4FRNT Renegade ~ Hand built in SLC.

[Tailwind]

I’ve been bummed by the current generation... I’m 5% tempted by the 191 but not nearly enough to buy a pair.

So it does sound like updates are in the works?

Haha it’s just a proto I got a hold of, full maple core 2400g per ski.

It’s an awesome layup, feels like a jski so great for inbounds, hopefully with the new renegade updates coming next year they do something similar. The renegade deserves a layup that can charge.

Attachment 355716

[altacoup]

^^^^

I’ve seen some 4frnt athletes skiing on some prototype renegades recently at Alta. Shape looks more like OG renegades but I haven’t fondled them. Also conditions haven’t been very renegade friendly here this winter, so I’m curious as to how they’ve been enjoying the proto types in the firm and bumps. Really glad I’ve managed to hoard 3 pair of HALS construction rens in the closet plus 2 in the rotation. Best ski ever and the only ski I could never be without


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[dub2]

^^^^

I’ve seen some 4frnt athletes skiing on some prototype renegades recently at Alta. Shape looks more like OG renegades but I haven’t fondled them. Also conditions haven’t been very renegade friendly here this winter, so I’m curious as to how they’ve been enjoying the proto types in the firm and bumps. Really glad I’ve managed to hoard 3 pair of HALS construction rens in the closet plus 2 in the rotation. Best ski ever and the only ski I could never be without


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IIRC I think I remember 4frnt talking about a possible update to the EHP, might be what some of those protos are.

[altacoup]

That’s kind of what I was hoping for when I saw they were skiing prototypes. But they’re full reverse camber and say renegade on them. Really I’d love if 4frnt just rereleased the ehp with no changes at all. Not as good in pow as renegades but more versatile on non pow days

[Mustonen]

Agh.... indecision. Was ready to pull the trigger on some new Rens, but now I’m just lusting after Pretzel’s pair and thinking I should wait to see what 2021 brings.

[mr_pretzel]

Agh.... indecision. Was ready to pull the trigger on some new Rens, but now I’m just lusting after Pretzel’s pair and thinking I should wait to see what 2021 brings.

I don’t know what the updates will be or if they will introduce the heavy core to the new one, I’m guessing they wont

[Mustonen]

I don’t know what the updates will be or if they will introduce the heavy core to the new one, I’m guessing they wont

You should sell me yours. What’s your BSL?

[tang]

I thought they beefed these back up after the whole bastard rens thing (like to 2200 or so) but the website shows 2045 grams per... is that the current? And the bastards were way lighter than that?!

[HAB]

I thought they beefed these back up after the whole bastard rens thing (like to 2200 or so) but the website shows 2045 grams per... is that the current? And the bastards were way lighter than that?!

Blister's measured weight on the 191s is more like 2200g. I think 4FRNTs stated weights are on the light side.

[tupp_]

New heavier layup looks interesting!

Saw the 4frnt sale on renegades today and pulled the trigger on a 184 (w/ shifts?) to compliment my old 1st gen 186’s (dukes). We will see how they compare when they arrive.

If anyone has skied them would still love input on how the new lightweight design handles. Thanks!

[tang]

Blister's measured weight on the 191s is more like 2200g. I think 4FRNTs stated weights are on the light side.

Got it, thank ya

[Dshack89]

I'm a big dude and love my 196 rens. My wife is due for a new powder setup and the 184s are tempting. She's 5'10" and generally is on 178ish skis and I'm wondering if the 184 measures / skis on the shorter side and might work for her. I see where blister measured the 191s at 189 so maybe 184 = 182?

Thoughts?

[Supermoon]

Reverse camber always skis a bit shorter anyway. For a powder ski I prefer a bit more length anyway, but really depends on what your wife wants in a ski.

[4FRNT_Skis]

We are indeed hammering some new prototypes right now...they don't say Renegades on them tho 😳

[dub2]

We are indeed hammering some new prototypes right now...they don't say Renegades on them tho 

Don't reply if it is an EHP update...

[altacoup]

Please no update! Pretty please. Just allow me to buy a pair of 186 ehps like god demands. I’ve got 2 193s but my 186 is shot. Also please don’t make me hoard my HALS construction renegades. THE GREATEST SKI EVER. Please make more. You have the power to make the ski world right. And please bring back 194 devastator. And if you really want to be the greatest ski company of all time. Shock the world and remake the spatula!

