from DBT, Rubi and Hawk yet.

edited for minor dyslexia, (but broad does apply to Christine O'Donnell)

[stuckathuntermtn]

Where does it say Humans committed genocide against Neanderthals? Is that a new theory? I must have missed that issue of National Geographic, or Smithsonian, or Discover. Or maybe you read it in Creation or some weird thing like that?

There are many theories as to why the Neanderthals died off, pretty much none of which includes mass murder. There are a few theories floating around that there may have been some inter breeding, but I'm not sure where you heard that we were their ancestors.

Jag, do you and Leroy take frequent trips to that "Creationist Museum" or whatever the fuck that thing is?

As far as the Big Bang goes, everything in the universe is accelerating away from everything else in infinite directions. What they can't really figure out is why it keeps going faster and faster, but there is plenty of evidence of a catastrophic explosion.

If you even bothered to get your facts right, maybe you'd understand better.

Find me the proof of any kind of higher being. Find me any proof of anything written in the Bible.

Thought not. You fucking tool.

[hutash]

Find me the proof of any kind of higher being. Find me any proof of anything written in the Bible.

Thought not. You fucking tool.

Even some marginally evidence would be interesting, but all they have is faith...that and and a dime will get you a cup of coffee.

[Tippster]

They problem of course is that is there is a failure to teach proper science in this country, part of which is due to idiotic school broads run by religious nutters, and if the like of Christine O'Donnel get elected, they will have even more power to teach rubish...

Fucking Broads.

[neck beard]

...they will have even more power to teach rubish.

That broad done not teached you right.

[ak_powder_monkey]

we did stop evolving, thanks to the agricultural revolution the ability for unfit individuals to reproduce has stopped it...

Also wouldn't a half man half monkey be basically a mountain gorilla?

[leroy jenkins]

no, you didnt

people have known for decades that newtons laws are a special case of relativistic physics, and for centuries that they dont apply in non-inertial reference frames

Well then they must have found another kind or something, because i did not just imagine reading an article somewhere recently talking about some shit like that. It was a recent article too.

And I dont mean on an atomic level, I remember it saying it was on a macro sscale level or some such thing.

Sorry Leroy, and I mean this in the kindest way, but you are fucking ignorant about evolution, and apparently physics as well.

There are buckets full of proof about evolution historically, observationally, and experimentally. There are books and books full of proofs if you bother to read them. I have. I can give specific examples if you need them, and write pages about it here, but I won't bore people with the details because it has been hashed out time and again. People like Beck, and apparently you, just haven't bothered to read or understand them. Evolution is as well established as the round earth theory, or the atomic theory. I personally have never seen the round earth, or an atom, but the evidence is irrefutable.

Evolution is of course different then natural selection. Evolution is change through time, while natural selection is a process that has partially made the change occur. Natural selection is the main driver, but there are other drivers as well, and no doubt more to be discovered. Again, there is ample proof of both evolution and natural selection.

Part of the problem is simply semantics. The word "theory" is greatly miss understood by people like Beck. In the vernacular theory is used to mean the same as a guess...e.g. my theory is Leroy is ignorant of evolution. In science this is better termed a hypothesis. I have made a statement based on certain assumption, and now I must find supporting evidence to accept/reject that assumption.

In science theory is used to describe an explanation that best fits are wide variety of facts, hence the germ theory of infection, or the atomic theory. No theory is absolute fact, because we are constantly refining the theory as data is accumulated. Simply stated there is no absolute. The atomic theory is constantly being refined, as is electromagnetism. Does this mean they are not proven? Of course not, it just means we understand them better.

Your example of Newton's theory of gravity is a perfect example. There are places in the universe were it does not apply, like at the beginning of time, the edges of the universe,in our own sun, and in every atom in our body. It has long been shown that Newton was correct, and his theory on gravity has withstood testing time and again. It is considered proven, that is until Einstein came along and proposed exceptions to Newton. Did this disprove Newton? No, it just modified the theory to function at a different scale, one that did not exist in Newton,s time. Einstein's modification of the theory has been proven, but yet again as more knowledge has been accumulated it was found to be inaccurate on a quantum scale. Did this disprove the theory? No, it was just refined it to work on a quantum scale, a scale that was just beginning to be understood in Einstein's time.

When people say evolution is just a theory, or that there is no proof because they have never seen a half monkey/man they are just showing there ignorance. Now I have nothing against ignorance, it is just lack of education or understanding, but I have a real problem when people like Beck, who unfortunately have a huge audience, use that ignorance to willfully influence others. If people like him do not understand something fine, they should either shut the fuck up, or make an effort to educate themselves.

