Plake Couloir Eccles article on powder.com WTF?

[Mulletizer]

Interesting article on Powder about Plake, Yo Hachemi, Remy Lecluse and Nate Wallace skiing one of Mt Blanc's biggest lines.

http://www.powdermag.com/features/ne...x-trip-report/

Huge hat tip for the skiing which is impressive and way beyond anything I would contemplate. But some of the stuff they did has me thinking WTF?

I can understand calling in a heli for an injured team member (although the way in which the injury occurred is questionable - I wasn't there so can't be sure of the circumstances). However, recognising that the Col du Peuterey is in shit, very dangerous condition, but electing to ski it then call in a heli to pull them out seems weak to me.

Sure, hindsight is a great thing. But what these guys did just seems knowingly dumb, likely to risk potential rescuers - and then publicising it without much recognition of those facts sets a pretty poor example to the legions of young who revere Plake (myself included, to an extent).

To give Nate Wallace credit, he does ask some questions:

Not the best way to finish. But how far do you need to take it? Does our descent count? Did we chicken out? Will those who write guidebooks and magazine articles give us credit as the fourth descent, and the first by an American?

Glen's expression and raised hand answers those questions. It says, "oh well", and most importantly, "who cares". We just skied one of the most unbelievable lines in the world, and are alive.

That said, the tone with which the article ends seems to be a Gallic-style shrug. Anyone who knows the area better - or was part of the crew to ski this line - care to comment?

[greg]

i wasn't there, but i still care to comment. i was having the same thoughts you are expressing. if you get heli rescued two times on a single descent, i certainly wouldn't call it successful and definitely not be proud and happy about it. especially since both times really poor decision making seemed to be the cause for the rescues. skiing these kind of lines with the intention to just try them out, and if it doesn't work out you call the heli cab to fly you out, is the wrong approach and certainly not what the rescue teams are for. they should at least have given them a night over when they called in the second time.

edit: at least i suppose i agree with you since i can't figure out that gallic style idiom.

[Scottish_Skier]

Gnarly TR doods

Very easy to sound like an armchair expert... Though personally I would be mortified if I ever have to be rescued by heli. Especially if it had to come back a 2nd time

Remi Lecuse is clearly a Chamonix legend and UIAGM guide - so will be well known locally... Reading between the lines I would be very suprised if he wasn't best buddies with the heli-pilot ?

One of my mates (and fellow mag) embarissingly had to be rescued off the Bosson glacier at nightfall in 2008. Mountain rescue team were apparently super chilled however - and took the line they would be have been flying or training anyway. Not behaviour to be condoned - but obviously PHGM would rather pick up living people ?

Next important question - was Plake on 207cm DH k2 extremes ?

[greg]

One of my mates (and fellow mag) embarissingly had to be rescued off the Bosson glacier at nightfall in 2008.

sooo - who is it?

Remi Lecuse is clearly a Chamonix legend and UIAGM guide - so will be well known locally... Reading between the lines I would be very suprised if he wasn't best buddies with the heli-pilot ?

maybe. but it's still retarded. heli assisted mountaineering has always been scorned on and is officially forbidden since the early eighties i believe. the timing in most of these long lines is the mayor issue. and planing to ski into a possible trap just because you know you have the privilege of being "rescued" and have your insurance pay for it, is a bit lame.

but you might be correct in your assumption. and i guess from now on, whenever i'm in the area, and seem to be running late, i'm just going to give lecuse a call, asking him, if he could get me a heli to pick me up sometime later since i really wouldn't feel like turning around and maybe wait till next season.

[Huck_Schmuck]

Epic line. What were the pictures taken on? A camera phone?

Being held up for the first heli evac put too much time on the day so calling in the second heli probably was the only real option. I'd suggest that in their heads the day out had been bummed already so why not just get out of there safely, last thing they needed was to lose another member of the team.

I didn't like the tone of the article, fwiw.

Here you see Glen skiing by one of Yo's skis. After down climbing Yo then preceded to air the bergschrund on one ski. Crash flip head over head, and self arrest just before a open crevasse.

It's not like fucking up this move just meant a shitty walk out back to the ski domain. Not cool. OK, so I doubt it was as simple as that and Nate Walace was probably just making it sound 'cool', but this was a serious route and the decision actually was bad and a heli was 'needed'.

I've skied with Remy once, nice guy, level headed. Prefers first decents.

[jmf]

I dunno - sure, these are shitty mountaineering techniques, but if I had ready access to private helivac, there's all sorts of stuff I'd try that I wouldn't otherwise. Calling out the pros to bail you out something you know you shouldn't be on is reckless and stupid, but calling your buddy with the helicopter to come get you? If you got it like that, knock yourself out.

