skiing in Japan

[huzieiii11]

Trying to put together a trip to Japan in February and was wondering if anyone on here has been there. We're looking to go to Niseko and wanted to get some beta on the area. Trying to get info about flights both international and domestic once we arrive as well as lodging info once were in Niseko. I've looked at a few of the travel sights that come up when doing a search for skiing in japan but would prefer some advice from some people who have actually been there. We are looking for something a step above Youth hostels but well below Four seasons style shit. Any info is greatly appreciated. Hit me at my normal email addy if you can help. huzieiii11@gmail.com cheers. James"huzie" hughes

[Mike Pow]

Loads of info if you search.

Where you starting from? How long for? How many people? etc etc

The more you tell us, the easier it is to help.

[StuntCok]

There is no skiing here. Just computer factories set along side ancient castles with geisha girls and vending machines with schoolgirl panties.

[regct]

vending machines with schoolgirl panties.

...really?

[neck beard]

Trying to get info about flights both international and domestic once we arrive

You can't even find info about getting a flight out of your own country?

And you want all that help sent to your private email address?

And you didn't even bother to search?

Stay at home.

[RiderX]

LOL Hohes. You're a PR guru.

To the OP. Search function JONG.

[neck beard]

1234567

[rfoubi]

I was just thinking of posting a similar thread, and i have been search function jonging my way around the japan infos and there is lots of good stuff on here, but i had a few questions as well. As far as places to be based out of to tour, any advice?

We are gonna try and tour as much as possible, hopefully stay somewhere not too expensive on hokkaido, and preferably be close enough to some resorts to hit up slackcountry/inbounds every now and then. Obviously stoked to check out some touristy/cultural/ non skiing shit as well. And hot springs! Oh yeah, and how anal are the resorts about OB skiing? Do you actually have to be poaching to hit all the tree runs? We are gonna be over a couple weeks. Im guessing a car is pretty key for this? Probably a stupid question, but is there any way to pull off sleeping in parking lots, etc if we have to? I do it all the time in NA, but am fully jongified as far as japan goes. Otherwise Does anyone know of specific hostels/guesthouses/whatever that can be recommended?

Sorry for all the questions, and thanks for any help at all, even links to threads i may have missed in my searching.

thanks TGR

[neck beard]

Hokkaido touring: you will have some fun around Tokachi (not a township, no lifts, one great inexpensive lodge at the trailhead, you bring and cook your own food) and Asahidake (one tram, no township at all, a few lodges). Both are in the same mtn range, 50 minutes drive apart (?). Furano is the closest "major" ski hill. Buses run from there to both Tokachi and Asahi. A car is useful.

I have slept in the carpark a few times at Tokachi and Asahi. There are very good onsens there (volcanic hotsprings). It will be cold.

There is also lots of relatively gentle touring near Niseko, incredible tree skiing, rolling terrain and some open sugar loaf ridges. You might typically need a car to get what ever start point you choose, or to get picked up from your end point. I am not an expert on routes in that area. But expect some classic touring terrain, a bit dull if you are a big hitter, but mindblowing powder. If you do not get a boot deep top up every 24-36 hours, ask for your money back.

[Mike Pow]

What Hohes said, and

great touring from the 'resorts' of Kurodake and Kiroro

[Canada Guy]

Sorry to threadjack here but I'm booked into the Black Diamond lodge for the week of Feb 21 to 28th however I will be flying into Tokyo the week before.

Does anyone have any advice on some mountains/resorts that I should hit up while on Honshu on my way to Hokkaido?

I have done some searching/reading about the Hakuba area and it seems like the terrain is quite a bit larger there than Niseko so it seems like a decent option. I plan to do both touring and lift access so any advice regarding either is appreciated.

Hopefully the OP will find some of the replies to this useful as well.

[rfoubi]

Yeah from what i read, Hakuba has sick steep terrain, but its harder to duck ropes? (Does anyone know about actual BC. Like are there gates from the ski hills to get to true BC as opposed to tree runs inbounds) and NIseko is more expensive and flatter, but gets amazing snow?

[Canada Guy]

Yeah from what i read, Hakuba has sick steep terrain, but its harder to duck ropes? (Does anyone know about actual BC. Like are there gates from the ski hills to get to true BC as opposed to tree runs inbounds) and NIseko is more expensive and flatter, but gets amazing snow?

I'm also interested in finding out more about the rules of ducking ropes. It seems like some resorts have no problem with it and some are much more stringent.