I can respect people like Micheal Behe, Darwin's Black Box, who have presented intelligent arguments against evolution. He has made an effort to understand the discussion and proposed an alternative hypothesis, unfortunately he is wrong and his ideas rejected time and again, but he is not ignorant of the topic at hand.

Sorry for the long rant, but this tired diatribe against evolution gets my hackles up.

You're probably right that I'm ignorant, I'm ignorant about a lot of things. I defer to the man with the darwin headed monkey as an avatar.

Just to recap though, so, its still just a theory right? Like I said a very well developed and highly logical theory?

Also, I may not know a lot of things, but I know what the definition of a theory is, thanks though.

Where does it say Humans committed genocide against Neanderthals? Is that a new theory? I must have missed that issue of National Geographic, or Smithsonian, or Discover. Or maybe you read it in Creation or some weird thing like that?

There are many theories as to why the Neanderthals died off, pretty much none of which includes mass murder. There are a few theories floating around that there may have been some inter breeding, but I'm not sure where you heard that we were their ancestors.

Jag, do you and Leroy take frequent trips to that "Creationist Museum" or whatever the fuck that thing is?

As far as the Big Bang goes, everything in the universe is accelerating away from everything else in infinite directions. What they can't really figure out is why it keeps going faster and faster, but there is plenty of evidence of a catastrophic explosion.

If you even bothered to get your facts right, maybe you'd understand better.

Find me the proof of any kind of higher being. Find me any proof of anything written in the Bible.

Thought not. You fucking tool.

Talk about a fucking non sequiter, what does any of that have to do with what I said? I wasnt advocating creationism for a second.

Considering how much certain people in this thread are commenting on other people's ignorance, those same people sure are making a lot of assumptions.



Also, not directed at anyone in this thread, but if you arent fond of religions, dont turn science into one.

[stuckathuntermtn]

Even some marginally evidence would be interesting, but all they have is faith...that and and a dime will get you a cup of coffee.

Faith with a capital F, which is significantly different than faith with a lowercase f.

Well then they must have found another kind or something, because i did not just imagine reading an article somewhere recently talking about some shit like that. It was a recent article too.

And I dont mean on an atomic level, I remember it saying it was on a macro sscale level or some such thing.



You're probably right that I'm ignorant, I'm ignorant about a lot of things. I defer to the man with the darwin headed monkey as an avatar.

Just to recap though, so, its still just a theory right? Like I said a very well developed and highly logical theory?

Also, I may not know a lot of things, but I know what the definition of a theory is, thanks though.



Talk about a fucking non sequiter, what does any of that have to do with what I said? I wasnt advocating creationism for a second.

Considering how much certain people in this thread are commenting on other people's ignorance, those same people sure are making a lot of assumptions.



Also, not directed at anyone in this thread, but if you arent fond of religions, dont turn science into one.

You posted some bullshit against evolution or something they posted about how you read this article you didn't understand. You repeatedly prove you are ignorant and an asshole about it.

[f2f]

Well then they must have found another kind or something, because i did not just imagine reading an article somewhere recently talking about some shit like that. It was a recent article too.

And I dont mean on an atomic level, I remember it saying it was on a macro sscale level or some such thing.

you may have read something about the Pioneer probes slowing down at the edge of the solar system -- an unexpected, very minute slow down so far unexplained successfully and not predicted by plain old newtonian gravity. this isn't new, the effect just gets republished every few years as a new paper aiming to explain it is published. here's something from 2003 that probably sounds just the same (if not less dumbed down -- things have changed online since 2003): http://discovermagazine.com/2003/oct/cover/

you don't disprove newton's theory by a single digit change several slots to the right of the decimal point. you disprove it by throwing yourself towards the earth and missing it.

[leroy jenkins]

You posted some bullshit against evolution or something.

I did nothing of the sort. I made a simple statement distinguishing proof from theory.

The point was not that evolution doesnt exist, and it wasnt about agreeing with glen beck for fucks sake. It was about reminding people to take science with a grain of salt as well.

For someone that rants about ignorance, you sure make stupid assumptions.


F2F, that kind of rings a bell, but i want to say it was about something else, like the newtonian laws not applying was more of a side story, god i wish i could remember, I also want to say it was about somewhere far outside our solar system, so I guess its all theoretical anyways.

Sorry guys, I've been meaning to get my "for use in future TGR debate" article filing cabinet in order, but its such a mess.