[greg]

well this is how i got the story, when i first read it: when they had to call in rescue for the first time it was clear that they ran out of time and were not going to make. but they wouldn't all fit in the heli, so it had to come back a second time anyways. i suppose their guide lecuse was able to convince the rescue team to pick them up a bit further down in order to be able to claim a fourth descent (whatever that is) - something the rescue team certainly would not have agreed to, knowing there is a dead end ahead, if it wasn't for their "pote" and well known guide lecuse.

of course i'm completely hypothesizing but that is what i "read between the lines."

Calling out the pros to bail you out something you know you shouldn't be on is reckless and stupid, but calling your buddy with the helicopter to come get you? If you got it like that, knock yourself out.

well the pghm, peloton de gendarmerie de haute montagne, is not actually private, it's part of the national police. and leaving aside the whole fraud issue and socializing of rescue costs for private joy - they, of course, are needed for rescues and not to fly people around. but apart from that, the very strict heli rules in chamonix are very reasonable. even nowadays the air is buzzing almost 24/7 although touchdowns are not allowed, except for rescue reasons. less restrictive enforcement and hell would break loose. in my opinion they should handle heliflying even more restrictive than they do nowadays. at least in hotspots like chamonix.

[Arno]

well the pghm, peloton de gendarmerie de haute montagne, is not actually private, it's part of the national police. and leaving aside the whole fraud issue and socializing of rescue costs for private joy - they, of course, are needed for rescues and not to fly people around. but apart from that, the very strict heli rules in chamonix are very reasonable. even nowadays the air is buzzing almost 24/7 although touchdowns are not allowed, except for rescue reasons. less restrictive enforcement and hell would break loose. in my opinion they should handle heliflying even more restrictive than they do nowadays. at least in hotspots like chamonix.

***pedant alert***

wasn't this on the Italian side and therefore the Italian rescue services

[greg]

yeah you are right. but even if the italians are private businesses (to be honest, i have no clue) it doesn't change my argument of socializing the cost (via insurance).

i really wish we would hear from somebody who's in the know. but having ranted so much, i doubt that is going to happen..

[Arno]

yeah you are right. but even if the italians are private businesses (to be honest, i have no clue) it doesn't change my argument of socializing the cost (via insurance).

i really wish we would hear from somebody who's in the know. but having ranted so much, i doubt that is going to happen..

i don't disagree with the substance of your point - i was just picking you up on a detail

my feeling is that lines like that aren't just about skiing the line - they are a test of mountain craft. they failed the latter so I think, if this line is remembered much at all, it will always be remembered for being the first American descent with helico exit. if an american gets round to doing it and exits on their own this will be seen as more of an acheivement

[powdherb]

It's the type of high-profile retardedness giving Americans a bad name time and again. Why didn't they make mental calculations of the time required to evac and evac the first time when they know they were late? Who calls a heli...twice??? Who airs a bergshrund on one ski? Imagine if it wasn't Chamonix/Courmayeur and they were doing this shit. Imagine in the Andes or Himalaya. Does a close proximity to rescue provide an excuse for checking all precautions and common sense at the door? Poor descisions and even poorer style and a huge C02 footprint. Are there no ethics?

As for first American descent. Who gives a shit? What next? First gay descent? First chicano-orthodox Jew descent?

[greg]

well they had a french guide and local with them. i'd rather give him the responsibility then plake and wallace. arete de peuterey is really hard to check out up front in order to ski it from the top. i'd be surprised if it wasn't lecluse who was the main decision taker. he should know how to get the infos, when rock fall starts, which basin heats up, and which seracs are crumbling.

as i said before, i could imagine that the group of four didn't fit into the heli together with the crew. (but it's a wild guess) and maybe therefore decided to give it a try against all odds, because rescue wise it might not have made such a big difference since the heli had to come back anyway. (of course that is just a wild guess too)

what i don't really get is, that apart from the guy loosing his ski, their time frame seemed to be a bit optimistic anyway. skiing a complex long line like that from the top, you'd expect encountering difficulties. route finding difficulties because of icy segments you found out about a bit late, down climbing, rappelling... so i kind of wonder if they weren't a bit late at the summit of mont blanc and when they dropped in to start with. dropping in knowing there is a high chance you might need helivac would be the real irresponsibility.

but what the hell do i know, i have a feeling i'm taking the second guessing a bit too far.

edit: i kind of wonder if and with how much detail lecluse is going to put this decent on his site.

[Lani]

Nice rant, 'herb.

God damn I want to spend a month or two of a fatty season in Cham.

[neck beard]

It wouldn't have taken much extra gear to have been prepared to spend and uncomfortable but totally survivable night out there.

Arno said it - they failed the test of mountain craft.

[splat]

Maybe we should ask jumpturn about this.
He got plucked off a ledge after failing to locate a rap anchor in the fog.
Ended up skiing with the chopper crew the next day.
Ah, the luxury of carte neige.
Glen/Nate, jump in on this.
Ciao.