I have found a lot of good info on skiing in Japan here:
http://www.snowjapan.com

But I haven't found too much specifically on the rules regarding out of bounds. (I'm so used to the Canadian Rockies where you can duck out anywhere you want.)

[StuntCok]

Snowjapan has become a bit of a joke after banning everyone who had any knowledge or opinion. Poachninja.com is more BC oriented and most posters are Hakuba oriented.

Out of bounds rules vary from resort to resort with 47/Goryu VERY strict on inbound ropes and Happo less so (there are more resorts further down the road with their own rules as well). All the big resorts allow you to use the lifts to hike out of the resort into the true BC. Hohes runs an English speaking guiding service so that is an option as well.

[satori]

I'm also interested in finding out more about the rules of ducking ropes. It seems like some resorts have no problem with it and some are much more stringent.

I have found a lot of good info on skiing in Japan here:
http://www.snowjapan.com

But I haven't found too much specifically on the rules regarding out of bounds. (I'm so used to the Canadian Rockies where you can duck out anywhere you want.)

As far as ducking ropes go, you can basically ski Niseko, Moiwa, Rusutu, Kiroro, and Teine from top to bottom. At Niseko now they have gates which will allow you to access the SC, if theyre closed, then its because patrol says avi conditions are high. Usually everybody and their grandmother are out them. Kiroro is supposed to have the best terrain in the area, so my mates and I are going to check it out this winter.

[neck beard]

Kiroro is supposed to have the best terrain in the area, so my mates and I are going to check it out this winter.

Kiroro has nice touring terrain, but if it is the best in the area then the area is on hard times! The lift co. terrain is incredibly flat and dull, a whole new level of dull Japanese terrain in some areas.

Satori, if you go to Kiroro here is some beta that badly needs a map and at least one reference to a compass: gondola top then over the rope next to the red skull and cross bones KEEP OUT sign in two languages, across the wide flats to climbers right, up a rounded head via a defined windlip. From that "peak", look around. As you are looking towards Niseko, and from memory a nice short steep flute line in the distance, try slight skiers left into a bowl (corniced at the top and looked like an obvious start zone to me with a narrow gully slide path). You can then link that with another gully by climbing an intermediate ridge on skiers right of the line you just skied, ski the gully (I saw plenty of sled tracks at the bottom), then climb again up to the left behind the first head peak you climbed, then look for a reeeally long traverse up and across further round in a clockwise direction (forget it on a snowboard). It is not easy to find the entry to the traverse and you will cross at least one serious slide path from memory, finish with an ok run back into the gondola base station. Starting from the gondola top, you generally are moving in a clockwise direction on each ascent.

Here is the windlip ridge you climb from the gondola. The lightly treed face runs down toward the ski area and a huge flat bench that I think was called Kotatsu for obvious reasons.


The name of the hill, with Niseko in the distance
http://lh5.ggpht.com/_e-9-s0CE-kI/TI...0/P4180275.JPG

And a much, much, much better place to spend you time and effort in Hokkaido. Not sure when the access road open though, and it would be a very long trip without it. In spring it is a fit person's day trip from Sapporo. There is a hut at the trail head (fireplace, drop toilet)

[fattwins]

The BC rules around Hakuba are much the same as Canada. Once you leave the resort youare on your own and asume all the risks. There are no real gates but the access points are pretty easy to find at the top.


Areas where the Signage is good sort of like a gate for BC
top lift at Goryu
top lift at happo
half way up the top pitch of tsugaike mid winter (march there is a tram)

Areas where the Signage is crap for BC
norikura a bit tricky more tricky
Cortina there is and are some points but hard to explain (note most of cortina is now open and fully patrolled for great tree sking).
Iwatake there is and are some points but hard to explain (big slide paths)
Sun Alpina I have no knowledge
Hakuba highland for noboarding just hike the old gelende

[rfoubi]

Ok sweet, i was just afraid that they wouldnt let you use the ski hills to get to any BC. Thats sweet. I heard about a points pass or something, that sounds like a touring pass for the lifts. as in, a cheap pass that allows you to ride once and use the lift to get to the alpine. Anyone know which resorts have a system like this?

And as far as inbounds trees, you mention cortina is all open now? I take it this means most are not? Id just like to not bother buying lift tix for a place if you cant ski trees without having to feel like a poacher.

Anyway thanks for the help guys, im looking forward to it so much!

[StuntCok]

47 Goryu, Happo, Tsugaike, and Norikura all have points passes.

[neck beard]

And as far as inbounds trees, you mention cortina is all open now? I take it this means most are not? Id just like to not bother buying lift tix for a place if you cant ski trees without having to feel like a poacher.