[LSeed]

Finally got the bindings in the mail for my new Ibex renegades. They had a pretty low stated weight on them so i was pretty excited to have an extra fat charger touring ski.
Holy shit, at least by hand weighing they weigh less then my 2017 hoji's and yet are stiffer feeling in flex and phattys.(That being said i now have about 60 days on the hoji's and they were purchased used)

I definitely feel like they will ski different then my OJ Owl renegades but I'll be taking the new setup out tomorrow and will report back, maybe I'll even get a chance to ski the owls/these ones side by side inbounds. Pretty damn amped.

[tupp_]

^^ What bindings did you put on them?

Trying to decide between shifts and a tech binding... Shocked at how soft these are in the tails compared to my white room renegades.

[Robik]

Just mounted mine with Tecton 12. I think it's a perfect match for my intended purpose.

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[mtbkr]

I have a Quiver Question I was hoping the members who follow this thread might be able to help me with.
I apologize in advance if I'm hijacking the intended purpose of this thread. I guess my ponderings below can be summed up to: "How do the new 191 Rens ski powder and variable backcountry conditions compared to the OG Rens and compared to a Praxis Protest?"

My situation:
- Have 193 Atomic Automatic 117s with Kingpins as my daily driver. (Mounted around +2.5). I'm happy with these as a daily resort driver, (Lake Louise, Kicking Horse, Revelstoke,) as I don't typically hit the resort unless conditions are at least soft or there is new snow. When there hasn't been new snow for a while it's touring only for me.
- Have 196 Praxis Protests with Dynafits as my dedicated touring ski. (Longer tours, hut trips, Rogers Pass, etc.)
- I've always wanted to try the OG Ren and nearly pulled the trigger numerous times. Recently I picked up a pair of 191, (blemish,) Rens which are sitting in my basement waiting for bindings.

I love the Protests and when conditions are deep, man are they an amazing pow ski. So loose and surfy with tons of float. Love that I can throw them sideways at high speed and that they carry my 175lbs of bacon with speed and confidence.
BUT - in firm backcountry conditions, (i.e. windslab,) they are a pain as any 128mm waisted ski probably would be. They also seem to particularly suck when it's dust-on-crust.
The dynafit setup has these limited to being a BC only setup as I'm too scared to charge on these on a deep day at the resort. (I know Dynafits are durable but on a 128mm waisted ski there is a lot of force on them when skiing hard conditions.) I do worry a little about them when side-hilling on steep hard stuff in the backcountry too.

My initial thought, (Option 1):
- Keep Atomic Automatics as daily driver and can use them touring on firmer days and for sidecountry missions.
- Sell the Protest Setup to fund bindings for the Rens, (Kingpin/Tecton/Shift) so these can become my go-to touring ski and can be used on deeper days at the resort instead of the Automatics for that extra level of pow fun. The Rens would hopefully be more versatile in a variety of backcountry snow conditions than the Protests. (Think week-long backcountry hut trip where I can only bring one ski and could encounter anything from crust to slab to spring conditions to super deep blower...)

Option 2:
- Maybe I'm foolish to be swapping Protests for new Rens. Do I simply sell the Rens and my Dynafits and put a more versatile pin binding on the Protests? Then I have a deep pow ski for both the backcountry AND the resort. In this case I rely on the Automatics for firmer days in the backcountry. Maybe when they wear out I exchange them for a Raven. (A topic for another day...)

Option 3:
- Sell the 191 Rens and the 196 Protests and look for an OG 196 Renegade on which to mount Kingpins/Tectons/Shifts.
(I've done my best to become a pretty technical skier despite not having a race background. With that said I'm not totally sure I'm man-enough to commit to OG 196s when the seemingly more laid-back 191 Rens might be enough for 175lb me and might be easier on the legs without compromising too much on the characteristics that the loyal Renegade followers love.)

Option 4:
- Do nothing because skiing the backcountry on a very light Protest/Dynafit setup is pretty cool and the Automatics can realistically handle any resort conditions and are still a decently fun pow ski on those magical deep resort days.

Option 5:
- Something completely different that I'm not thinking of that someone on here can hopefully recommend.

Thanks All!!

[mr_pretzel]

I don’t think the new ren skis chopped up snow well, it’s a blast in fresh snow, but doesn’t ski like the old one.
I also think you will find it lacking at high speeds coming from a 196 protest as it will feel quite a bit shorter unless you would appreciate that.
It definitely works well as a BC ski, but if you’re looking for something to also use in the resort it isn’t really it in my opinion.

You definitely shouldn’t be afraid of the old 196 ren, if you lug around the 196 protest you will have no issue with the big ren. It actually sounds like that would be a good way for you to go as they will be a bit more versatile than your protests, but still ski pow like rocketships.

Although I’d say since you already have them it would almost be a shame to not give them a shot as you might really enjoy them as a backcountry ski.

