Excavation question, how would you remove 90 Cubic feet?

[basinbeater]

I am planning a paver patio in the back yard, and it is going to be 180sqft. So I need to dig out about 6 or 7 inches deep to place gravel and then sand for the base. So my question to the collective is, how would you remove that dirt? It has grass, and after three or four digs with a shovel, there has to be a better way. The spot is 14'x12'. Thanks for any good ideas!

[OSECS]

I am planning a paver patio in the back yard, and it is going to be 180sqft. So I need to dig out about 6 or 7 inches deep to place gravel and then sand for the base. So my question to the collective is, how would you remove that dirt? It has grass, and after three or four digs with a shovel, there has to be a better way. The spot is 14'x12'. Thanks for any good ideas!

1. Rent a bobcat

2. rent a roto tiller

3. hire a crew of laborers

4. have a son and wait till he turns 13 or 14 then give him the chore

[Corest to the Morest]

[krp8128]

I just did this this morning. Not quite as deep, but essentially 3 spots, 24x8, 14x6 and 2x14. Give or take, it was 304 sq feet about 4" deep, or just over 100 cubic feet. In the end 196 16x16 pavers are going down. Digging was grass, an inch or two of topsoil then clay/pebbles. Shovel and wheelborrow only.

You could rent some type of excavator or tractor, but that's too much hassle for a small spot IMHO.

EDIT: Better dims and a pic of the space:



We laid down 127 tiles after digging this morning, realized we were short by 40 and called it a day. PITA getting the drainage and heights right to meet up with the stairs and the door. The owner didn't want to tamp the sand before we laid them down, it would have made a huge difference. later this week we are going to run a tamper over everything and level out a few tiles. 196 total....

[krp8128]

Oh, if the ground is hard wet it down first.

[mac19]

rent a bobcat mt52 walk behind loader for a few hours. check it out on youtube it's what you need most likel

[OSECS]

Wetting the ground just makes the dirt heavier and the job messier. ...... personal experience.

The roto tiller works great and rents for about $40 a day, get a good wheel barrow !!!

[krp8128]

Wetting the ground just makes the dirt heavier and the job messier. ...... personal experience.

The roto tiller works great and rents for about $40 a day, get a good wheel barrow !!!

True, depending on the soil. The clay get's hard as a rock when it is dry, there is a lot of iron in the soil.


Other then manning up, the tiller sounds like the best idea.

[ectreeskier11]

you should hire a hard working ski bum in need of money like myself. you've got my number .

[basinbeater]

Allright, so Sod cutter, followed by roto tiller. Maybe even just two passes with the sod cutter, and bingo, that's as deep as I will need to go. Next question is, what do I do with all the dirt and grass (shitty grass) that I want to get rid of? Dump? neighbors yard? Maybe the dump. Or go for the neighborhoods biggest ever spring cleanup pickup on the street. Neighbors will love that!
Also, any mags ever buy gravel and pavers in SL? Where did you go and why? Thanks for the input so far guys, helpful stuff.

[OSECS]

Allright, so Sod cutter, followed by roto tiller. Maybe even just two passes with the sod cutter, and bingo, that's as deep as I will need to go. Next question is, what do I do with all the dirt and grass (shitty grass) that I want to get rid of? Dump? neighbors yard? Maybe the dump. Or go for the neighborhoods biggest ever spring cleanup pickup on the street. Neighbors will love that!
Also, any mags ever buy gravel and pavers in SL? Where did you go and why? Thanks for the input so far guys, helpful stuff.

Make sure you rent a compactor to get a good level and consistent base. I did this job a year or two ago. The compactor makes for a much better finished job.

I compacted after putting the rock dust down, and then compacted after the sand. The porous nature of the paver joints means water will collect at the lowest spots and eventually make the pavers settle unevenly.

[Core Shot]

I need to dig out about 6 or 7 inches deep


after three or four digs with a shovel, there has to be a better way.

The spot is 14'x12'.

you=weak

seriously. you are thinking about renting a sod cutter, roto-tiller and compactor for a small paver patio??

get a clue. and hire someone that is not afraid of working.

the only tool that makes sense is the compactor for the stone dust base before you put down the pavers.
rototiller is stupid.
sod cutter is overkill.

bobcat is beyond stupid, unless of course you already own one.

Living in SLC, I'm guessing there are enough mexicans in the area to do your entire job for the same amount of dough you are planning on spending on tool rental and dirt removal.

[krp8128]

you=weak

seriously. you are thinking about renting a sod cutter, roto-tiller and compactor for a small paver patio??

get a clue. and hire someone that is not afraid of working.

the only tool that makes sense is the compactor for the stone dust base before you put down the pavers.
rototiller is stupid.
sod cutter is overkill.

bobcat is beyond stupid, unless of course you already own one.

Living in SLC, I'm guessing there are enough mexicans in the area to do your entire job for the same amount of dough you are planning on spending on tool rental and dirt removal.

yes.

See my post for comments on compactor, and rent one. I was staying PC so I didn't mention the mexican option...

[Tippster]

1. Go to Home Depot

2. Hire crew

3. Open Beer

I don't do two things: Dig or Paint. Both are awful on your back and my back is my living. There is money saved and money well spent, and I know which is which.