- Hakuba Goryu/47 will treat you like a poacher, or worse. And that will frustrate you because the trees look good. They have CCTV in strategic spots.

- Happo will treat you tough if you poach one or two inbounds areas, and then in others they probably will not care at all if history is any indication. But a lot of the trees in Happo are only so-so IMHO.

- Tsugaike will come down on you hard if you hit the obvious tasty stuff. They also have CCTV. They will probably turn a blind eye or not even know for the less than obvious stuff. Which is very good.

- Cortina is pretty much all good to go.

As for hiking from the sanctioned bc gates: a one-up ride will cost about 1500 yen, varies between ski areas. As CuntStok said, Tsugaike, Happo, Goryu, Norikura, and Cortina all have these point passes.

Ridge hike Hakuba slackcountry...


...and a little further along the ridge.


No lift ticket required:

[Loon]

Nothing to see here, move along.

[neck beard]

Much better in Niseko or Rusutsu or Kiroro or Furano, Hokkaido. Move along.

[fattwins]

Happo for me has it all. Although the signs say that you cant ski the trees there are more trees at happo than at most resorts I have been to. the trees at Happo are really under rated with quite a few unknown rarely skied pillow lines. On a weekend the BC whether dangerous or not will be busy.

Goryu/47 have great potential but that is all that it is. With a strict system in place a seasons pass holder is bound to get busted. One day certain trees will open that pose no danger to the lifts or the cat tracks below. When this happens Goryu and 47 will be quite possibly the best resort in Japan for freeriders. The ridges that climb above and branch off of these resorts are not for low angle decents. Most everything is 35 degrees or more. Also the decents towards Happo can expose you to large avalanche paths. If you arent thinking about them before you ski down you shouldnt be there.

Tsugaike has great trees but the patrol are quite anal about anything off the SE aspects of the resorts. This area slid onto a cat track killing people. 4 to 5 years ago there was much more traffic on these slopes but expect to have the book thrown at you if you get caught there. There are other areas that can be poached though and the patrol will 95% of the time let it slide. The plus side to Tsugaike is the touring terrain that rises above the resort. Shorter decents than most of the other resorts but a much better touring mountain with options. you can hit steep or safe mellow areas many of which are rarely skied untill spring. Some tours can be long but most people can yoyo a few good areas. When the snow in Hakuba is going a bit bad there is usually something to be skied somewhere above Tsugaike. I would hire a guide or at least trust someone enough to help you find some of the nicer routes. Some true classic Hakuba runs.

[rfoubi]

- Hakuba Goryu/47 will treat you like a poacher, or worse. And that will frustrate you because the trees look good. They have CCTV in strategic spots.

- Happo will treat you tough if you poach one or two inbounds areas, and then in others they probably will not care at all if history is any indication. But a lot of the trees in Happo are only so-so IMHO.

- Tsugaike will come down on you hard if you hit the obvious tasty stuff. They also have CCTV. They will probably turn a blind eye or not even know for the less than obvious stuff. Which is very good.

- Cortina is pretty much all good to go.

As for hiking from the sanctioned bc gates: a one-up ride will cost about 1500 yen, varies between ski areas. As CuntStok said, Tsugaike, Happo, Goryu, Norikura, and Cortina all have these point passes.

Ridge hike Hakuba slackcountry...


...and a little further along the ridge.


No lift ticket required:

Cool man, although the CCTV tree poaching thing seems gnarly. Im guessing with all the snow they are worried about people setting off avis in the trees? Or just dont want people falling in tree wells? OR? Anyway I am just super stoked to be able to pay $20, ride the lifts to the alpine, and just tour the BC/SC all day. That terrain looks super fun. And from the looks of it, you could take the lifts up, hike up even higher, and then ski all the way down to the valley outside the ski area boundary (and therefor not at risk from big brother CCTV lose your pass?)

That last pic you posted, im guessing thats touring off a pass or something? Im guessing to tour anything thats not off ski areas, a car would be a must? We were probably thinking of skiing hakuba area for a week with no car, and then maybe renting something, and checking out some road access BC and other sights/resorts/onsen in the area.


Thanks everyone for all the detailed replies, its been a huge help so far.

One more thing, cheaper accom, any hints? Looking for a shared room ideally with 3-4 of us.

[RiderX]

Fattwins, who has already posted a few times in this thread, has a lodge in Hakuba.

http://www.hakubapowderlodging.com/index.html