the answer to "WTF is wrong with my boots?"

[joeshek]

Wife had Ankle surgery this fall and has a nice 4" plate at the bottom of her fibula, just above her ankle. Rehab/recovery is going well, and it's looking plausible that she'll be able to get skiing yet this spring.

Of course we tried on our boots in the living room over the weekend, and can feel discomfort from the liner pushing on the plate. Of course. For what it's worth, these are Technica Cochise 105W's (MV)

Choices seem to be
1) Buy a set of intuitions, add some padding over the plate and heat mold them to make a "pocket".
2) Buy pair of full tilts/other 3 piece shell, hopefully with a stock intuition liner. In the back of my head, this also seems to be the way to go because she already struggles to get her foot in and out on a cold day. At the same time, she has no recollection of this.
3) this is way more complicated than I think and I need to just send her to to Larry's (bootfitting)


Recs?

[gregL]

Wife had Ankle surgery this fall and has a nice 4" plate at the bottom of her fibula, just above her ankle.

I have the same, only longer. 8 screws still in place as well.

A good Intuition heat mold with foam strip over the hardware worked pretty well for me (I could still feel it at times). I don't think you'll get enough space re-heating the stock Tecnica liner, but it may be punchable.

If easy "on-off" is a priority, why not get a Full Tilt/Dalbello/Roxa 3-piece? (Bear in mind most of the stock "Intuition" liners do not have the same moldability as an aftermarket Intuition, as not all the foam is closed cell EVA)

[joeshek]

I have the same, only longer. 8 screws still in place as well.

A good Intuition heat mold with foam strip over the hardware worked pretty well for me (I could still feel it at times). I don't think you'll get enough space re-heating the stock Tecnica liner, but it may be punchable.

If easy "on-off" is a priority, why not get a Full Tilt/Dalbello/Roxa 3-piece? (Bear in mind most of the stock "Intuition" liners do not have the same moldability as an aftermarket Intuition, as not all the foam is closed cell EVA)

Awesome, thanks. Think we'll pick up a pair of Intuitions and give that a go first. Thinking luxury liners?

Any advice on how thick to cut the foam over the hardware?

[gregL]

Any advice on how thick to cut the foam over the hardware?

I used 1/8" self adhesive foam and beveled the edges.

[skithewest]

Boot boards in my Cochise cracked down the center of the heel this weekend.

Seperately, I've been getting pretty intense pain along the 5th metatarsal from the toe through the ankle. In my right boot it's been so bad I've had to stop skiing.

Swapped the cracked boards with some old soft full tilt boards. They don't exactly fit, but they do have a decent heel rise and at least in the living room seem to take pressure off the metatarsal.

Is skiing this the worst idea? I have footbeds, but didn't have a great experience getting fitted when they were made.


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[Mustonen]

You can grind off way more than that, the S/Max bootboard is a thick mofo. If necessary I've cut the heel and toe apart and double stick-taped them back in place (or hot glue) so they don't slide. In severe cases I've been known to remove the front part of the bootboard completely, though it messes with the ramp (if you need this, you're happy just to not have your instep crushed and can deal with the ramp issue).

You can also cut out the elastic and vinyl on the top of the liner, grind footbed thinner, etc.

Skied them yesterday, and felt pretty good. It was sunny and 28, so probably not the truest test.... but no issues when it cooled off. Had a bit of a pain point over my medial malleolus (I can use google) when I cranked them down, thoughts on how to resolve that at home?

Otherwise, the S/Max ski so much better (for me) than the Hawx it’s really no comparison. Hard snow and high edge angles? Check. Refrozen horrible crud? No problem. Now that I’ve installed some heaters (got a deal on Hotronics) I anticipate no meaningful boot issues for the next few years. I wish the lugs were just a little bit rubberized or textured, would make walking and taking skis off easier, but I’ll buy myself some cat tracks if that seriously becomes an issue when I’m navigating the parking lot with my Texas suitcase.

Let it be said and recognized, me not taking gregL’s advice cost me $$$. Still glad I did it, just so I know, but not the cheapest lesson. I’ll probably be throwing the Hawx on gear swap soon to recoup some expense.

[gregL]

Skied them yesterday, and felt pretty good. It was sunny and 28, so probably not the truest test.... but no issues when it cooled off. Had a bit of a pain point over my medial malleolus (I can use google) when I cranked them down, thoughts on how to resolve that at home?