[Pinner]

Shovel.

Or what Tipp said. Not because of back issues, so much as on the principle of the thing.

[basinbeater]

I am actually going to pay to have the sod cut and removed. My yard is about 1300aqft, and the patio area will be about 180sqft. So I just got a quote to do clear the whole thing for $150. I will level the yard myself, and dig out the rest of the patio area myself. Then installing the patio myself as well. Yes the compacter seems like a must.
Also I may hire one of those mexican guys from the corner of 4th South for a day. What the going rate for those guys?

[dk_alaskan]

wtf, TWO things for you, TECH TALK JONG, and for more useful tips and information in regards to your challenge, DYNAMITE THE BITCH jong!!!

[booner]

This is what I do for a living. The Bobcat sounds like overkill to some...that's because they've never dug out a 200 square patio, 8" down, by hand. It will take FOREVER and kill you. Rent a walk behind Bobcat (MT-52/55). Dig down 8" below FINAL grade. This may be the same as existing grade, but sometimes isn't. You are going to have a lot of dirt/sod to get rid of...way more than you think, unless your existing grade is way lower than final grade will be. The walk behinds don't lift very high, so if you are using a truck to take soil out the sides can't be very tall. You'll need a line level, strings, and stakes if you aren't going to use a laser transit. Laser transit will save you a ton of time if you can borrow/rent. Make sure you have plenty of positive pitch...about 2" over 10' is a good ballpark. You will need to rent a power tamper for your base material, and will need a hand tamper since the machine can't get all the way into corners. If you need to tamp around stuff like downspouts an upside-down sledge hammer works perfect. Overdig the area by a foot in each direction and make the patio nominal so you don't have to cut anything. Use plastic edge restraint (from a paver distributor...not Lowes/Wal-mart, etc)and sweep it in with polymeric sand when done. It will be a mess within a year if you skip either of these. I also would not use sand for a small patio. I know this is what "they" say to use, but there is a better/faster way. For small patios I use what is referred to as "screenings" on top of a CR1 base. Basically you set top of crusher run to bottom of paver, tamp the CR, put 1" gas pipes on top of the CR and set pipe to bottom of paver height. Then you screed the screenings(sand) off the pipes with a 2x4, and set the pavers on your screeded surface. PM me if you want more input, I could walk you through the details of the whole thing. It seems like pretty simple work, but if it isn't done just right it will last a fraction of the time before it starts to settle and shift on you.

[Jethro]

you=weak

Living in SLC, I'm guessing there are enough mexicans in the area to do your entire job for the same amount of dough you are planning on spending on tool rental and dirt removal.

Going the Non-PC route, either remove it yourself, or pay a living wage to someone who has the right to be here. Don't be self serving and hire illegal Mexicans just because they'll work cheaper. People who hire them are the reason they migrate here. Don't be part of the problem. In a few years all the ski bum jobs will be filled by illegals, just wait and see.

[Dhelihiker]

i am an excavation expert. 90 cubic feet is not an excavation, its grading.

this is an excavation



The answer depends on the type of material.

Sand- pick and shovel

Soft clay- Digging bar and shovel

stiff clay or rock- Jackhammer (spade tip for clay) and shovel

rent a mexican for $10 an hr and implement one of the methods above.


thats what i would do

[MultiVerse]

I put together a 200sqft patio in my backyard two years ago by doing most of the excavation with a shovel and pick, mostly because a cedar fence that encloses the back yard prevented the use of any machinery.

I did rent a "jumping jack" and a plate vibrator from Home Depot but everything else was done by hand.

As far as where to buy the raw materials, Lehi Block provided the best value in terms of price and quality, and I got quotes from just about all of the suppliers in the area. They also have an outdoor display that you can drive through anytime.

For sand and gravel there's a place on the 1600 block of Beck Street that sells by weight if you have access to a pickup truck or trailer and they are open on Saturdays, unlike most industrial suppliers. I can't remember the name but here's a satellite photo of the location.

Attachment 77224

[RB]

^^ That's the Staker-Parson lot.
I got my sand from them when we did our pavers.

http://www.stakerparsonlandscape.com/

[DougW]

Echo the comments of do it by hand. No big deal a little girl could do that. Its only 3.3 yards. Had to do same ish thing but it was a slope so a lot more. Rented 12 yard dumpester and filled to brim in one weekend. That was clay from backyard up 10 foot vert to front yard about 60 feet. My wife helped for a bit and did about a yard herself though only wheelbarrowing.

[telepariah]

Echo the comments of do it by hand. No big deal a little girl could do that. Its only 3.3 yards. Had to do same ish thing but it was a slope so a lot more. Rented 12 yard dumpester and filled to brim in one weekend. That was clay from backyard up 10 foot vert to front yard about 60 feet. My wife helped for a bit and did about a yard herself though only wheelbarrowing.

Ditto. My loser neighbor who hardly ever leaves his house dug out a 20 x 20 18 inches deep garden in clay and rocks with help from his 12 year old daughter in a weekend. If he can do it, anyone can do it.

It was funneh watching him let the little girl do most of the work.