[Mustonen]

I don’t think the new ren skis chopped up snow well, it’s a blast in fresh snow, but doesn’t ski like the old one.
I also think you will find it lacking at high speeds coming from a 196 protest as it will feel quite a bit shorter unless you would appreciate that.
It definitely works well as a BC ski, but if you’re looking for something to also use in the resort it isn’t really it in my opinion.

You definitely shouldn’t be afraid of the old 196 ren, if you lug around the 196 protest you will have no issue with the big ren. It actually sounds like that would be a good way for you to go as they will be a bit more versatile than your protests, but still ski pow like rocketships.

Although I’d say since you already have them it would almost be a shame to not give them a shot as you might really enjoy them as a backcountry ski.

Interesting. I don’t think the OG ren skis chopped snow very well. You can definitely carry speed through whatever crap you encounter, but you can’t ever relax and lack of suspension makes for a lively ride. ETA: don’t get me wrong, I love them in chopped snow, but I wouldn’t describe them as a good ski for that to somebody else.

I just mounted up my new 191 ibex last night (thanks IAS for the jig), and hopefully if/when we get some snow this winter I can compare and contrast.

Agreed that the 196 shouldn’t scare you. It’s a loose ski. It can be a lot to handle in tight spaces and it isn’t light, but it isn’t going to punish you that much if you like big skis. In some ways it’s a little less work than the 186 at speed in chopped snow or hard snow.

[LSeed]

ATK Freeraider 2.0's So a good mix of burly but light, wont be using this as a resort ski

I found the OG rens were definitely a full on ski, have some of my gnarliest straightlines in recent memory done on them mawking at insanse speeds into mogul town at KH and they held up. I would not expect the same anymore at the resort with the new Ren's but I feel like they marketed them so hard as a BC pow ski the light weight will definitely encourage me to bring them with me for some pillow sending.
For reference I ski BC for the most part on 187 4frnt Hoji's on the Hoji Tour Im 5 foot 3 and 160lbs
In the resort I ski mostly entirely on OG Blizzard Bodacious 197cm w/world cup langs from 2008 and love it. 2 totally different beasts for different missions not a fan of half n half setups personally. Id rather buy a cheaper used resort setup that i'll most likely fuck up on rocks and shit and spend some extra $$ on lightweight gear for the BC.

[Supermoon]

I’ve spent considerable time on the 186 and 196 Rens. If it were me I’d want the HOJI instead of a Ren for a 1-ski backcountry setup with something like Shifts if it was going to be a deep-day resort ski too.

As has been said, the Ren is a great ski when it’s deep and is also a good ski in chop if you are willing to go balls out all the time. It’s down right hard to ski them slowly through that stuff at times. They are also wider than I’d want in a dicey side hill situation or having to navigate down an icy chute somewhere.

I would personally keep the protests, mount the RENs with Shifts and then get something that’s like 100-110 underfoot for a do-it-all backcountry ski. Maybe the Backland 107 if you like your automatics.

[strange meadow lark]

Here a two minor points (I have not skied 196 Protest, or 196/191 Ren FWIW).

1. You say one of the main reasons to switch from protest to ren as your main pow-touring ski are tough BC conditions (windslab/crust etc). From what I have skied, the hoji-line skis handle these conditions better than anything I have skied. I like them even more than R/R because you have consistent edge-hold if you need it if you are on a really hard surface. It's a perfect combination of a smooth release that is impossible to hook/grab but still a relatively long and powerful edge. I ski OG 186 Rens backcountry and 187 Hojis for the resort. I have new Ravens to mount but Vermont is a snow desert right now, so I haven't had a chance to try the new construction. I think my experience would hold up for the 191's--the Hoji's flex might make it closer to the new Ren and my Hoji's are very close to the old Rens in these conditions. It is the variable snow performance that got me hooked on these and I just about only ski hoji designs now outside of skinny rock skis.

2) This has probably been debated at length on here, and I'll try not to beat a dead horse. You are clearly comfortable w/ pin bindings at the resort to a point, but if it were me, I would really try and think about what I was going to use the new Rens for and how important having that 50/50 ski is for you. I would either go with an ATK/vipec/etc for near exclusive use touring or put a Shift on if its a 50/50 ski. That use case is what the shift (or Cast) is for. Its not about what Kingpins/tectons are capable of, or durability--its consistent releases. A bunch of resort laps are just that many more times that inconsistent release/prerelease behavior can occur.

Personally I would mount your Rens with a light touring binding and then find a beat pair of older rens/hojis/bodacious etc with alpine bindings (or just find a cheap pair of alpine bindings to throw on the Protests and switch over?)