If it's a "bit" of an issue, I'd take the liner out, put your foot in, hold my finger over the pain point, and mark the spot with a Sharpie by poking the liner until I feel the fingernail.

Then put the liner over something hard and rounded, and pound on it with a mallet. If you need more than a "bit" of space, you probably need a lever punch.

[gregL]

Boot boards in my Cochise cracked down the center of the heel this weekend.

Seperately, I've been getting pretty intense pain along the 5th metatarsal from the toe through the ankle. In my right boot it's been so bad I've had to stop skiing.

Swapped the cracked boards with some old soft full tilt boards. They don't exactly fit, but they do have a decent heel rise and at least in the living room seem to take pressure off the metatarsal.

Is skiing this the worst idea? I have footbeds, but didn't have a great experience getting fitted when they were made.

If they didn't hurt before the bootboard cracked, order a new bootboard from Tecnica. Bootboards are molded in unique shapes to fit shells, you want the connection to be solid.
If they hurt before, are you sure the shell is wide enough?

[skithewest]

If they didn't hurt before the bootboard cracked, order a new bootboard from Tecnica. Bootboards are molded in unique shapes to fit shells, you want the connection to be solid.
If they hurt before, are you sure the shell is wide enough?

Overall length/width of the board aren't an issue, but yea the dimples in the shell don't align with the weirdness from the ft board. Was thinking about dremeling out some spots to help keep it in place.

It did hurt before I noticed it was cracked, but the shell is definitely wide enough, my feet are pretty narrow and that boot is pretty generous.

It's because my feet are so narrow that I think the pain is more from lack of footbed support in the arch and medial midfoot. the metatarsal pain seems like it could be lateral column stuff, especially since it's more under the foot than on the side.


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[gregL]

It's because my feet are so narrow that I think the pain is more from lack of footbed support in the arch and medial midfoot. the metatarsal pain seems like it could be lateral column stuff, especially since it's more under the foot than on the side.

Sounds feasible. What sort of "not great" experience did you have when getting your current footbeds made?

[rod9301]

Awesome, thanks. Think we'll pick up a pair of Intuitions and give that a go first. Thinking luxury liners?

Any advice on how thick to cut the foam over the hardware?

If you want it to be easy to get on and off, power wraps are much better.

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[gregL]

If you want it to be easy to get on and off, power wraps are much better.

Powerwraps in an overlap boot isn't the best combination - the liner and boot cuff at at odds with each other, the liner often gets pinched and wrinkles during molding, etc. I would just get a 3-piece boot that comes with an Intuition . . .

[AZskibum]

After a season of seeing a fitter and trying to get my foot into the xt3 140 LV, I have broken down and ordered the Atomic 130 ultra xtd. I tried that one on ages ago and it felt fine, but for whatever reason I went with the lange.

After two different custom insoles, multiple punches and grinds, I just could not get away from the numbness in my foot, pressure on top of my toes, tips of my toes, pinky toe getting pushed under, and arch pain in my xt3s. I'm hoping that the Ultra is a bit roomier like I remember it being. I wanted to buy from a shop but my local ones are out of my size/don't carry anything like it.

They do have a Cochise 130 and Techica zero pro i'm considering just to get something on my foot for May and June that works

I really liked the control of the xt3, but man, it was a mind over matter feeling trying to do more than two runs, or even walking from the parking lot.

[macon]

Where can I buy a boot punch device? I already have a heat gun and I don't see a boot punch on tognar.

[iriponsnow]

Where can I buy a boot punch device? I already have a heat gun and I don't see a boot punch on tognar.

https://patriotfootbeds.com/products...-punching-tool

Go get em tiger.