[verbier61]

interesting story. This has been a uber-galore spring on the pennine alps, soooo many lines that have not been skiable for years or decades became finally skiable (see for instance the de benedetti's mont blanc and the N of the m blanc de cheilon, that this june have been skied at least twice after a wait of almost 30 years....). Such a rush can lead a strong crew to mistake(s) like this one.
BTW The italian heli rescue is free for anyone with an alpin club card (CAI in Italy, CAF in france, SAC/CAS in switz, etc) and a serius issue on the mountain. I can only imagine how much they laughed when they got the second call, but apparently it was not a risky spot for them so I also believe they were not pissed to go to pick the gallo/yanks...


and yes, cosmiques it's because they study cosmic rays there, not for the cosmic landscape..... ;-)

[supercastor]

What pisses me most in this story is not the way things should or should not have been done, but the fact that Powder published it as it is (low def pics, subtitle and all). This is the kind of thing that happens in the mountains - and particularly around Cham, people fail and call helis. But publishing the story as if it was like the fourth successful descent of this line is not fair in my view. It would have made a wonderful gonzo journalism piece (and Wallace paradoxically aknowledges that early in his otherwise quite dull account), with some good humor poured in and making fun of a potentially tragic experience, but the way it is, it just pisses people of (+gives a very bad example).
"First Americans to Ever Descend the Couloir Eccles and Arete Peuterey " would have made an heated/hatred blog post on skitour or other ski mountaineering forum though.
I hate it when a good story is lost for an internet quickie.

[Cosmic Suncloud]

2@$
was climbed/skeid 9 days earleir sans snowmo by these dudes

http://www.skitour.fr/sorties/mont-b...eur,21922.html

[greg]

2@$
was climbed/skeid 9 days earleir sans snowmo by these dudes

you mean this? http://www.skitour.fr/sorties/mont-b...22.html#sortie

not sure i understand what you are trying to say. 2@$? sans snowmo? thanks for the heads up on the report, though.

[Roo]

2@$
was climbed/skeid 9 days earleir sans snowmo by these dudes

http://www.skitour.fr/sorties/mont-b...eur,21922.html

L'Equipe <<Erreur 404>> sont le .

[Cosmic Suncloud]

L'Equipe <<Erreur 404>> sont le .

blimy...http://www.skitour.fr/sorties/mont-b...eur,21922.html


http://www.skitour.fr/sorties/mont-b...eur,21922.html

[alto]

Made too late by the rescue and Glen taking a huge shit on the summit of Mt. Blanc.

[alto]

It's the type of high-profile retardedness giving Americans a bad name time and again. Why didn't they make mental calculations of the time required to evac and evac the first time when they know they were late? Who calls a heli...twice??? Who airs a bergshrund on one ski? Imagine if it wasn't Chamonix/Courmayeur and they were doing this shit. Imagine in the Andes or Himalaya. Does a close proximity to rescue provide an excuse for checking all precautions and common sense at the door? Poor descisions and even poorer style and a huge C02 footprint. Are there no ethics?

As for first American descent. Who gives a shit? What next? First gay descent? First chicano-orthodox Jew descent?

I call bullshit on your unwarranted rant. Just think about it. You realize for this crew their whole lives are constructed around skiing, right? And they're all well-respected players in the most gnarly mountain sports scene to ever have existed. This year gave the Alps a 30-year winter, and maybe once in a lifetime shot at that line, which drops off of the steep side of the biggest mountain in Europe. This was the time to go for the line, and anyone who is formulating opinions of the events without direct information from the skiers themselves as to what circumstances led them to make their decisions is just blowing useless hot steam. As far as claiming the "first American descent," it may seem corny, but its the Alps! There is virtually no unturned stone. To leave a mark, you might have to look a little farther into the history books.

In summary - that line is the shit, I'm sure they're not proud of how it ended, but they successfully skied it and got out, all safe. Its not the Himalaya. Its Mont Blanc, and proximity to a heli plays a part of decision making, like it or not. Glen = more rad than all.

[H-wood]

Seconding the bullshit call.
A super badass Chamonix local shares his experience skiing a legendary line with legendary skiers… and gets a bunch of self-righteous squawking in return? Jesus.
Not one person that's bitching here is qualified to Monday-morning quarterback for these guys.

This wasn't Expedition Peuterey '09, it was some local skiers giving it a go because they were jonesing for something to ski in June. Since this wasn't done for sponsors (where's the hype that people are bitching about?), it's really cool that Wallace let Powder share his thoughts on their website--it could be another 20 years before that line gets skied again. But why bother when the result is a bunch of pissy demands that he explain himself to the peanut gallery?

[Lone Star]

i liked the article and its format. very TGR-TResque. perhaps some of the decision making could be questioned but the article doesn't really provide enough details to pass judgment either way. once again we have a difference of opinion between the armchair quarterbacks and extremo freeskier dudes. and the truth probably lies somewhere in the middle.