[mntlion]

Where can I buy a boot punch device? I already have a heat gun and I don't see a boot punch on tognar.

http://blademaster.com/web/usa/en/bl...21-sc6000.html

[hardboiled]

hey guys. I've been skiing a pair of Lange XT3 130s (100mm last) this season, put 20ish days on them in bounds, and another 5 days touring. bought with custom footbeds and using the stock liners, heat molded in the shop where I bought them. for about the second half of my season I've been dealing with pain on the lower shin of my right leg, just above the ankle (on one leg only). I think it's the "corner" where the lower shell turns up and overlaps with the bottom of the cuff, where there seems to be a rivet covered by rubber. first time I went back to the bootfitter, we added heel cups as I thought maybe my foot was moving a bit inside the shell, but that hasn't fixed the issue. at first I could pretty much tough it out and thought it might resolve as the boots/liner broke in, but as the season has gone on it's gotten worse and right now after 3 days in a row of touring my leg is quite swollen in the spot where it's irritated, and it feels like this issue is not going away. feels like there's fluid, maybe a cyst. anyone else deal with this and have suggestions? I'm going back to my bootfitter but interested in how the knowledgeable folks in this thread would troubleshoot this issue.

[DarthMarkus]

hey guys. I've been skiing a pair of Lange XT3 130s (100mm last) this season, put 20ish days on them in bounds, and another 5 days touring. bought with custom footbeds and using the stock liners, heat molded in the shop where I bought them. for about the second half of my season I've been dealing with pain on the lower shin of my right leg, just above the ankle (on one leg only). I think it's the "corner" where the lower shell turns up and overlaps with the bottom of the cuff, where there seems to be a rivet covered by rubber. first time I went back to the bootfitter, we added heel cups as I thought maybe my foot was moving a bit inside the shell, but that hasn't fixed the issue. at first I could pretty much tough it out and thought it might resolve as the boots/liner broke in, but as the season has gone on it's gotten worse and right now after 3 days in a row of touring my leg is quite swollen in the spot where it's irritated, and it feels like this issue is not going away. feels like there's fluid, maybe a cyst. anyone else deal with this and have suggestions? I'm going back to my bootfitter but interested in how the knowledgeable folks in this thread would troubleshoot this issue.

Sounds like a volume issue. Isolated pressure on your shin can mean that when you go to power your boots the lower shin takes the brunt because it's the first point of major contact. When you go to power a boot, the pressure HAS to go somewhere, right? Ideally a good amount of that pressure should disperse down the length of your shin and a snug fit around your tibia and fibula should keep rotation of the leg to a minimum.

Improper volume can also manifest into pressure in the heel cup or medial malleolus. I can't make the volume of langes work for myself either unless I were to drop down a size, and even if I did, I'd then have to deal with the length of the boot being short.

Having also skied the xt3 this season, I can say that I really REALLY wanted the boot to work, because outside of it's relative fit to my foot, the boot is awesome. Unfortunately, I just don't have the correct volume through the cuff.

I think you would have better luck in the cochise or the hawx ultra XTD. Not talking shit in lange either, I just think your issues stem from a lower volume ankle/lower leg that's harder to address with lange. If you really wanna try to make the langes work, I had improvements in mine when I put an intuition in. You may have some luck with a slight varus wedge to the inside of your heel as well - it may help if your tibia is rotating to the medial side.

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[skithewest]

Towards the end of a long hot day my right boot starts to try and fart a little. Seal around the cuff is great and the air can't get out.

It starts under my foot and I'm sure something is probably off with the footbed, but I can figure out what/where. Boot fitter spent tons of times with me already but we're still working on this last piece.

Any ideas on ways to find the spot that needs posting?


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[AZskibum]

After a season of seeing a fitter and trying to get my foot into the xt3 140 LV, I have broken down and ordered the Atomic 130 ultra xtd. I tried that one on ages ago and it felt fine, but for whatever reason I went with the lange.

After two different custom insoles, multiple punches and grinds, I just could not get away from the numbness in my foot, pressure on top of my toes, tips of my toes, pinky toe getting pushed under, and arch pain in my xt3s. I'm hoping that the Ultra is a bit roomier like I remember it being. I wanted to buy from a shop but my local ones are out of my size/don't carry anything like it.

They do have a Cochise 130 and Techica zero pro i'm considering just to get something on my foot for May and June that works

I really liked the control of the xt3, but man, it was a mind over matter feeling trying to do more than two runs, or even walking from the parking lot.

Tried the XTD ultras... feels better but still a lot of pressure on the right pinky toe, top of the big toe and along outside of the foot. The instep height does feel better. Wondering if I should keep trying to make the lang's work, or try to make these work and take them to get heat molded. Local fitter only has Technica Zero G pros and Cochises in 26.5 now. Really wish I didn't live in Arizona.

[slcdawg]

This thread was essential when I was shopping for Alpine boots. Hoping you can help me with a touring boot dilemma.

I am looking for a dedicated touring boot with ~120 flex. Conventional boot fitting wisdom is that its easier to size down and make space as needed. However, I'm having a hard time finding an AT boot that fits right and serves my purpose (touring, not 50/50 boot). Here is my short list of what fit best/closest:

Lange XT3 - Shell fit for 26.5 is perfect. This boot fits the best (like a glove) but is a 50/50 boot, its heavy with poor range of motion. And I think I'll sweat a ton in that liner. This is not a good fit for what I want to use it for (3-5 laps, 2-3000k vert, no resort/sidecountry).
Scarpa Maestrale RS - Shell fit for 26.5 is perfect. But fit is a little roomy, like when a liner is packed out. And I know it will pack out more. Is exactly the type of boot for my purpose.
Dynafit Hoji Pro Tour - Shell fit for 26.5 is snug/performance fit. Fit is close to perfect, fits like a glove. However, instep is not quite high enough. Not a lot the boot fitter can do to expand space (no bootboard, I'm already using all of the ankle rachet). The boot fitter is not confident they can make it work. Tried on a 27.5 and the instep issue went away but felt a little roomy, similar to the Scarpa is the 26.5.

My question, is (while its not ideal) can I make the Maestrale or larger Hoji work with shims, padding, etc? Or am I stuck with a boot that fits great but not great for my purpose? Any other boots I should try?

For reference my resort boot is a Salomon S Max Pro in 26.5. Had to do a fair amount of work to get the instep to work (6-7 visits to bootfitter) and now its perfect. My old AT boots are Scarpa Maestrale 27.5, I sized up on bad advice. They are great at ascending and I can go all day in these, but I really have to crank them down to descend to the point where my legs get really tired. I have good local shop with good bootfitters.

Appreciate any input. Cheers!

[mntlion]

if the salomon fits well for alpine, have you tried the salomon walking/rando boot?

[gregL]

For reference my resort boot is a Salomon S Max Pro in 26.5. Had to do a fair amount of work to get the instep to work (6-7 visits to bootfitter) and now its perfect.

It is either an S/Max or an S/Pro, not both. They are different lasts, and the S/Pro fit is pretty much duplicated in the Shift Pro but IMO it's too heavy and the walk mode isn't good enough to be a pure touring boot. Same with the XT3, though I own and ski a lot in it.

Have you tried the Tecnica Zero G Tour Scout?

The boot doesn't have to fit the way it comes out of the box for very long. Concentrate on nailing the midfoot/ankle/heel fit and assume your bootfitter can fix the rest (hopefully, I don't know your bootfitter).

[gregL]

. . . I've been dealing with pain on the lower shin of my right leg, just above the ankle (on one leg only). I think it's the "corner" where the lower shell turns up and overlaps with the bottom of the cuff, where there seems to be a rivet covered by rubber.

This is on the shin itself and not the malleolus (ankle bone)? I would ask you to show up in person so I could look at your leg and the boot/liner . . . doesn't sound like something I can fix over the Internet.

[slcdawg]

It is either an S/Max or an S/Pro, not both.

Doh! Its the S/Max.

Same with the XT3, though I own and ski a lot in it.

How do you like touring in it? My shop told me Lange is coming out with some more tour friendly boots in 2022 but they have either a narrow last or low flex (110).

Have you tried the Tecnica Zero G Tour Scout?

Yes, and I can't remember why it wasn't a good fit. Might have been the price.

The boot doesn't have to fit the way it comes out of the box for very long. Concentrate on nailing the midfoot/ankle/heel fit and assume your bootfitter can fix the rest (hopefully, I don't know your bootfitter).

This is really the crux of my question. I'd love to go with the Maestrale or the bigger Hoji if the bootfitter can make the fit a little better. Is this possible with a boot that has a good shell fit but doesn't quite have the heel hold/ankle hold? Or, a losing battle?

Alternatively, the Hoji 26.5 fits like a glove, but I would need to expand the instep. My bootfitter is saying that will be difficult, they would need to expand the plastic and move the ankle ratchet by drilling a hole and adding a rivet. I was originally going down this route but not feeling confident we can make it work.